A question about the Offertory

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deb216

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It has become the practice at our church for the lectors to return to the ambo and introduce the family or individuals who will be presenting the bread and wine during the Offertory. At first it just confused me. Why would anyone be recognized in such a manner? The gifts they bear are not their own. The service they provide is not merit worthy. Even if it was, there are a multitude of people who help out in one way or another, from the eucharistic ministers and lectors to the ushers, choir members, altar servers, greeters and sign language translators. If we had to call attention to all of them, we would never hear “The Mass has ended…”

Now that I am preparing to be a lector, I am concerned. My trainer told me that I am under no obligation to participate in this distasteful practice but, at the time, it was limited to specific masses on specific days. Lately everyone does it. Will those bearing the gifts be upset if their names are not announced? Will someone else have to make the announcment if I don’t? Do I really want to put myself in the situation of having to decline and explain myself. I don’t want to make waves but I also don’t want to do something that I consider to be liturgically incorrect.

Am I making a mountain out of a molehill?
 
deb216 said:
It has become the practice at our church for the lectors to return to the ambo and introduce the family or individuals who will be presenting the bread and wine during the Offertory. At first it just confused me. Why would anyone be recognized in such a manner? The gifts they bear are not their own. The service they provide is not merit worthy. Even if it was, there are a multitude of people who help out in one way or another, from the eucharistic ministers and lectors to the ushers, choir members, altar servers, greeters and sign language translators. If we had to call attention to all of them, we would never hear “The Mass has ended…”

Now that I am preparing to be a lector, I am concerned. My trainer told me that I am under no obligation to participate in this distasteful practice but, at the time, it was limited to specific masses on specific days. Lately everyone does it. Will those bearing the gifts be upset if their names are not announced? Will someone else have to make the announcment if I don’t? Do I really want to put myself in the situation of having to decline and explain myself. I don’t want to make waves but I also don’t want to do something that I consider to be liturgically incorrect.

Am I making a mountain out of a molehill?
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It’s an improper practice and needs to be stopped. Listing the names in the bulletin is different.
 
it’s idiotic and totally misrepresents what the gesture signifies.
no use to put names in the bulletin, these people are usually chosen by the ushers at the time, if you did list the names half the time they would not show up anyhow. Why do they need to be recognized? they are and represent the entire congregation, just as intelligent to have everyone present stand up and give their name, or even read off their envelope number and contribution amount.

this parish obviously has no inkling of the real meaning of “full active participation in the Mass”. remedial CCD is indicated for all, beginning with the “liturgist”.
 
To me it seems like a reasonable thing for the commentator to do, except that it should not be from the ambo.

From the 2002 General Introduction to the Roman Missal (GIRM) approved for the USA, which can be accessed from romanrite.com/girm.html :
“105. … b. The commentator, who provides the faithful, when appropriate, with brief explanations and commentaries with the purpose of introducing them to the celebration and preparing them to understand it better. The commentator’s remarks must be meticulously prepared and clear though brief. In performing this function the commentator stands in an appropriate place facing the faithful, but not at the ambo.”

The naming of the people provides something of an introduction, so the parishioners get to know each other a little better.
 
Easy way to solve the problem - stop the practice of people bringing the bread and wine up the center aisle from the rear of the church.
 
The Church I grew up in uses a Lector and a Commentator (Ok, a reader and a commentator). At the beginning of the Offertory, the Commentator announces, “As the gifts are presented in our name by , please join in singing our Offertory hymn, , number ### in the Heritage Missal.” The only thing I find cringe worthy and distasteful in that announcement is the following: Heritage Missal. 😃

I don’t know if this practice is truly improper or not, but I know the priest and his sense of humor. It is done in part to make sure people are paying attention, as well as if he has to conscript someone at the last second to bring up the gifts. Please note that the Commentator’s script acknowledges that the gifts of bread and wine are being presented on behalf of the entire congregation.
 
AMDG1 said:
Easy way to solve the problem - stop the practice of people bringing the bread and wine up the center aisle from the rear of the church.
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The procession is encouraged, even required for a Stational Mass of the Diocesan Bishop:

From the 2002 General Introduction to the Roman Missal (GIRM) approved for the USA, which can be accessed from romanrite.com/girm.html :
“73. … The offerings are then brought forward. It is praiseworthy for the bread and wine to be presented by the faithful. They are then accepted at an appropriate place by the priest or the deacon and carried to the altar. …”.

Order of Mass:
“LITURGY OF THE EUCHARIST
PREPARATION OF THE ALTAR AND THE GIFTS
… It is desireable that the participation of the faithful be expressed by members of the congregation bringing up the bread and wine for the celebration of the eucharist or other gifts for the needs of the church and the poor.”
(Roman Missal, Catholic Book Publishing Co., New York, 1985, page 370. It seems to have the same in the 2002 Latin edition, on page 514, n. 22.)

“The gifts are then brought forward. As a sign of their participation, the faithful should present the bread and wine for the celebration of the eucharist, and even other gifts to meet the needs of the Church and of the poor.”
(Ceremonial of Bishops, Liturgical Press, 1989, ISBN 0-8146-1818-9, page 56. From Part II, Chapter 1, Stational Mass of the Diocesan Bishop).
 
John_Lilburne said:
The naming of the people provides something of an introduction, so the parishioners get to know each other a little better.
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The introduction the General Instruction refers to is a introduction “to the celebration” not to persons. It is certainly a very good thing for the parishoners to get to know each other, however, it is just not appropriate during Mass. As Cardinal Arinze said in “The Church Teaches Forum”, Louisville, Kentucky, July 18, 2003
The danger of horizontalism is very real in many Eucharistic celebrations. Some priests and people behave as if they come to Mass primarily to meet one another, to reaffirm one another and at times even to entertain one another. No. Such horizontalism is misplaced. We come to Mass primarily to adore God, to thank Him, to ask pardon for our sins and to make requests for our needs. We are not the center. God is.
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Maybe they announce the name the people so that there’s no confusion on who’s suppose to being doing it?

Seems like a petty thing to get upset over.

Jim
 
There’s no reason to introduce who the people bringing up the gifts are. Their liturgical function is to bring up the gifts on behalf of the entire congregation.
 
Again, it’s all in the presentation, no pun intended. If you look at the example from the parish I grew up, I would find it a petty thing to get upset about. In one way, it’s a verification of whose job it is, in another it’s a simple acknowledgement. It’s all folded into a script whose function really is to introduce the Offertory Hymn, but there is no question who is tasked with bringing up the Gifts.

However, when a spectacle is made, which is what appears to be happening in the OP’s parish, then things need to be dealt with and adjusted.
 
John_Lilburne said:
The procession is encouraged, even required for a Stational Mass of the Diocesan Bishop:

From the 2002 General Introduction to the Roman Missal (GIRM) approved for the USA, which can be accessed from romanrite.com/girm.html :
“73. … The offerings are then brought forward. It is praiseworthy for the bread and wine to be presented by the faithful. They are then accepted at an appropriate place by the priest or the deacon and carried to the altar. …”.

Order of Mass:
“LITURGY OF THE EUCHARIST
PREPARATION OF THE ALTAR AND THE GIFTS
… It is desireable that the participation of the faithful be expressed by members of the congregation bringing up the bread and wine for the celebration of the eucharist or other gifts for the needs of the church and the poor.”
(Roman Missal, Catholic Book Publishing Co., New York, 1985, page 370. It seems to have the same in the 2002 Latin edition, on page 514, n. 22.)

“The gifts are then brought forward. As a sign of their participation, the faithful should present the bread and wine for the celebration of the eucharist, and even other gifts to meet the needs of the Church and of the poor.”
(Ceremonial of Bishops, Liturgical Press, 1989, ISBN 0-8146-1818-9, page 56. From Part II, Chapter 1, Stational Mass of the Diocesan Bishop).
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I was being a bit obtuse but thanks for the references.
 
I find the whole concept of staing the names is wierd. Who cares who they are.
 
puzzleannie said:
it’s idiotic and totally misrepresents what the gesture signifies.
no use to put names in the bulletin, these people are usually chosen by the ushers at the time, if you did list the names half the time they would not show up anyhow. Why do they need to be recognized? they are and represent the entire congregation, just as intelligent to have everyone present stand up and give their name, or even read off their envelope number and contribution amount.

this parish obviously has no inkling of the real meaning of “full active participation in the Mass”. remedial CCD is indicated for all, beginning with the “liturgist”.
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What she said!👍
 
Why couldn’t the altar servers simply process to the back of the church and then process back to the altar with the gifts? They’re lay folk, ie, capable of representing the laity.

I hate this kind of thing. Our parish administrator did something two Sundays ago that was appalling. Our choir had outdone themselves that day, we were all together, the music was traditionalish, we were on spot, we really helped contribute to a prayerful mass (we do, on occasion, detract from it, so you’ll have to excuse my enthusiasm on the days we don’t!). It was a great Mass. So what does Fr. do before the blessing and dismissal? He says, “I just have to say what a great job the choir did today! Weren’t they fantastic?” (big appaluse). Of course, one realizes that if one is to say that about the choir, one must say the same about the altar boys, the ushers, the readers, etc., which he proceeded to do. Big applause for all. It turned into the Oscars awards.

He hasn’t done it since, maybe someone had a wee word in his shell-like ear. If he does it again, I shall sing off-key, loudly, with big arm gestures.
 
hilde_the_dog said:
I find the whole concept of staing the names is wierd. Who cares who they are.
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I agree. It seems as if we should be more focused on the actual words of the Offertory prayers.

By the way, the Novus Ordo prayers are somewhat different than the Tridentine prayers.
 
cue said:
The introduction the General Instruction refers to is a introduction “to the celebration” not to persons. It is certainly a very good thing for the parishoners to get to know each other, however, it is just not appropriate during Mass. As Cardinal Arinze said in “The Church Teaches Forum”, Louisville, Kentucky, July 18, 2003
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Ditto. The commentator, when used, is supposed to be making remarks that enhance the congregation’s understanding of the rite, the sacred action - knowing the name of the person performing the action contributes zilch toward that end.
 
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