A Question for our Mormon/ LDS friends

[PJM]

If I understand your position correctly?

God the father is [or was] a human person?

So who were HIS parents?

God Bless you,
Patrick

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

HhEEE-!

“Heavenly Father,” or Elohim as he is called also, in Mormonism, is an exalted man.

He was once just a regular dude like us right now and he “became A god.”

Who are HIS parents? NO ANSWER.

How man gods are there? INFINITE!

When did it all begin? NEVER, THAT’S THE POINT!

 

[Aelred_Minor]

HhEEE-!

“Heavenly Father,” or Elohim as he is called also, in Mormonism, is an exalted man.

He was once just a regular dude like us right now and he “became A god.”

Who are HIS parents? NO ANSWER.

How man gods are there? INFINITE!

When did it all begin? NEVER, THAT’S THE POINT!

I’m interested in the Mormon response to this. Do they really worship creatures and disbelieve in a true Creator of the Universe? If so they would seem to be the crudest kind of pagans, but I’m under the impression that they don’t follow the logic in that direction, that they attempt to believe simultaniously that Elohim is an exalted human and in a more orthodox interpretation of God. In any case we should give them a fair hearing about their beliefs just as we hope that people will give us a fair hearing about things like the Trinity and the Incarnation without blowing us off as illogical because of the mysterious nature of those beliefs.

 

[Marie5890]

If I understand your position correctly?

God the father is [or was] a human person?

So who were HIS parents?

God Bless you,
Patrick

LDS dogma is that yes (or at least was, not sure if things have changed), God the Father is an exaulted human, who once lived out a human life much the same way we do now…

Yes, He has parents as well and it continues back in time like that.

But it’s not something that is focused on nor explored or expanded upon. Mormons only focus would be on this world, not other worlds with other populations.

If I recall correctly, it falls under the doctrine known as “eternal progression”

lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?locale=0&sourceId=bea7767978c20110VgnVCM100000176f620a____&vgnextoid=da135f74db46c010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD

ldsinfo.tripod.com/exaltation.htm

I believe it harkens back to the King Follet Sermons?

 

[PJM]

=Marie5890;11586560]LDS dogma is that yes (or at least was, not sure if things have changed), God the Father is an exaulted human, who once lived out a human life much the same way we do now…

Yes, He has parents as well and it continues back in time like that.

But it’s not something that is focused on nor explored or expanded upon. Mormons only focus would be on this world, not other worlds with other populations.

If I recall correctly, it falls under the doctrine known as “eternal progression”

lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?locale=0&sourceId=bea7767978c20110VgnVCM100000176f620a____&vgnextoid=da135f74db46c010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD

ldsinfo.tripod.com/exaltation.htm

I believe it harkens back to the King Follet Sermons?

THANKS,

I’m curious about their FIRST parents origin:shrug:

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

I’m interested in the Mormon response to this. Do they really worship creatures and disbelieve in a true Creator of the Universe?

YEP!
All matter is eternal also, nothing ever had a beginning.
It is even Mormon thought that we all existed as certain
intelligences of sort, spirit matter, formed through gods
and their many wives.

If so they would seem to be the crudest kind of pagans, but I’m under the impression that they don’t follow the logic in that direction, that they attempt to believe simultaniously that Elohim is an exalted human and in a more orthodox interpretation of God.

They want to put on this mask that Mormonism is just another Christianity, but it isn’t really.

 

[Marie5890]

THANKS,

I’m curious about their FIRST parents origin:shrug:

It’s all seen as eternal. Forward and backward.

Just as traditional Christian believe that God is eternal and has always been, so Mormons believe that eternal progression is eternal…

No such thing as “first parents” for them anymore than we believe there is a beginning for when God came into being…

 

[Nicea325]

It’s all seen as eternal. Forward and backward.

Just as traditional Christian believe that God is eternal and has always been, so Mormons believe that eternal progression is eternal…

No such thing as “first parents” for them anymore than we believe there is a beginning for when God came into being…

U-huh…the same God who did not create everything,but merely “organized” it into order? :whacky:

 

[mark_c]

U-huh…the same God who did not create everything,but merely “organized” it into order? :whacky:

Not sure I understand… first parents were human? then THEY created GOD? then where did the first humans come from? This seems like a chicken and egg problem.

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

Not sure I understand… first parents were human? then THEY created GOD? then where did the first humans come from? This seems like a chicken and egg problem.

It’s called eternal progression.

Mormon Couplet:
“As Man is, God once was,
As God is, Man may become.”
God was once a man, IN MORMONISM, born of human parents, they and
Mormon God being the spirit children of some other god who came the ex-
act same way as the Mormon God, etc, NEVER was there a beginning to
this process, so far as Mormon doctrine teaches anyway.

 

[mark_c]

It seems more plausible and believable that GOD always existed and is forever THE Creator and GOD than to have to explain (or evade) how man became a god. If man continues to make or become gods, then where or who are today’s Mormon/LDS gods? Are they living? It would seem to me that if gods are created even today, would they not make an impact in the world even more than Christ? It also seems that the definition of god to the LDS is not capable with the mainstream belief of a Christian god.

 

[ChristIsTheWay]

If I am not mistaken, some modern Mormons have drifted away from the idea that God was an ordinary man like us. At least the ones I’ve met and spoken with believe that when they say God was once a man, they believe He was a man like Jesus Christ was a man. In other words, a divine being from eternity who became human for a time and then returned (this time with a body) to His position as God the Eternal Father. Here is an actual LDS source that discusses this is much more detail: en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_the_nature_of_God/Infinite_regress_of_Gods

 

[Marie5890]

If I am not mistaken, some modern Mormons have drifted away from the idea that God was an ordinary man like us. At least the ones I’ve met and spoken with believe that when they say God was once a man, they believe He was a man like Jesus Christ was a man. In other words, a divine being from eternity who became human for a time and then returned (this time with a body) to His position as God the Eternal Father. Here is an actual LDS source that discusses this is much more detail: en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_the_nature_of_God/Infinite_regress_of_Gods

wow that certainly is a change in belief!!!

 

[LivingWaters7]

If I am not mistaken, some modern Mormons have drifted away from the idea that God was an ordinary man like us. At least the ones I’ve met and spoken with believe that when they say God was once a man, they believe He was a man like Jesus Christ was a man. In other words, a divine being from eternity who became human for a time and then returned (this time with a body) to His position as God the Eternal Father. Here is an actual LDS source that discusses this is much more detail: en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_the_nature_of_God/Infinite_regress_of_Gods

Yes, some Mormons reject the idea that God the Father was a man that progressed to Godhood. As you mention, the idea that He a God that became a man on an earth somewhere as a Savior like Jesus Christ is entertained.

I believe I’ve mentioned this on another thread, however it’s clear to me that various LDS prophets, apostles, other leaders, LDS Church manuals and magazines, have taught that the Father was once a man that progressed to/achieved Godhood. Even Joseph Smith once said that he would refute the idea that God has always been God from all eternity.

 

[TexanKnight]

Yes, some Mormons reject the idea that God the Father was a man that progressed to Godhood. As you mention, the idea that He a God that became a man on an earth somewhere as a Savior like Jesus Christ is entertained.

I believe I’ve mentioned this on another thread, however it’s clear to me that various LDS prophets, apostles, other leaders, LDS Church manuals and magazines, have taught that the Father was once a man that progressed to/achieved Godhood. Even Joseph Smith once said that he would refute the idea that God has always been God from all eternity.

true…but the mormons have been trying for a long time to run pell mell from the earlier beliefs and teachings in order to appear more mainstream

 

[mark_c]

Running from their very beliefs and tenants of their faith really doesn’t say much about their theology, does it? I agree that many Mormons are very nice folks, but I struggle with understanding why they feel a duty to a faith that many of them, really don’t find reasonable. I suppose that this applies to all those fringe Christian faiths who distort Catholicism and attempt to dissuade the truth.

More and more I find great comfort in the the Catholic Church and the writings of great Saints and gentle followers of the faith. The more I learn about the rich history of the Church, I am more and more amazed at the depth and reason for the tenants of the Catholic faith. I have not really found any other faith that has the depth, knowledge and the capacity for teaching about the Trinity and upholding and perpetuating the faith.

 

[PJM]

=ChristIsTheWay;11590029]If I am not mistaken, some modern Mormons have drifted away from the idea that God was an ordinary man like us. At least the ones I’ve met and spoken with believe that when they say God was once a man, they believe He was a man like Jesus Christ was a man. In other words, a divine being from eternity who became human for a time and then returned (this time with a body) to His position as God the Eternal Father. Here is an actual LDS source that discusses this is much more detail: en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_the_nature_of_God/Infinite_regress_of_Gods

The convenience of changing DOCTRINE is itself a SIGN:

Didn’t Jesus say" Let those with ears HEAR?" Mt. 13:43

So HOW can they deny a First cause?

 

[ChristIsTheWay]

wow that certainly is a change in belief!!!

Yes, it is indeed. Though my LDS friends insist that this is all speculation. It was never doctrine or something like that. I have my doubts of course but do see this as hope that as the LDS Church tries to become more mainstream, they might just find their way back to Christianity. Who knows?

 

[mark_c]

Yes, it is indeed. Though my LDS friends insist that this is all speculation. It was never doctrine or something like that. I have my doubts of course but do see this as hope that as the LDS Church tries to become more mainstream, they might just find their way back to Christianity. Who knows?

Wow, I am delighted that you got an LDS to respond to a question of their faith by a non/LDS believer. I know several LDS folks and when questioned, they back down and button their lips. None want (or can) defend their faith when questioned. Not sure what that is all about but it really appears that they are luke warm about their beliefs. I suppose that could be said by most folks. I think it harks back to the LDS belief that Catholics are the devil themselves. I asked a LDS if this were true and I got the silent treatment. It was not an emphatic NO, so I guess it is still one of their beliefs.