A question for Non-denominationals

[brb3]

In my personal library (which contains approx 950 books on the christian faith) contains 10 or 12 multi volume systematic theology books representing most major schools within protestantism and many single volume works on issues within evangelicalism. I consider myself a pre-mil dispensationalist.

Which in your library support ‘pre-millennial’ rapture eschatology … and disprove the Catholic viewpoint of the post-millennial [some would say amillennial] biblical second-coming prophetic teachings ?

 

[brb3]

I was blind, when I was Fundamentalist.

Actually, just mistaken.

Protestant & non-denoms hold many errant ideas. Since being introduced to Catholic teachings on scripture … I’ve had to forsake many of my errant non-Catholic ideas.

Fundamentalists & Protestants are not ignorant, just misinformed / maleducated by their teachers.

 

[brb3]

I was raised in a Southern Baptist home, but do not espouse that denomination,

Baptism is HUGE with our church, but not as washing your sns away; the Blood of Christ does that! Baptism is more like a wedding ceremony, or replicating Jesus’s death, burial, and resurection!

So … baptism is a drama for you ? Passion Play acting ?

What role does Christ play in your drama ? Baptism is not linked with the Blood Passion of Christ ?

 

[1beleevr]

The foundation of non-denominationalism is questionable doctrine. Once saved always saved. rejection of infant baptism, “bible alone” are all doctrines that are lacking of any kind of basis in the Truth.

Ah yes, but free from weekly confession, calling the pope holy father, crucifixes, and purgatory! And the most grievious error that catholics make, is assuming that ALL noncatholics believe that OSAS means free to continue a life of sin once saved! What a crock! Why bother coming to Christ if you are going to mock Him by sinning! And infant baptism is a catholic interpretation of some Bible verse

 

[1beleevr]

So … baptism is a drama for you ? Passion Play acting ?

What role does Christ play in your drama ? Baptism is not linked with the Blood Passion of Christ ?

Where in my post, did you read that? I said that baptism dos not wash away your sins! We are cleansed from sin by the Blood of Christ! When you get saved, you die to your old self, when you go under the water, you are buried with Christ! And when you come up out of the water, you are resurrected with Christ! Passion Play?

 

[CWBetts]

Ah yes, but free from weekly confession, calling the pope holy father, crucifixes, and purgatory! And the most grievious error that catholics make, is assuming that ALL noncatholics believe that OSAS means free to continue a life of sin once saved! What a crock! Why bother coming to Christ if you are going to mock Him by sinning! And infant baptism is a catholic interpretation of some Bible verse

Confession: In the Scriptures
Crucifixes: What don’t you like about them?
Pope: read Isa 22 in light of Matthew 16
Purgatory: very clearly in the Scriptures
OSAS: Absolutely contrary to the Scriptures
Infant Baptism: The Church is the infallible interpreter of the Scriptures, so the Church’s interpretation trumps yours.

 

[CWBetts]

Where in my post, did you read that? I said that baptism dos not wash away your sins! We are cleansed from sin by the Blood of Christ! When you get saved, you die to your old self, when you go under the water, you are buried with Christ! And when you come up out of the water, you are resurrected with Christ! Passion Play?

According to the Scriptures, Baptism DOES cleanse you! Sheesh! Why don’t you actually rea the entire Bible, and not just the parts that support your preconceived notions.

 

[brb3]

I said that baptism dos not wash away your sins! We are cleansed from sin by the Blood of Christ!

When you get saved, you die to your old self, when you go under the water, you are buried with Christ! And when you come up out of the water, you are resurrected with Christ!

There again, you said it. “Baptism dos[does] not wash away sins !”

But, somehow you are “cleansed from sin by Blood of Christ!” Then … is it by the literal Eucharist ?

Is your Immersion a symbolic drama played out, or is it ESSENTIAL for salvation ?

 

[Jon_Hus]

Which in your library support ‘pre-millennial’ rapture eschatology … and disprove the Catholic viewpoint of the post-millennial [some would say amillennial] biblical second-coming prophetic teachings ?

If I’m understanding your comments correctly, the actual debate in my view is dispensational vs. covenant theology, not between pre, post, A mil.

 

[1beleevr]

Confession: In the Scriptures
Crucifixes: What don’t you like about them?
Pope: read Isa 22 in light of Matthew 16
Purgatory: very clearly in the Scriptures
OSAS: Absolutely contrary to the Scriptures
Infant Baptism: The Church is the infallible interpreter of the Scriptures, so the Church’s interpretation trumps yours.

Okay, confession is in scriptures, specifically 1John 1:9, and James 5:16(not specific about going to a priest,though), Crucifixes: Paul teaches crucifixion, and resurrection; and Jesus was remove from the Cross, so there’s no need to display a likeness of Him on it He is seated at the right hand of God! pope: couldn’t glean anything from either book that justifies calling a mortal man, "holy father. John 17:11 however, Jesus does call God,“Holy Father!” H-m-m-m-m-! Purgatory: Verses used to support purgatory are vague at best! OSAS: This is and has been a very intriguing subject I actually know people who believe that once you are saved, that you are covered, and it’s not that bad if you sin! I am not quite sure at this point, what I really believe about OSAS. I will say this though; Jesus Christ paid a tremendous price to redeem you from the slavery of sin! I find it hard to believe that He would just let you go, when you backslide(which we all have done). I tend to espouse the idea, that we are like those sheep, where one srays away, and the Shepherd(Jesus) comes after us! Do we want to sin after being saved? Of course not(well not me). Even Paulsaod,"The things I want to do, I don’t and the things I don’t want to do, I do!"I don’t understand completely what infant baptism accomplishes, since the child has no concept of what is going on! Ball’s in your court!

 

[CWBetts]

Okay, confession is in scriptures, specifically 1John 1:9, and James 5:16(not specific about going to a priest,though), Crucifixes: Paul teaches crucifixion, and resurrection; and Jesus was remove from the Cross, so there’s no need to display a likeness of Him on it He is seated at the right hand of God! pope: couldn’t glean anything from either book that justifies calling a mortal man, "holy father. John 17:11 however, Jesus does call God,“Holy Father!” H-m-m-m-m-! Purgatory: Verses used to support purgatory are vague at best! OSAS: This is and has been a very intriguing subject I actually know people who believe that once you are saved, that you are covered, and it’s not that bad if you sin! I am not quite sure at this point, what I really believe about OSAS. I will say this though; Jesus Christ paid a tremendous price to redeem you from the slavery of sin! I find it hard to believe that He would just let you go, when you backslide(which we all have done). I tend to espouse the idea, that we are like those sheep, where one srays away, and the Shepherd(Jesus) comes after us! Do we want to sin after being saved? Of course not(well not me). Even Paulsaod,"The things I want to do, I don’t and the things I don’t want to do, I do!"I don’t understand completely what infant baptism accomplishes, since the child has no concept of what is going on! Ball’s in your court!

Confession is very specific. Speaking only to the eleven (that would be the ordained priesthood) Jesus said quite clearly that they had the power to forgive sin. It was important, because this is among the first things He told them after the resurrection!
As for the crucifix: WIthout a corpus, a cross is just a torture instrument. WIth the Corpus, it is a reminder of the Passion.
Infant baptism: baptism washes away sin. Infants are baptized in the faith of the Church, and infant baptism is not contrary to the Scriptures, though it is is inferred. Something need not be spelled out explicitly in the Scriptures to be valid. Show me in the Scriptures where the the Trinity is fully unpacked.

 

[1beleevr]

There again, you said it. “Baptism dos[does] not wash away sins !”

But, somehow you are “cleansed from sin by Blood of Christ!” Then … is it by the literal Eucharist ?

Is your Immersion a symbolic drama played out, or is it ESSENTIAL for salvation ?

Read these verses, and try to explain what they mean! Not sure where you’re getting the thing about drama, and symbolism, but baptism is also a public proclamation(even John the Baptist baptzed in public, including Jesus) And, if Jesus was baptized publicly and by full immersion, why shouldn’t we? Is the word eucharist in the Bible anywhere?

 

[1beleevr]

Read these verses, and try to explain what they mean! Not sure where you’re getting the thing about drama, and symbolism, but baptism is also a public proclamation(even John the Baptist baptzed in public, including Jesus) And, if Jesus was baptized publicly and by full immersion, why shouldn’t we? Is the word eucharist in the Bible anywhere?

Oops, forgot to include the verses: 1John 1:7, Revelation 1:5, Hebrews 13:12, and Ephesians 1:7!

 

[1beleevr]

Confession is very specific. Speaking only to the eleven (that would be the ordained priesthood) Jesus said quite clearly that they had the power to forgive sin. It was important, because this is among the first things He told them after the resurrection!
As for the crucifix: WIthout a corpus, a cross is just a torture instrument. WIth the Corpus, it is a reminder of the Passion.
Infant baptism: baptism washes away sin. Infants are baptized in the faith of the Church, and infant baptism is not contrary to the Scriptures, though it is is inferred. Something need not be spelled out explicitly in the Scriptures to be valid. Show me in the Scriptures where the the Trinity is fully unpacked.

Actually, it’s not very specific at all! speculative may be a better word here! The Bible tells us that if we forgive those who have sinned against us, our Father in Heaven will forgive us and them! So, are you saying that with a corpus on the cross, it is not an instrument of torture? I can look at an empty Cross, and be brought to tears, remebering the sacrifice Jesus made for me(and everyone else). Almost got sick when I saw a depiction of Christ on the Cross at a thing called,“Walk through Bethlehem!” Inferred is the key word in your answer to infant baptism; still don’t believe in it! Who was talking about the Trinity, by the way; or are you just throwing that in? Did you find anyother scripture to justify calling the pope holy father?

 

[brb3]

1John 1:7, Revelation 1:5, Hebrews 13:12, and Ephesians 1:7!

All above refer to Passion of Christ. My question for you was how do you have ‘blood of Christ’ applied to you … if not by Baptism ?

By his Eucharist [lord’s supper] perhaps ? Except, a Baptist can’t receive ‘lord’s supper’ w/o first receiving Baptism

Don’t you accept that Baptism is therefore ESSENTIAL ---- for your Baptist justification ?

 

[brb3]

I don’t understand completely what infant baptism accomplishes, since the child has no concept of what is going on! Ball’s in your court!

Did circumcision accomplish anything for the O.T. Jewish infants ?

Cradle Catholics must of necessity later have Sacrament of Confirmation at ‘age of accountability’ … to complete their infant Baptisms.

 

[brb3]

I consider myself a pre-mil dispensationalist.

What is ‘pre-mil’ … if not pre-millennialist ?

 

[1beleevr]

All above refer to Passion of Christ. My question for you was how do you have ‘blood of Christ’ applied to you … if not by Baptism ?

By his Eucharist [lord’s supper] perhaps ? Except, a Baptist can’t receive ‘lord’s supper’ w/o first receiving Baptism

Don’t you accept that Baptism is therefore ESSENTIAL ---- for your Baptist justification ?

If you are asking me if I’m a Baptist, the answer is no. Is that the name you guys give the Lord’s Supper; eucharist? Baptism is essential for salvation, but it is not everything! I believe that when one comes to Christ(He will meet you wherever you are), you are then covered by the Blood of Christ! In your scenario, blood would be water and water would be blod! I know that both came out when His sside was pierced!

 

[1beleevr]

Did circumcision accomplish anything for the O.T. Jewish infants ?

Cradle Catholics must of necessity later have Sacrament of Confirmation at ‘age of accountability’ … to complete their infant Baptisms.

As far as I can discern, circumcision in the Jewish community, on the 8th day of ife was a sign of God’s covenant with His people! And what of someone who is not a cradle catholic(such a cute term)? And what is the age of acountability? What happns at confirmation? Does the child make a public statement of faith?

 

[CWBetts]

Actually, it’s not very specific at all! speculative may be a better word here! The Bible tells us that if we forgive those who have sinned against us, our Father in Heaven will forgive us and them! So, are you saying that with a corpus on the cross, it is not an instrument of torture? I can look at an empty Cross, and be brought to tears, remebering the sacrifice Jesus made for me(and everyone else). Almost got sick when I saw a depiction of Christ on the Cross at a thing called,“Walk through Bethlehem!” Inferred is the key word in your answer to infant baptism; still don’t believe in it! Who was talking about the Trinity, by the way; or are you just throwing that in? Did you find anyother scripture to justify calling the pope holy father?

I am not going to argue this with you. You won’t accept Tradition, and Sola Scriptura is a self-refuting heresy.