A question about sins and confessions

[Solmyr]

Have you never gotten angry and yelled at someone? Or got snarky and insulted them to their face? Have you never looked at what other people have and found yourself sulking and lost in envy? Or even been so upset about them you dwelt in hateful thoughts? Or judged a person by their looks and thought cruel things about them even though you know you shouldn’t? Have you never taken guilty pleasure in talking about other peoples faults and scandals? Have you never developed bad habits that you later realize you should break and struggled against them?

Because one gives in to that temptation…desiring that which is tempting one…

Why does one eat too many oreos - or make all those trips to the buffet - though one knows it is not good for your heath…?

If one chooses something that is not good - but always there is the appearance of something attractive - something that “seems” in some way “good to you”- though one knows it is in reality not good for you…

Please get serious.

There is a huge difference between giving in to the temptation of having junk food and missing a mass (for no good reason). Please stick to the really serious choices, like murder someone or not. Or raping someone or not. If you know that missing mass for frivolous reasons is a serious sin, then why would you commit it? Especially since you cannot hope to get away with it, since Big Brother is watching you.

 

[Rbaker]

Please get serious.

There is a huge difference between giving in to the temptation of having junk food and missing a mass (for no good reason). Please stick to the really serious choices, like murder someone or not. Or raping someone or not. If you know that missing mass for frivolous reasons is a serious sin, then why would you commit it? Especially since you cannot hope to get away with it, since Big Brother is watching you.

Most Christian people, (and when i say most I mean 99% of them) would not commit murder unless they were suffering from a mental disability of some sort.

It is quite obvious that you are not here for answers and are merely here to just stir the pot.

 

[davidv]

Please get serious.

It is very serious. Obedience to God law has serious consequences. Disobedience likewise. Giving in to the first temptation is not the last step. It is the first. Human nature, as it is, when there no immediate negative consequence, will continue to indulge in those temptations. Eventual those indulgences are no longer satisfying. Then something new is tried.

There is a huge difference between giving in to the temptation of having junk food and missing a mass (for no good reason). Please stick to the really serious choices, like murder someone or not. Or raping someone or not. If you know that missing mass for frivolous reasons is a serious sin, then why would you commit it? Especially since you cannot hope to get away with it, since Big Brother is watching you.

Given your disregard for God (He is not “Big Brother”), it is no wonder that you judge this a huge difference. It is not as huge as you state.

 

[Vic_Taltrees_UK]

I don’t think Solmyr is here to stir the pot.

Solmyr, in response to some of your questions:

• when asking about what a Pope might confess I think a sure bet is when his annoyance has got the better of him over cardinals that are twisting his arms. Or even the sort of thing I described in my own case. In parallel with going to confession I’m sure he will include in his prayers, prayers for guidance and wisdom in dealing with people like that.
• when asking about serious crimes or serious non-criminal sins, serious pastoral issues are or may be involved and I’m not too sure how it might work in detail as it’s out of my depth.
• missing mass even for various reasons may not be a mortal sin. But even when it is, the experience of coming to God for strengthening in good time does one good so in contrast to “not getting away with it” one ends up benefitting.

 

[tweedlealice]

Please get serious.

There is a huge difference between giving in to the temptation of having junk food and missing a mass (for no good reason). Please stick to the really serious choices, like murder someone or not. Or raping someone or not. If you know that missing mass for frivolous reasons is a serious sin, then why would you commit it? Especially since you cannot hope to get away with it, since Big Brother is watching you.

Salutations,
Good and evil were created by God. " I create the light, I create the darkness. I create the good. I create the evil. It is in Isaiah around Chapter 40.
One can google the verse and read it. He gave Satan the earth as his domain. That is why the church must be strong in fasting and prayer. We are the arms and legs, heart and mind of Jesus. Temptation is used by Satan to lore us to sin. Sin is being out of the perfect will of God for you… I love that. I am clueless. Trying all the time to figure it out. There are sins of omission. Jesus will say,"Alice you were suppose to do this , then! Why didn’t you?
The sins of the father are passed down from generation to generation. Mental illness with people thinking of harming themselves and/or others. There is mental illness. But there is,“The devil made me do it”.
I hope this clarifies what you are trying to settle.
We were born in original sin, also. Baptism clears that.
"We are sinners saved by grace.
in Christ’s love,
Tweedlealice

 

[Bookcat]

Please get serious.

There is a huge difference between giving in to the temptation of having junk food and missing a mass (for no good reason). Please stick to the really serious choices, like murder someone or not. Or raping someone or not. If you know that missing mass for frivolous reasons is a serious sin, then why would you commit it? Especially since you cannot hope to get away with it, since Big Brother is watching you.

I am serious.

1. Analogies from persons very common experience help to answer your question.
2. Intemperance too is a sin.
3. You actually phrased the question in terms of not only mortal sin but also venial sins (see your post).

Not even minor ones, like taking a candy from a baby. In other words, when I think that one should not do something… I simply would not do it.

So I cannot fathom what kinds of actions which you would consider to be “sinful” or “immoral” and still you would be tempted to perform. And not just tempted, but actually DO it. The act, of course must be volitional, knowing full well that it a “disallowed” behavior. (Not necessarily a “grave” or “grievous” action.)
.

 

[Bookcat]

If you know that missing mass for frivolous reasons is a serious sin, then why would you commit it? Especially since you cannot hope to get away with it, since Big Brother is watching you.

The person who misses Mass without the excusing reason - they can lets say be tempted to go to a ballgame instead cause their favorite team is playing (and they forgot to go to the vigil Mass the day before). The appeal of the good of recreation is there for that person and in their weakness they give in and go for that pleasure. They are likely not well evangelized and catechized - they are likely more towards the “cultural Christian” -with a weaker formation and faith. Rather too effected by the world. Not something that would tempt those who are rather committed.

Or it could be that they are committed but that is a very very strong personally tempting thing for them that day - and they give in.

Again it is the same - If one chooses something that is not good - but always there is the appearance of something attractive - something that “seems” in some way “good to you”- though one knows it is in reality not good for you…

And as the saying goes “sin makes one stupid” - Sin is not a good reasoned choice.

(Oh and it is not that “Big Brother is watching you” your confusing items from secular society with that of God. )

 

[Bookcat]

The person who misses Mass without the excusing reason - they can lets say be tempted to go to a ballgame instead cause their favorite team is playing (and they forgot to go to the vigil Mass the day before). The appeal of the good of recreation is there for that person and in their weakness they give in and go for that pleasure. They are likely not well evangelized and catechized - they are likely more towards the “cultural Christian” -with a weaker formation and faith. Rather too effected by the world. Not something that would tempt those who are rather committed.

Or it perhaps could be that they are committed but that is a very very strong personally tempting thing for them that day - and they give in. I do not know what particular persons temptations are. That would not be tempting to me but who knows for someone else it might be.

Again it is the same - If one chooses something that is not good - but always there is the appearance of something attractive - something that “seems” in some way “good to you”- though one knows it is in reality not good for you…

And as the saying goes “sin makes one stupid” - Sin is not a good reasoned choice.

(Oh and it is not that “Big Brother is watching you” your confusing items from secular society with that of God. )

 

[Nicene]

I am sorry, if I was not clear enough. I am interested in this question: “if you consider an act to be sinful (either venial or mortal), then WHY do you commit it”? And, of course you can speculate on it: “how come that the pope and the bishops and the priests also commit sins”? It is just something I cannot understand. If I know that an act is “wrong”, then I don’t do it… isn’t that what rational people do?

Let me add: if there is something that is contrary to my concept of “moral” behavior (which might be different from yours - for example a “white lie” perfectly fine in my eyes) then I WILL NOT act on it, no matter how strong the “temptation” might be.

I don’t think that a “temptation” is an excuse. More like a cop-out.

Biblically sins encompass thought word and deed. We all have what is termed concupisence,
Desire. So say you get angry at someone for cutting you off and have thoughts of revenge of some sort, cutting off in return, flipping him off etc, not only is the action of revenge a sin but the thought even if you don’t do it. Emotional responses, which we all have, can be classified as sin as well, whether you act on them or not. The same applies toward say looking at a woman with desire even without acting on the impulse because it treats another human being objectively, which is contrary to God’s intent for us. Even telling someone off, an emotional response is a reaction to desire.

These base things can by “making all good things your habit” (Hebrews) can eventually overcome. Good and bad habits are all “formed”. For example a thief, the first time he steals an item from a store he usually feels guilty, by the tenth time he thinks it’s already his before he takes it and will become angry at the person who catches him.

Anyone who denies he has had bad thoughts towards another is lying to himself and others, but by making good thoughts dominant even those desires can be overcome. We just have to acknowledge them. Confession not only puts you back right with God but it forces us to face ourselves and identify those areas we need to make “all good things your habit”. Habit’s are life forming.

Peace and God bless
Nicene

 

[Scottgun]

Just for edification at your leisure: Bishop Sheen’s The Psychology of Temptation: youtu.be/DVCMfCPlCOo

 

[Solmyr]

1. Analogies from persons very common experience help to answer your question.

No argument from me. They can be very helpful.

1. Intemperance too is a sin.

What kind?

1. You actually phrased the question in terms of not only mortal sin but also venial sins (see your post).

Yes, and I received the answer for the venial sins. The way I read it, the venial sins are no big deal. You have a temptation, you are weak and fail to resist. A good explanation, and it means that you don’t really care about it.

But that does not explain the mortal sins. Simple “weakness” cannot cover it. After all for a sin to be mortal it is necessary that 1) the act should be a grave matter; 2) you must know that it is a grave matter and 3) you must act with full consent. That is not something that can happen by accident.

So the question now remains is: “why would you commit a mortally sinful act?” You cannot hope to escape detection. Maybe one can use the rationalization: “no problem, I will confess, and get off the hook”. But that does not seem likely that you can pull a veil across God’s eyes with such a cheap trick.

By the way, since we are at it, who gives the absolution? The priest in God’s name or God himself?

 

[Bookcat]

What kind?

Often a venial sin.

Now if ones doctor said say - you will be dead in a week if you eat all those oreos…well that would be an example of a grave sin.

 

[Bookcat]

Yes, and I received the answer for the venial sins.

Yes back then…but I later provided more for ya since you asked

 

[Bookcat]

The way I read it, the venial sins are no big deal. You have a temptation, you are weak and fail to resist. A good explanation, and it means that you don’t really care about it.

No it does not mean that.

It MAY mean that for some persons. Sure. That is granted. Unfortunately some do not see the reality of even venial sins being sins.

But no it does not mean that one does not care about it.

It means that man is weak and such smaller sins will not be entirely avoided -even by the very holy. Though they will avoid a great deal more of them than others!

 

[Bookcat]

But that does not explain the mortal sins. Simple “weakness” cannot cover it.

Correct.

It covers some of them. That is one category.

There are also for example sins of malice. Terrible.

After all for a sin to be mortal it is necessary that 1) the act should be a grave matter; 2) you must know that it is a grave matter and 3) you must act with full consent. That is not something that can happen by accident.

Correct not by accident. But it can yes happen due to weakness and temptation. Also though yes there is consent. As I noted sin makes one stupid.

So the question now remains is: “why would you commit a mortally sinful act?” You cannot hope to escape detection. Maybe one can use the rationalization: “no problem, I will confess, and get off the hook”.

It would depend on the person and the kind of sin.

Desire for a pleasure or to avoid something etc etc …maybe even hoping one might repent…

or one may be in a chosen life of sin and do not care and want to act as one wants …etc etc.

There are so many sins and reasons why persons fall into a particular sin. Temptations vary.

Again it is a desire for something that one takes to be an apparent good for them - though one knows it is not…really.

Certainly if the person does not actually repent - they remain in their sin - so there is no “I will do Mortal sin Y and then confess while intending to do Y again”.

(different than say person struggling with a particular sin and repents and resolves not to do it again…)

By the way, since we are at it, who gives the absolution? The priest in God’s name or God himself?

God via the Priest. It is a Sacrament.

 

[jcrichton]

No argument from me. They can be very helpful.

What kind?

Yes, and I received the answer for the venial sins. The way I read it, the venial sins are no big deal. You have a temptation, you are weak and fail to resist. A good explanation, and it means that you don’t really care about it.

But that does not explain the mortal sins. Simple “weakness” cannot cover it. After all for a sin to be mortal it is necessary that 1) the act should be a grave matter; 2) you must know that it is a grave matter and 3) you must act with full consent. That is not something that can happen by accident.

So the question now remains is: “why would you commit a mortally sinful act?” You cannot hope to escape detection. Maybe one can use the rationalization: “no problem, I will confess, and get off the hook”. But that does not seem likely that you can pull a veil across God’s eyes with such a cheap trick.

By the way, since we are at it, who gives the absolution? The priest in God’s name or God himself?

…sorry you keep insisting in what’s been answered several times over: giving into temptation, acting on it, is sin; any Believer can give into temptation, that is why Salvation is not once and for all–if a person becomes a Believer then gives into sin he/she has rejected God’s Authority and has decided to go on his/her own…

All human beings are capable of doing wrong (being unrighteous), even the most holy person alive (including the Pope); the difference between Believers and non-Believers is that Believers, as you have pointed out, are well aware of the effects of their sinful acts while non-Believers, may be aware (as I undoubtedly believe you are) but just don’t care since they do not believe in anything other than themselves (man).

You have the wrong idea when it comes to human folly if you actually believe that the religious are above human frailty (embracing evil); and while there could be those who do not believe in God who, out of sheer “goodness” will not commit themselves to sin or crimes… I doubt very much that there are more than a few worldwide–it is human weakness/folly and we, as water, more often than not, tend to flow to the path of least resistance.

May the Holy Spirit enlighten you!

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[Solmyr]

All human beings are capable of doing wrong (being unrighteous), even the most holy person alive (including the Pope); the difference between Believers and non-Believers is that Believers, as you have pointed out, are well aware of the effects of their sinful acts while non-Believers, may be aware (as I undoubtedly believe you are) but just don’t care since they do not believe in anything other than themselves (man).

Well, I think that I am just as weak and fallible as everyone else, maybe even more so. But it is totally impossible for me to commit an act of “rape”, no matter how much I would be tempted.

Speaking of much less important events, many times it happened that the cashier gave me back more money than it was due. For a split of a second it flashed through my mind that I could keep it (it would not have come out of her pocket), but felt the irresistible “nudge” to speak up and give the money back. And I am not a “saint”, not by a long shot. But when I feel that something I should not do, then I don’t do it. Even if I could get away with it.

 

[Solmyr]

God via the Priest. It is a Sacrament.

Thanks. But I have another question. It is possible that someone forgets or withholds something during the confession. Or does not really “repent”, just says so. The priest is obviously unaware of this, and yet he utters those words: “ego te absolvo…”. “I absolve you”… not “God absolves you”. Are the words “ego te absolvo” to be taken seriously? Does an absolution really take place?

 

[Bookcat]

Thanks. But I have another question. It is possible that someone forgets or withholds something during the confession. Or does not really “repent”, just says so. The priest is obviously unaware of this, and yet he utters those words: “ego te absolvo…”. “I absolve you”… not “God absolves you”. Are the words “ego te absolvo” to be taken seriously? Does an absolution really take place?

If a person forgets a venial sin - no worries. Not required to be confessed (though it is good to do). And one need not directly confess all ones venial sins for them to be absolved in confession (or even forgiven in many other ways).

If a person withholds and is not sorry for a venial sin - then that sin is not forgiven -but the rest are.

If a person honestly forgets a mortal sin - but is contrite - it is absolved “indirectly” with the others. If remembered he is to confess it in the next confession.

If a person does not repent of a mortal sin or if he withholds it - then that confession is not valid - the persons sins have not been absolved (for they did not repent of their mortal sins). Even though the words of absolution are said -the sins are not absolved. Not valid. And the person can now have more sin to confess.

 

[1Lord1Faith]

Thanks. But I have another question. It is possible that someone forgets or withholds something during the confession. Or does not really “repent”, just says so. The priest is obviously unaware of this, and yet he utters those words: “ego te absolvo…”. “I absolve you”… not “God absolves you”. Are the words “ego te absolvo” to be taken seriously? Does an absolution really take place?

Catholics are not to take a legalistic approach to anything spiritual. Not even confession. At the core of confession is the relationship between God and the penitent. The priest is a witness and spiritual advisor who was given the authority (Mt 18:15-20) to absolve.

A Brother Who Sins.*
15
h “If your brother* sins [against you], go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have won over your brother.
16

• i If he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, so that ‘every fact may be established on the testimony of two or three witnesses.’
  17
  j If he refuses to listen to them, tell the church.* If he refuses to listen even to the church, then treat him as you would a Gentile or a tax collector.
  18
• k Amen, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
  19
• l Again, [amen,] I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything for which they are to pray, it shall be granted to them by my heavenly Father.
  20
• m For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.”

As for your question about not really repenting. The answer is also in Mt 18.

The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant.*
21
n Then Peter approaching asked him, “Lord, if my brother sins against me, how often must I forgive him? As many as seven times?”
22

• Jesus answered, “I say to you, not seven times but seventy-seven times.
  23
  o That is why the kingdom of heaven may be likened to a king who decided to settle accounts with his servants.
  24
• When he began the accounting, a debtor was brought before him who owed him a huge amount.
  25
  Since he had no way of paying it back, his master ordered him to be sold, along with his wife, his children, and all his property, in payment of the debt.
  26
• At that, the servant fell down, did him homage, and said, ‘Be patient with me, and I will pay you back in full.’
  27
  Moved with compassion the master of that servant let him go and forgave him the loan.
  28
  When that servant had left, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a much smaller amount.* He seized him and started to choke him, demanding, ‘Pay back what you owe.’
  29
  Falling to his knees, his fellow servant begged him, ‘Be patient with me, and I will pay you back.’
  30
  But he refused. Instead, he had him put in prison until he paid back the debt.
  31
  Now when his fellow servants saw what had happened, they were deeply disturbed, and went to their master and reported the whole affair.
  32
  His master summoned him and said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you your entire debt because you begged me to.
  33
  p Should you not have had pity on your fellow servant, as I had pity on you?’
  34
  Then in anger his master handed him over to the torturers until he should pay back the whole debt.*
  35
• q So will my heavenly Father do to you, unless each of you forgives his brother from his heart.”