A question about Traditional catholicism

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Os2Hugh

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Hello All Hope someone might have an answer for me on some questions I have today about the different “schools” if you will in our church. I have been really involved with the Church now since Christmas 2010 and have embraced my faith and have met some very great people along the way.
Now to the question at hand. In my parish in the Boston Archdiocese we have two priests one a more modern less into the traditional liturgical stuff but a very caring and dynamic man. Our other priest who is a bit younger (early 60’s) is much more traditional in the liturgy and in dress etc. Both men are very orthodox (thank God). What I noticed though was some fellow parishoners and other folks I’ve met in the last few years, really good people (most fall in the 50-70 age range) seem to have issues with certain priests.
An example that comes to mind I went to confession in a nearby parish (good to have different insights from confessors) and I was very impressed by this 30 something year old priest. He wore the shirtfront with cufflinks and some of the old school clergy attire and he used quite a bit of Latin at the Mass. When I told a lady friend about this really good priest in the next town over she said with a annoyed/sarcastic tone “kinda traditional isn’t he”.

It’s hard to explain but I was taken aback by this seemingly harsh rebuke of a good priest. I didn’t say anything because I love and respect this woman, but Iwas wondering why in that 50-60 age generation there seems to be a revulsion to anything “traditional catholic”. When folks talked about going to a Latin Mass they were having nearby it was a similar chorus of jeers and eye rolls.
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                                          I have never been to a Tridentine Mass, but would like to go, and have friends in other parts of the country who swear by them, and get lots out of it. Basically I am asking is it a generational thing why these otherwise good catholics seem to dislike the younger priests and a more traditional form of Catholicism?

                     Why do they want to seemingly begrudge the folks who like traditional Catholicism? I am by the way 29 so I am rather confused by this attitude.
Peace in Christ,
Wincenty
 
I cannot answer for anyone else, but I have never gone to a Tridentine Mass because I am used to attending and participating in a Mass in my native tongue and would struggle too much. I probably would get very frustrated at not understanding the words and would feel excluded because I could not respond. This is why I never sing Tantum Ergo or say any of the Latin or Greek words that are sometimes included in a Mass as it throws and confuses me. I guess that with 2000 years of rich tradition, we cannot take it all in and can only do our best.

As for your question about priests, I don’t know a single parish priest who is universally loved by their flock. There is always someone who disagrees with or doesn’t like something or other about their priest, irrespective of the priest’s age. I have been blessed with the priests in our parish although I know that they have struggled overall with their flock for various reasons.

If you are drawn or wish to attend a Tridentine Mass, just go.
 
Let me help explain this.

I believe the problem lies in the traditionalist Catholic belief that Our Pope is not Our Pope, rather the Popes seat is vacant until the Catholic Church is restored to the way it used to be before Vatican II and so they separated themselves from the Catholic Church in rebellion to this. They feel as if the Holy Spirit has left the Church because of the changes in the mass which is absolutely not true. The Church is and will always be guided by the Holy Spirit. Vatican II was expected and needed like all the other Councils in the past to help the Church grow and flourish amidst modern times. The Church has grown tremendously and there’s not enough priests and so the lay ministers have to help carry out the ministry work of the Church. For another example we can’t keep building huge buildings made of stone and marble if we are responsible for the financial well being of the future of the Church…It is the same Church but we speak the language of the people in the Churches and Latin which served us well as it was a universal language among people, is no longer in use that way. And the Priests who left the Church to keep with the old traditions persuaded many of the faithful to go with them away from the Church and the Pope until the Church is restored. That is being a wolf in sheep’s clothing and something Jesus tells us not to do and they can be very adamant about us not belonging to the true Catholic Church. Of course the Traditional Church has a beautiful service, but what is more important is that the Church is made up of people who have a desire to be fed and go out into the world and sharing the light of Christ to others…
 
i dont mean the sedevacantists i mean more traditional in communion with Rome.
 
it boils down to me it seems they just prefer more contemporary worship which is fine (I prefer English and modern songs mixed with traditional hymns) but they seem to have a real deep seated dislike of some of the more “old School” younger priests. I am too young to have been around for VAT 2 but does this maybe have something to do with it?? (Iknow I am grasping at straws here 😦 .
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                          I have heard the term "spirit of Vatican 2" used positively and negatively just to add to the confusion. Like I said we have priests of both schoold in my parish and they are both great men and hold true to Catholic Orthodoxy and teaching. I just feel bad for some of the young seminarians and priests who seem to be entering a somewhat hostile environment in our church. It's gonna have to be a tough generation of shepherds for sure!
Wincenty
 
Os2Hugh said:
Why do they want to seemingly begrudge the folks who like traditional Catholicism? I am by the way 29 so I am rather confused by this attitude.
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I wish I knew myself but FWIW I see a lot of the younger folks attending the EF. They may not come every week but they are quite open to perhaps a more contemplative form of prayer, among other things. The Latin Mass Society has put out a 5-part series on this and you may find it if you search for “Death of the Reform of the Reform.”
 
I experienced the change in my youth so I don’t remember much of the mass beforehand. I imagine it to be beautiful. I know they have a Latin mass about a half hour away from me which is in communion with the Church. I’ve always wanted to go to it. We have bits and pieces of Latin in the mass still. I apologize for my comment, but if a person reacted that way I could only think they felt opposed to it. I believe some people embraced the change, some people didn’t… I believe that the Church has to stay relevant if it wants to get the message out into the world about Jesus, and it has to involve us. A lot of people today are not satisfied with the way things used to be, though I don’t think we should take our past for granted because it was beautiful before and just part of life. Today people are looking to be entertained instead of living life simply with God.
 
a friend of mine who’s an older deacon said something along the line that this new generation of priests he calls them the JP2/Benedict priests tend to be much more orthodox than their peers in previous generations. He says much less likely to challenge Rome’s authority etc.
 
That’s good, we don’t need more priests just because we need priests, we need more priests who are good priests who take seriously the priesthood. To add… I’ve met many a younger priests who do just that…!
 
Thank You Karen, No offense taken at all, just kinda confused about the whole dynamic being somewhat new (in a sense) The Church. As long as I can confess my sins and receive the Lord in the Eucharist I’ll be fine.
 
Os2Hugh said:
It’s hard to explain but I was taken aback by this seemingly harsh rebuke of a good priest. I didn’t say anything because I love and respect this woman, but Iwas wondering why in that 50-60 age generation there seems to be a revulsion to anything “traditional catholic”. When folks talked about going to a Latin Mass they were having nearby it was a similar chorus of jeers and eye rolls.

I have never been to a Tridentine Mass, but would like to go, and have friends in other parts of the country who swear by them, and get lots out of it. Basically I am asking is it a generational thing why these otherwise good catholics seem to dislike the younger priests and a more traditional form of Catholicic,

Why do they want to seemingly begrudge the folks who like traditional Catholicism? I am by the way 29 so I am rather confused by this attitude.

Peace in Christ,
Code: 
                 Wincenty
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I am in that age group (50-60) and I don’t understand it either. Some people in my own age group are completely virulent about their distaste for anything traditional or “pre-Vatican II”.

Maybe it’s because they lived through the big change. The only way to get their minds around such huge changes in Liturgy and praxis was to demonize what came before.

I find it very perplexing since our generation is very nostalgic in general and looks fondly on just about everything from music to toys from the 50s and 60s but seems to have a knee-jerk hatred from anything Catholic from that same era. 🤷

For my part, I am just thankful that many younger Catholics, especially priests, are more interested in preserving and returning some of the traditions.
 
I just feel bad for some of the young seminarians and priests who seem to be entering a somewhat hostile environment in our church. It’s gonna have to be a tough generation of shepherds for sure!
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Sadly this is the case for many priests and seminarians which is why they so desperately need our prayers and our practical help and support in the parish. The insight that you have is a beautiful gift, not everyone, irrespective of age, understands that we expect our priests to be infallible and yet compliant with our views and desires. The reality is that these wonderful men are fallible and are called to serve God and not the ways of the world.
 
To give an example about the situation. I as a young catholic man am always asked if Iam a seminarian or if I planning to become a priest. Probably because so few young men attend Mass anymore 😦
 
Os2Hugh said:
Hello All Hope someone might have an answer for me on some questions I have today about the different “schools” if you will in our church. I have been really involved with the Church now since Christmas 2010 and have embraced my faith and have met some very great people along the way.
Now to the question at hand. In my parish in the Boston Archdiocese we have two priests one a more modern less into the traditional liturgical stuff but a very caring and dynamic man. Our other priest who is a bit younger (early 60’s) is much more traditional in the liturgy and in dress etc. Both men are very orthodox (thank God). What I noticed though was some fellow parishoners and other folks I’ve met in the last few years, really good people (most fall in the 50-70 age range) seem to have issues with certain priests.
An example that comes to mind I went to confession in a nearby parish (good to have different insights from confessors) and I was very impressed by this 30 something year old priest. He wore the shirtfront with cufflinks and some of the old school clergy attire and he used quite a bit of Latin at the Mass. When I told a lady friend about this really good priest in the next town over she said with a annoyed/sarcastic tone “kinda traditional isn’t he”.

It’s hard to explain but I was taken aback by this seemingly harsh rebuke of a good priest. I didn’t say anything because I love and respect this woman, but Iwas wondering why in that 50-60 age generation there seems to be a revulsion to anything “traditional catholic”. When folks talked about going to a Latin Mass they were having nearby it was a similar chorus of jeers and eye rolls.
Code: 
                                          I have never been to a Tridentine Mass, but would like to go, and have friends in other parts of the country who swear by them, and get lots out of it. Basically I am asking is it a generational thing why these otherwise good catholics seem to dislike the younger priests and a more traditional form of Catholicism?

                     Why do they want to seemingly begrudge the folks who like traditional Catholicism? I am by the way 29 so I am rather confused by this attitude.
Peace in Christ,
Code: 
                 Wincenty
Click to expand...
I wonder if that lady’s reaction focused too much on how you described this priest. Did you elaborate on what was “good” about him, or was your description centered on his attire, cufflinks, and Latin? None of those necessity make a priest “good,” or even traditional in ways that count.
 
nope He did stick out because he looked sort of like the priests in the old Bing Crosby movies, but my admiration of him had to do with his knowledge and his very unique and insightful penances and his general demeanor as a confessor. Just avery impressive prayerful man.
He was kind but also firm he wasn’t danceing around the seriousness of how Sin effects us. He just had it excellent speaker and homilist also 🙂
 
Os2Hugh said:
Hello All Hope someone might have an answer for me on some questions I have today about the different “schools” if you will in our church. I have been really involved with the Church now since Christmas 2010 and have embraced my faith and have met some very great people along the way.
Now to the question at hand. In my parish in the Boston Archdiocese we have two priests one a more modern less into the traditional liturgical stuff but a very caring and dynamic man. Our other priest who is a bit younger (early 60’s) is much more traditional in the liturgy and in dress etc. Both men are very orthodox (thank God). What I noticed though was some fellow parishoners and other folks I’ve met in the last few years, really good people (most fall in the 50-70 age range) seem to have issues with certain priests.
An example that comes to mind I went to confession in a nearby parish (good to have different insights from confessors) and I was very impressed by this 30 something year old priest. He wore the shirtfront with cufflinks and some of the old school clergy attire and he used quite a bit of Latin at the Mass. When I told a lady friend about this really good priest in the next town over she said with a annoyed/sarcastic tone “kinda traditional isn’t he”.

It’s hard to explain but I was taken aback by this seemingly harsh rebuke of a good priest. I didn’t say anything because I love and respect this woman, but Iwas wondering why in that 50-60 age generation there seems to be a revulsion to anything “traditional catholic”. When folks talked about going to a Latin Mass they were having nearby it was a similar chorus of jeers and eye rolls.
Code: 
                                          I have never been to a Tridentine Mass, but would like to go, and have friends in other parts of the country who swear by them, and get lots out of it. Basically I am asking is it a generational thing why these otherwise good catholics seem to dislike the younger priests and a more traditional form of Catholicism?

                     Why do they want to seemingly begrudge the folks who like traditional Catholicism? I am by the way 29 so I am rather confused by this attitude.
Peace in Christ,
Code: 
                 Wincenty
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Hi Wincenty,

This is not a universal attitude among all Catholics. We are all, including priests, part of the Body of Christ. Yes, the priests are taught what to do, how to celebrate the Mass and about caring for those entrusted to them. I think the Church, through the various Popes, has been quite clear over the years. I was there before and after Vatican II. The NO appeared and my only thought was to follow Holy Mother Church, even though the TLM was still allowed.

This is not a generational thing but a divisive way of looking at our fellow Catholics. Some have tried to create categories that divide, not build up the Body. “Cafeteria Catholics,” “Liberal Catholics,” and other labels that divide. Some people, in general, do not get along with others, but the Church is not meant to be a collection of tribes with different, political and derogatory labels. I think no one should get worked up over any of this as if it was an Us versus Them thing. Perhaps you could have a talk with your priest and offer your observations and get his advice.

I mean, do we need to know a lot of personal details about the people we go to Church with? If they like this or don’t like that? I know people who agree with me on some things and people who disagree with me on the same things, but I am civil with both.

God bless,

Ed
 
edwest2 said:
Hi Wincenty,

This is not a universal attitude among all Catholics. We are all, including priests, part of the Body of Christ. Yes, the priests are taught what to do, how to celebrate the Mass and about caring for those entrusted to them. I think the Church, through the various Popes, has been quite clear over the years. I was there before and after Vatican II. The NO appeared and my only thought was to follow Holy Mother Church, even though the TLM was still allowed.

This is not a generational thing but a divisive way of looking at our fellow Catholics. Some have tried to create categories that divide, not build up the Body. “Cafeteria Catholics,” “Liberal Catholics,” and other labels that divide. Some people, in general, do not get along with others, but the Church is not meant to be a collection of tribes with different, political and derogatory labels. I think no one should get worked up over any of this as if it was an Us versus Them thing. Perhaps you could have a talk with your priest and offer your observations and get his advice.

I mean, do we need to know a lot of personal details about the people we go to Church with? If they like this or don’t like that? I know people who agree with me on some things and people who disagree with me on the same things, but I am civil with both.

God bless,

Ed
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I think ed has got it spot on for this one.

and just for the record, it also goes the other way, there are people who have the same kind of attitude about anything postvatican II.

but catholic is catholic, there should not be any labels, there are good things from before and after vatican II. it’s important to try not to throw out everything.
 
Os2Hugh said:
i dont mean the sedevacantists i mean more traditional in communion with Rome.
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What you described is exactly what sedevacantism is. Most “Traditionalist” Catholics don’t believe such things. The majority of the ones in my community just want the hardcore delivery of the faith as it was before and the reverence of the liturgy, and want to become holy, without the warm fuzzies and feel good vibes and watered down faith that is found in some parishes.

Myself, personally, I just want to become a saint and need all the help and discipline I can get.
 
Deo_Gratias42 said:
What you described is exactly what sedevacantism is. Most “Traditionalist” Catholics don’t believe such things. The majority of the ones in my community just want the hardcore delivery of the faith as it was before and the reverence of the liturgy, and want to become holy, without the warm fuzzies and feel good vibes and watered down faith that is found in some parishes.

Myself, personally, I just want to become a saint and need all the help and discipline I can get.
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Please stop the discord by referring to anyone as Traditionalist. We are not to judge or demand that others are doing something wrong unless we say something about it to a priest, not here. Quit dividing the flock.

Ed
 
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