A patron saint for single guys

[Sarcelle]

At least the Church honors celibacy.

In the Protestant Evangelical world, celibacy, even for the sake of the Kingdom. is often treated with suspicion.

There is also this idea that celibacy causes people to have pedophilia.

 

[adgloriam]

So the fact that marriage is an image of the holy trinity does not confer on it any spiritual excellence.

You are saying marriage has no spiritual excellence?

it is all nature that is a reflection of God

nature doesn’t get married, it was man who was made in God’s image.

This does not confer on the vineyard, a dignity of Heaven.

Man is part deiforme and endowed with dignity, so too marriage has been elevated to the dignity of sacrament.

the Church has chosen to overestimate marriage and couple life in general

The Church doesn’t overestimate marriage. But it’s good to know you underestimate the church and underestimate marriage.

Please, @Mboo feel free not to debate marriage with me. I’d honestly rather you didn’t. [Although I honestly appreciate your efforts and good will, and thank you for it.]

 

[adgloriam]

by making believe that natural happiness can be ordered to spiritual happiness.

Joy is a fruit of the Holy Spirit, and life is a gift of God.

For a Christian to be unhappy because one is not married is a sign of imperfection because one manifests:

Should you come across a person at life’s cross roads who’s wounded and sad please refrain from judging them in accordance with your own mindset and somewhat distorted view of human relations. Because marriage and conjugal love can be, and are, a beautiful life giving thing.

 

[adgloriam]

We Dominicans founded colleges and universities

Please listen @Cloisters, I really appreciate your personal work and catholic activities -in that invariably your posts bring me joy- and I appreciate the Dominican legacy.

However, academia (which is not exclusively Dominican or catholic) needs a hefty critic at times. Due to the place in society it occupies and the frequent pernicious effects academia has on the average person.

The goals of the Communist Party included

included infiltrating everything…And I do thoroughly enjoy Joseph Ratzinger’s thoughts reflecting this in his personal experience. But today, pernicious forces permeating academia are foremost secular (or if they are something else, mask themselves as secular).

 

[Chicken_Pigeon]

For a Christian to be unhappy because one is not married is a sign of imperfection because one manifests:

• a weak Faith (we do not believe that true happiness is not of this world as Jesus taught us),
• a weak hope (we desire earthly happiness instead of wanting Heaven)
• a weak charity (we care more about our earthly happiness than the glory of God)

Uh…it’s human to want a spouse. This is ridiculous. If it weren’t natural for us to feel lonely or unhappy that we are still single no one would get married

Wow

BokbokBAWK!!!

 

[Chicken_Pigeon]

You can choose and suffer celibacy simultaneously

Saints weren’t perfect

BokbokBAWK!!!

 

[adgloriam]

Thank you @mrsdizzyd I really appreciate the post and it gave me a lot to think about. You know your hagiology…!!

Ok, so if I can have one more minute of your attention I’ll try to explain better my objections.

If you look at the ‘academic wing’ of saints and blessed, you’ll find -more so the further back we go- that their genius was groomed and fostered from an early age. Their stint at university, their entire path, being all but natural. Take st.Aquinas son of count Aquinas, take bl Pier.Giorgio Frassati born into a wealthy family and surrounded by ‘like minded’ people, take st.Alphonso of Ligorio again set for a carer in laws and the letters…

So, in ‘the academic wing’ you’ll see what some have called the ‘critique of scholastic reason’ by way of a ‘double truth of the gift’ in that their gifts weren’t all that un-natural, rather it was in a sense the most natural thing for them to become gifted, since they had all the necessary and previous social dispositions.

 

[ineedofmercy]

Exactly
Celibacy effects all who choose (and don’t choose it) differently
Some choose it (and some are stuck with it)and suffer greatly
Others feel no change in emotions
Others accept with great happiness having had no desire for marriage

But I would say in most cases people suffer somewhat to be celibate

 

[ineedofmercy]

Mboo
Just because someone desires marriage and is upset because they are single
Does not mean they choose it over God
It does not mean they do not hope for heaven or pray to Gof about their sadness

That’s like saying someone who is crippled shows weak faith by being sad they cannot walk
They aren’t choosing walking over God but their pain is natural and in some cases brings them closer to God

Marriage is special thing and those who desire it and feel they may never have are not wrong to feel sad
It’s when that sadness and anger take over their lives and they flood themselves with self pity and anger towards God that makes it wrong

 

[adgloriam]

Celibacy effects all who choose (and don’t choose it) differently
Some choose it (and some are stuck with it)and suffer greatly

This formulation is again somewhat tricky since it presupposes a fully rational social agent who’s in complete control of his will and excludes the lion’s share of social influences that may for the most part determine and condition the options he has and takes.

Regarding free choice (as action theory puts it) not all choices are individual and fully rational, most agents will only have partial information and their choice obeys a plethora of factors outside their will - or comprehension.

 

[ServusDei1]

Me when I’m admited to heaven.

 

[Start]

The saints were perfect to a certain degree.

 

[Chicken_Pigeon]

No they weren’t. They were sinners. They died with the grace of God

Bokbok

 

[Start]

I meant Christian perfection which is somewhat different.

 

[Mboo]

That’s like saying someone who is crippled shows weak faith by being sad they cannot walk
They aren’t choosing walking over God but their pain is natural and in some cases brings them closer to God

If this natural sadness is the sign of the sadness of our soul, then it is the manifestation of an imperfect charity. In the perfection, only sin must sadden our soul.

 

[Mboo]

Joy is a fruit of the Holy Spirit, and life is a gift of God.

it is spiritual joy that is a fruit of the Holy Spirit, not natural joy. For example, someone who has passed his exam is in joy, this joy is not a fruit of the Holy Spirit, but a fruit of nature.

 

[Mboo]

Should you come across a person at life’s cross roads who’s wounded and sad please refrain from judging them in accordance with your own mindset and somewhat distorted view of human relations. Because marriage and conjugal love can be, and are, a beautiful life giving thing

It is obvious that it is a beautiful thing, even the pagans know it. But the joy of marriage is not in the order of Christian perfection.
Spiritual Christian joy is the result of faith, not of nature. The joy of marriage stems from nature and not from faith, so it is not meritorious.

 

[poche]

Maybe we could mention St Toribio of Mongrovejo. Although he was a bishop he was a layman when he was nominated for the position.

 

[Mboo]

You can choose and suffer celibacy simultaneously

Saints weren’t perfect

by saying that one suffers from celibacy, I meant that he lives celibacy in spite of himself. When someone freely chooses celibacy, even if he suffers from it, he loves this suffering because it is a desired and chosen suffering.

 

[Mboo]

No they weren’t. They were sinners. They died with the grace of God

Bokbok

there are several levels of perfection. According to Saint Thomas, the lowest level of Christian perfection is to live without mortal sin. And it is possible to live without mortal sin. So, we can live here with at least this level of perfection