A Q about oral sex...sort of

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I’m a catechist, and I had a middle-aged couple come to me with the following query:

The wife is post-menopausal. They are both able to complete the marital act. But the husband has managed to convince his wife that oral stimulation to climax is permissible as long as they insert the semen into the wife afterwards.

I have never had this question before. I found lots of information about artificial insemination, and oral sex, but they do not address this very specific set of behaviors.

(name removed by moderator)ut would be most appreciated.

Char
 
Oh boy. Do you get paid enough to handle that question? 😃

I’d tell them to ask their confessor and then do something to forget I was ever asked.
 
Ummmm…not only was I enormously embarrassed, I actually wondered the same thing. :o

But, I realize that I need to give them something definitive. I was impressed (after my face regained its normal color), that they were willing to put themselves out there, in the name of obedience.
 
As another poster suggested: send them to their confessor.

I am one of those folks who just doesn’t get the fascination with oral sex. It seems totally gross to me.
 
Well, according to them, they asked a priest and he was unclear. I’m not sure how clear I can be, and not even sure how much I should (or want) to go into detail with them in the name of modesty. I was hoping I could just point them to a link…or something? :confused:

Char
 
The only way the semen gets “put in there” is via a penis ejaculating into the vagina.

No turkey basters allowed. 😉
 
I am not sure it’s the same thing unless they know how to properly implant semen (which is doubtful). Also, sperm are not really meant to survive long outside. That alone would seem to invalidate this as in any way being true to the final cause of those little guys and the sexual act.

Anyway, I would have told him to go to the parish priest and tell him I sent them to get an answer to that question. Because that would be hilarious. You must be sitting on a gold mine.
 
Cricket2 said:
As another poster suggested: send them to their confessor.

I am one of those folks who just doesn’t get the fascination with oral sex. It seems totally gross to me.
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That sounds like excellent advice to me, too. Wish more people felt like you, Cricket, about the grossness of that. Unfortunately secular society seems to treat it as they do porn…accepting and often encouraging. Sad, but true.
 
This sort of procedure (which itself just has to be the oddest suggestion I think I’ve ever heard, in this context :eek:) would seem to be equivalent to the notion of some of the reproductive technologies that attempt to make sperm more able to fertilize an egg, and then be artificially inserted into the potential mother.

Catholic moral theologians would respond that these sorts of approaches are not morally licit, since it must be the sexual act itself that deposits the sperm into the woman. (Moreover, the materials of a previous sexual act may not licitly be inserted into a woman in the context of a subsequent act: if the act is meant to be unitive and procreative, then the act and its materials must maintain their integrity.)

This guy is trying real hard to justify a sex act that he wants his wife to perform, rather than attempting to have a marital relationship that is chaste and virtuous… 🤷
 
Refer them to the book called (I think) The Good News on Sex and Marriage. Something like that, anyway. It’s been referred to in many Ask an apologist reply on sex.

PS - it doesn’t matter is she is post menopausal, the same sexual covenants apply to us all, really.
 
I can’t help but wondering what the point of this would be for this couple…hmm…anyway, I really respect them for honestly asking the question, we should all be bold and willing to find out what we’re expected to do (and not to do) by the Church, no matter how uncomfortable it might be. Kudos to them!
 
chartreuse said:
I’m a catechist, and I had a middle-aged couple come to me with the following query:

The wife is post-menopausal. They are both able to complete the marital act. But the husband has managed to convince his wife that oral stimulation to climax is permissible as long as they insert the semen into the wife afterwards.

I have never had this question before. I found lots of information about artificial insemination, and oral sex, but they do not address this very specific set of behaviors.

(name removed by moderator)ut would be most appreciated.

Char
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The simple answer is NO. There are really only three hard and fast rules for Catholics when its comes to sex between married couples, and this violates one of them:

“The husband and wife enter into sex with the intention that the man climaxes inside of the woman.”

The Church isn’t legalistic about sex, and this question really makes this a legalistic game (“i.e., as long as that semen gets in there at some point, somehow, someway, it’s fine”). It’s not legalistic, it’s about the principal of what sex is design for. The point is that the Church teaches us that sex is designed to be unitive and procreative. That means the couples must intend for the man to “finish” inside the woman (for both unitive and procreative purposes). If there is a genuine “oops,” don’t worry about it. But, if the intention the whole time is something else, no go.

Oral sex as foreplay, yes. The “turkey baster” scenario, to get it in there eventually, the church says it’s not procreative (and I would argue demeaning to the woman and violates the unitive aspect as well), so no.
 
2HeartsSlave said:
***I can’t help but wondering what the point of this would be for this couple…***hmm…anyway, I really respect them for honestly asking the question, we should all be bold and willing to find out what we’re expected to do (and not to do) by the Church, no matter how uncomfortable it might be. Kudos to them!
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My take would be that the husband wants oral sex performed on him to orgasm and the wife knows this is not allowed. So, he tells her they can get around the “rules” by inserting the semen into her vagina afterward.

In my opinion, nope, it’s not licit. It would be licit to begin with oral sex and end with regular intercourse, though.
 
Zachary said:
Refer them to the book called (I think) The Good News on Sex and Marriage. Something like that, anyway. It’s been referred to in many Ask an apologist reply on sex.

PS - it doesn’t matter is she is post menopausal, the same sexual covenants apply to us all, really.
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^This.

The morality of a particular sex act does not depend on the state of the couple (other than the fact that they are married). Menopausal, pregnant, vasectomy, tubes tied, etc. all have the same “rules,” regardless of what your “status” is.

As I have posted on other forums, between married couples, there are only three simple, hard and fast rules, which are design to focus on what sex is designed to be (unitive and procreative). Everything else is about the couple loving and respecting and enjoying each other.
 
I was taught in a marriage preparation class given by a priest that while the wife may climax as part of foreplay, the husband ought to intend to climax as part of the marital act. If he accidentally climaxes prematurely during foreplay, however, that is no sin. (God reads hearts, so just be honest.) Oral stimulation is permissible as foreplay, IOW, but is not to be chosen as a substitute for intercourse.
 
“The husband and wife enter into sex with the intention that the man climaxes inside of the woman.”

Hee hee…the intention …funny. Only Cathoilcs would actually spell it out.

Once again, in a word No.
 
Blessedwithfive said:
“The husband and wife enter into sex with the intention that the man climaxes inside of the woman.”

Hee hee…the intention …funny. Only Cathoilcs would actually spell it out.

Once again, in a word No.
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Ha, yes. The only reason to spell out “with the intention of” is because many couples ask “What if we are on our honeymoon, and an “oops” happens? Did I sin?” “What if we are interrupted by our kids?”

Many Catholics aren’t scrupulous enough and don’t pay attention at all to how God designed sex. However, in my experience, some Catholic couples are too scrupulous and worry that everything related to sex is a sin. So, “with the intention of” is a handy way of saying “don’t obsess and be too scrupulous.”

Cheers!
 
EasterJoy said:
I was taught in a marriage preparation class given by a priest that while the wife may climax as part of foreplay, the husband ought to intend to climax as part of the marital act. If he accidentally climaxes prematurely during foreplay, however, that is no sin. (God reads hearts, so just be honest.) Oral stimulation is permissible as foreplay, IOW, but is not to be chosen as a substitute for intercourse.
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Yes. ^This exactly.
 
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