A New Face to Traditionalism?

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Far as I can tell, this statement COULD be read as “Modernist” or lacking in faith, but rereading it gives you what they mean…

“MonkRock provides a way of life for those who choose to stay in the modern world and work to pull it forward - a way to change the world from within and even be changed in the process.”

As long as one works to change the world they are in… and bring it from the **** it is today to something richer (and more Catholic:thumbsup: ), then it’s alright.
 
bear06 said:
They want to bring Traditionalism to the modern world - no doubt to their generation… And? Isn’t that what you want to do? It’s getting quite ridiculous that people can’t use the word “modern” without someone accusing someone else of modernism.
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I don’t see it that way at all. Just look at the website with open eyes. “Monkrock” why is that needed? Why do they feel the need to put a “new face” on tradition? That is the basis of modernism…always changing, always being updated, always being re-interpreted, always having to appeal to* modern* man. Well, the truth doesn’t change. It doesn’t need to be packaged in modern wrapping. Our faith should not be brought down to the level of MAN. All of the modernisms they use, monk rock is a play on words (punk rock), “urban solution”, “buzz”, the catchy “lo-fi living”. Come on now, this is not tradition. This is a ridiculous modern, marketing idea to appeal to the young. It doesn’t work. What works is the reverence, beauty, solemnity, and holiness of the true traditional Church.

Here is a much nicer site, in keeping with tradition:
ourladyoflourdescatholicgifts.com/index.html
 
bear06 said:
And the modernist cake is what? Naming coffee after a saint? Please. I suppose you freak out when a winery is named after a saint or how about a city? Look at your foot! There’s a hole in it!:rolleyes:
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I think naming a product like coffee after a saint is disrespectful. Cities are named after saints as an homage to that saint who is chosen to be a patron. Those cities are asking for the protection of the saint. I suppose the same could be said for a winery, seeking the support of a saint. But coffee? Give me a break… that’s just materialism and disrespect packaged as lighthearted humor.
 
labernadette said:
I don’t see it that way at all. Just look at the website with open eyes. “Monkrock” why is that needed? Why do they feel the need to put a “new face” on tradition? That is the basis of modernism…always changing, always being updated, always being re-interpreted, always having to appeal to* modern* man. Well, the truth doesn’t change. It doesn’t need to be packaged in modern wrapping. Our faith should not be brought down to the level of MAN. All of the modernisms they use, monk rock is a play on words (punk rock), “urban solution”, “buzz”, the catchy “lo-fi living”. Come on now, this is not tradition. This is a ridiculous modern, marketing idea to appeal to the young. It doesn’t work. What works is the reverence, beauty, solemnity, and holiness of the true traditional Church.

Here is a much nicer site, in keeping with tradition:
ourladyoflourdescatholicgifts.com/index.html
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They’re not trying to redefine Truth. Using buzz word can hardly be considered a form of modernism and you really have no proof that their marketing technique doesn’t work. Different things will appeal to different people. Just because it doesn’t appeal to you (and to be quite honest, it doesn’t appeal to me either but I doubt I’m the target group) doesn’t mean that it wouldn’t appeal to an 18 year old.

As for the coffee…It would seem silly that we can put a wine under the patronage of a saint but not a coffee. It’s hardly disrespectful to pick your favorite saint and name something you enjoy after it.
 
bear06 said:
As for the coffee…It would seem silly that we can put a wine under the patronage of a saint but not a coffee. It’s hardly disrespectful to pick your favorite saint and name something you enjoy after it.
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I don’t think it’s too difficult to see the difference between naming a winery for a saint, and a kitschy gimmick like naming a product “Padre Pio Americano Espresso Blend”. The latter shows a definite lack of respect and I don’t think it’s humorous which is the obvious objective with this “merchant.”
 
bear06 said:
They’re not trying to redefine Truth. Using buzz word can hardly be considered a form of modernism and you really have no proof that their marketing technique doesn’t work. Different things will appeal to different people. Just because it doesn’t appeal to you (and to be quite honest, it doesn’t appeal to me either but I doubt I’m the target group) doesn’t mean that it wouldn’t appeal to an 18 year old.

As for the coffee…It would seem silly that we can put a wine under the patronage of a saint but not a coffee. It’s hardly disrespectful to pick your favorite saint and name something you enjoy after it.
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Well buzz words are certainly not a form of “old -fashionism”. You know, that argument that you need to make our faith “appealing” to the young is outlandish and so modern. Children and young adults alike should be taught the faith the way it has always been taught, not with trend, not with gimmicks, not trying to be “cool”, not 21st century style. There is a time and a place for everything and our Catholic Faith should never be watered down, diminished, or made light of. Again, modernism is a sin.
 
labernadette said:
Well buzz words are certainly not a form of “old -fashionism”. You know, that argument that you need to make our faith “appealing” to the young is outlandish and so modern. Children and young adults alike should be taught the faith the way it has always been taught, not with trend, not with gimmicks, not trying to be “cool”, not 21st century style. There is a time and a place for everything and our Catholic Faith should never be watered down, diminished, or made light of. Again, modernism is a sin.
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This is getting quite silly. Where in Church doctrine does it say that we have to be old-fashioned? Yikes. This would seem to be quite a false notion of tradition. I think that you greatly confuse the heresy of Modernism with the word modern. I drive a modern car. Is it heretical to do so?

These folks are not trying to get people to adapt Catholicism to fit their lives. They’re trying to get people to adapt their lives to fit Catholicism. Modernism attacks dogma. So, you’ll have to provide some proof of which dogmas these guys are trying to attack.

You might want to reread BayernAnhaenger’s post.
 
bear06 said:
This is getting quite silly. Where in Church doctrine does it say that we have to be old-fashioned? Yikes. This would seem to be quite a false notion of tradition. I think that you greatly confuse the heresy of Modernism with the word modern. I drive a modern car. Is it heretical to do so?

These folks are not trying to get people to adapt Catholicism to fit their lives. They’re trying to get people to adapt their lives to fit Catholicism. Modernism attacks dogma. So, you’ll have to provide some proof of which dogmas these guys are trying to attack.

You might want to reread BayernAnhaenger’s post.
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[Edited by Moderator] Bottom line, I don’t like using modern trendy methods to teach the faith. It isn’t needed, it isn’t traditional, and it starts everything out on the wrong foot. Hold fast to tradition. If you embrace modernism in small doses, next thing you know, you’ll be embracing the error of modernism in all areas of your faith.
 
Jacafamala said:
Give me some of that Brother Broom Moka Java Blend. Sounds heavenly. I don’t think St. Martin would mind having a coffee named after him, so long as it’s a fair trade coffee.

Pax Christi,
Ann
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Ha ha! What is next? How about hosts sold as cookies? Oops! that has already been done. Or maybe auctioning off the Holy Eucharist on Ebay? Seems that has been done too. So much for disrespecting that which pertains to our Faith. Maybe we should try to promote RESPECT, rather than blasphemy.
 
labernadette said:
You have just pulled a modernist stunt and “interpreted” what I said to suit yourself. No, what was meant was that if you

claim that using buzz words is not modernism, then what shall it be called? It certainly isn’t old fashioned practice, hence, it is modern.

And you’ve rather just proven my point. Our Church does not point to all modern things and say “Sin!”
So, why don’t you refrain from making confusion reign? Bottom line, I don’t like using modern trendy methods to teach the faith.
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I have to say that it is because of many of the comments here that my friends are confused by my traditionalist views regarding Catholicism. They see traditionalists as “Stogy old-people who reject the now”.
I see myself, however, as a bridge between the “stogy” and the new.

I was a Charismatic, I used ABC, I engaged in pre-marital sex and saw nothing wrong.
Now look at me, I am a rosary-saying, large-family desiring, mantilla-wearing, Latin-learning neo-Trad. It takes groups and sites like this to bring people to the Truth.

What about all those Truth commercials about tobacco? Are they wrong for putting a glossy modern spin on the anti-tobacco campaign?
 
It’s getting quite ridiculous that people can’t use the word “modern” without someone accusing someone else of modernism.
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Only when the “modern” significantly and quite suddenly differs from what’s been handed down is it called modernism, IMO. Don’t forget, if you lived in 1850, you lived in THAT modern era but the Mass (or many other practices) didn’t significantly differ than the ones in 1590, for example.
 
BobP123 said:
Only when the “modern” significantly and quite suddenly differs from what’s been handed down is it called modernism, IMO. Don’t forget, if you lived in 1850, you lived in THAT modern era but the Mass (or many other practices) didn’t significantly differ than the ones in 1590, for example.
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We’re talking about the use of “buzz” words (not in the Mass I might add). This group advocates the TLM, Gregorian Chant, Mantillas, etc. Not one thing on the site indicates the heresy of Modernism.
 
bear06 said:
We’re talking about the use of “buzz” words (not in the Mass I might add). This group advocates the TLM, Gregorian Chant, Mantillas, etc. Not one thing on the site indicates the heresy of Modernism.
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As I stated earlier, it is about respect. Respect for our Faith. And I notice in the statement you made here, that you call modernism a heresy. We don’t need gimmicks, children and young people should learn to separate their Catholic Faith from punk-rock music and trends.
 
labernadette said:
As I stated earlier, it is about respect. Respect for our Faith. And I notice in the statement you made here, that you call modernism a heresy. We don’t need gimmicks, children and young people should learn to separate their Catholic Faith from punk-rock music and trends.
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And what if it is these “punk-rock” and trends that lead young people to the truth of traditionalism, like it did me?
 
…and all this squabbling and bickering is supposed to entice folks to embrace your point of view?! Lotsa luck.
 
PatienceAndLove said:
And what if it is these “punk-rock” and trends that lead young people to the truth of traditionalism, like it did me?
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If I could ask a question…How many more would be led to tradition by observing all of the reverence, solemnity, beauty and respect for God and of tradition and the traditional Mass? Would you of never been led to tradition if not for some trendy gimmick? There must of been something there that summoned you, and was it by the grace of that gimmick or by the grace of God and of your Faith?
 
labernadette said:
If I could ask a question…How many more would be led to tradition by observing all of the reverence, solemnity, beauty and respect for God and of tradition and the traditional Mass? Would you of never been led to tradition if not for some trendy gimmick? There must of been something there that summoned you, and was it by the grace of that gimmick or by the grace of God and of your Faith?
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If you could get them in to observe that reverence, lots. But you have to get them in.
Honestly, I probably never would have found the beauty of tradition if it weren’t for sites like monkrock.com that told me about traditionalism. I would probably still have my screwed up ways of thinking. And yes, it was the grace of the gimmick, given to me by the grace of God.
 
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