A question of Authority

[CWBetts]

I think the biggest problem Protestants have with Catholicism is authority. They cannot accept the authority of the Church established by Christ. They will site other things, but it comes down to authority. They wish to do what they want. They want to be able to interperet the Scriptures in their own way, and in essence become their own Pope. Am I wrong?

 

[NDfan]

I think the biggest problem Protestants have with Catholicism is authority. They cannot accept the authority of the Church established by Christ. They will site other things, but it comes down to authority. They wish to do what they want. They want to be able to interperet the Scriptures in their own way, and in essence become their own Pope. Am I wrong?

Yes you are wrong. I just love new converts to Roman Catholicism.

CW what does authority have to do with interpreting scripture?? Protestants don’t accept the Catholic church’s teachings NOT because they have a problem with authority. It’s because they simply don’t agree. You want to assert the RCC is the only authority that CAN interpret scripture. So therefore if anyone counters their beliefs you automatically say they have a problem with authority.

Protestants would simply say the RCC is erroneous in some of their interpretations and cannot in their hearts follow them. It has nothing to do with authority at all. The problem is Roman Catholics get stuck too much on this authority notion and use it as the source of all issues.

You have problems right within the RCC itself. Over half of the RCC membership do not believe in transubstantiation or purgatory. A large percent think the church has gone down the wrong path when it comes to the teachings on Mary. This is not just isolated to the laity but exists right within the leadership. Do they have a problem with authority too??

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

Yes you are wrong. I just love new converts to Roman Catholicism.

CW what does authority have to do with interpreting scripture?? Protestants don’t accept the Catholic church’s teachings NOT because they have a problem with authority. It’s because they simply don’t agree. You want to assert the RCC is the only authority that CAN interpret scripture. So therefore if anyone counters their beliefs you automatically say they have a problem with authority.

Protestants would simply say the RCC is erroneous in some of their interpretations and cannot in their hearts follow them. It has nothing to do with authority at all. The problem is Roman Catholics get stuck too much on this authority notion and use it as the source of all issues.

You have problems right within the RCC itself. Over half of the RCC membership do not believe in transubstantiation or purgatory. A large percent think the church has gone down the wrong path when it comes to the teachings on Mary. This is not just isolated to the laity but exists right within the leadership. Do they have a problem with authority too??

**I beg to differ here. First of all, you need to name the sight where over “half” of the Catholics in the world do not believe in the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ and purgatory , and the teachings about the Blessed Mother. Don’t just sit at your computer and utter false words here because unless you can come up with some evidence, that you yourself know this, and your sources are credible, because, quite frankly, you are full of it.
There are a million converts every year just in Africa alone, there are Chinese bishops, Iraqi Catholics, thousands of them. Catholics are all over the world. If you can tell me you know of these people in other countries (since you said half of all Catholics, which is half of 1.5 billion), do not believe in the Body and Blood of Our Savior, Jesus Christ, then I will convert to Protestanism.
That is why they ARE Catholic, because of these three things you mentioned. :banghead:
Furthermore, Jesus left us authority starting with Peter who was bishop for 25 years. Amazing when you think how we Catholics have an unbroken link from 2,000 years ago of 265 popes. Quite impressive if you ask me. Protestants, why do you believe that Jesus would leave us abandoned? Can’t you see that is how Jesus chose Peter? **

 

[prodigal-sun]

I think the biggest problem Protestants have with Catholicism is authority. They cannot accept the authority of the Church established by Christ. They will site other things, but it comes down to authority. They wish to do what they want. They want to be able to interperet the Scriptures in their own way, and in essence become their own Pope. Am I wrong?

I concur, Even though non catholic christians do not believe in the authority of the church and our head on earth, “The Pope”. They quite frankly set themselves up as a pope!

Peace!

 

[Hisalone]

The biggest problem I have with the RCC is that at the time of Reformation she was abusive, corrupt and apostate. She has never properly repented of these sins. If she had you would have never started this thread realizing that it was the RCC who was the cause of the split.

Its not authority I object to.
It is corrupt authority.
It is abusive authority.
It is apostate authority.

 

[elvisman]

The biggest problem I have with the RCC is that at the time of Reformation she was abusive, corrupt and apostate. She has never properly repented of these sins. If she had you would have never started this thread realizing that it was the RCC who was the cause of the split.

People within the Church were abusive, corrupt and apostate - the the Church herself wasn’t. If she was, Jesus was a liar. (Matt. 16:18)
Are you prepared to make that claim?

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

The biggest problem I have with the RCC is that at the time of Reformation she was abusive, corrupt and apostate. She has never properly repented of these sins. If she had you would have never started this thread realizing that it was the RCC who was the cause of the split.

Oh please…if Martin Luther was doing God’s work, why did he fail at his attempt to “reform” the Catholic church?
A man that works with God’s approval doesn’t fail because God doesn’t fail.

 

[OneTrueCathApos]

The biggest problem I have with the RCC is that at the time of Reformation she was abusive, corrupt and apostate. She has never properly repented of these sins. If she had you would have never started this thread realizing that it was the RCC who was the cause of the split.

Its not authority I object to.
It is corrupt authority.
It is abusive authority.
It is apostate authority.

Doesn’t matter if one might screw up, THE CHURCH STILL STANDS! People are human. The church is infallible.

 

[Bear_Claw]

The church is infallible.

Says who? The Church? It’s a circular argument.

Like the Pope declaring the Pope infallible. It’s very arrogant to make that declatration and then to assume that it’s from God.

The church is infallible.

Says who? The Church?

It’s a circular argument.

Like the Pope declaring the Pope infallible. It’s very arrogant to make that declaration and then to assume that it’s from God.

The church still stands, because it’s run by humans. The church is made up of the people, the body of Christ.
If they choose to listen to one man proclaiming his own infallibility, that’s their problem.

 

[ziapueblo]

The biggest problem I have with the RCC is that at the time of Reformation she was abusive, corrupt and apostate. She has never properly repented of these sins. If she had you would have never started this thread realizing that it was the RCC who was the cause of the split.

Its not authority I object to.
It is corrupt authority.
It is abusive authority.
It is apostate authority.

The Church brought these issues before the Council of Trent and cleaned house.

 

[CWBetts]

Says who? The Church? It’s a circular argument.

Like the Pope declaring the Pope infallible. It’s very arrogant to make that declatration and then to assume that it’s from God.

Says who? The Church?

It’s a circular argument.

Like the Pope declaring the Pope infallible. It’s very arrogant to make that declaration and then to assume that it’s from God.

The church still stands, because it’s run by humans. The church is made up of the people, the body of Christ.
If they choose to listen to one man proclaiming his own infallibility, that’s their problem.

You act like the doctrine of Papal Infallibilty was invented at Vatican I!!! It has always been there, even in the Scriptures at the Council of Jerusalem!! We do not say the Pope is infallable because the Pope says! We say he is infallible because the Scriptures do!

 

[Bear_Claw]

The Church brought these issues before the Council of Trent and cleaned house.

Corrupt, abusive and apostate authority?

Trent did nothing for that…go and read the biographies of the following popes:
Liberius, reigned 352-66
Honorius I, reigned 625-638
Stephen VI, reigned 896-89
John XII, reigned 955-964
Benedict IX, reigned 1032-1048
Boniface VIII, reigned 1294-1303
Urban VI, reigned 1378-1389
Alexander VI, reigned 1492-1503
Leo X, reigned 1513-1521
Clement VII, reigned 1523-1524

From: listverse.com/religion/top-10-most-wicked-popes/

 

[Bear_Claw]

You act like the doctrine of Papal Infallibilty was invented at Vatican I!!! It has always been there, even in the Scriptures at the Council of Jerusalem!! We do not say the Pope is infallable because the Pope says! We say he is infallible because the Scriptures do!

Pope Pius ix proclaimed the dogma of papal infallibility in 1870. Before that the pope was not infallible.

The evidence is pretty clear on that one…

 

[Hisalone]

People within the Church were abusive, corrupt and apostate - the the Church herself wasn’t. If she was, Jesus was a liar. (Matt. 16:18)
Are you prepared to make that claim?

Jesus does not lie.
Your interpretation of Jesus said does lie.

 

[Hisalone]

Oh please…if Martin Luther was doing God’s work, why did he fail at his attempt to “reform” the Catholic church?
A man that works with God’s approval doesn’t fail because God doesn’t fail.

The counter reformation is proof positive that reform was needed.
God doesnt fail.

 

[Hisalone]

Doesn’t matter if one might screw up, THE CHURCH STILL STANDS! People are human. The church is infallible.

As long as your definition is the church universal and not just the one at Rome.

 

[Snerticus]

The biggest problem I have with the RCC is that at the time of Reformation she was abusive, corrupt and apostate. She has never properly repented of these sins. If she had you would have never started this thread realizing that it was the RCC who was the cause of the split.

Its not authority I object to.
It is corrupt authority.
It is abusive authority.
It is apostate authority.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, WHOA!!!

“She has never properly repented of her sins.”?

Says who? You? Your congregation? Your denomination?

…or God?

Pope JP II apologized and repented for the whole Church. And that’s not enough for you? You may not think he was sincere, you may not have liked him at all, but that’s not for you to judge, is it? I might think you are bitter for something that should be forgotten and forgiven, as proper Christians should do. But that’s not for me to judge.

Or do you think you are God?

 

[fbl9]

I think the biggest problem Protestants have with Catholicism is authority. They cannot accept the authority of the Church established by Christ. They will site other things, but it comes down to authority. They wish to do what they want. They want to be able to interperet the Scriptures in their own way, and in essence become their own Pope. Am I wrong?

No you are not wrong…one can not accept the authority of the Church and say that the Eucharist is not true,or any of the other doctrines of the Church…
In fact i accept the Church’s authority on the basis of the Euchairst alone.

 

[broski234]

Yes you are wrong.

You have problems right within the RCC itself. Over half of the RCC membership do not believe in transubstantiation or purgatory. A large percent think the church has gone down the wrong path when it comes to the teachings on Mary. This is not just isolated to the laity but exists right within the leadership. Do they have a problem with authority too??

Where did you get your info from? Could you site your source? How do you, as a protestant, know that a “large percent think the church has gone down the wrong path when it comes to the teachings on Mary”? By what authority do you make these claims? Please site your sources? And by the way, I readily admit that there are many Catholics who don’t practice their faith the way they should. However, that has no bearing on the Church. It’s not the Church’s fault these people don’t pray more, go to church more, or live by the teachings of the church. Why do you condemn the Catholic Church. We have all seen your threads and know the things you have said with regards to the Catholic Church. Would you call Jesus a bad teacher because Peter denied him 3x’s, or because Judas betrayed him, or because many of his disciples walked away from him because they found one of His teachings too hard to accept (Eucharist-I know you don’t agree with us on this subject)? I doubt you would! So why condemn His Church?

 

[broski234]

Yes you are wrong.

You have problems right within the RCC itself. Over half of the RCC membership do not believe in transubstantiation or purgatory. A large percent think the church has gone down the wrong path when it comes to the teachings on Mary. This is not just isolated to the laity but exists right within the leadership. Do they have a problem with authority too??

Where did you get your info from? Could you site your source? How do you, as a protestant, know that a “large percent think the church has gone down the wrong path when it comes to the teachings on Mary”? By what authority do you make these claims? Please site your sources? And by the way, I readily admit that there are many Catholics who don’t practice their faith the way they should. However, that has no bearing on the Church. It’s not the Church’s fault these people don’t pray more, go to church more, or live by the teachings of the church. Why do you condemn the Catholic Church? We have all seen your threads and know the things you have said with regards to the Catholic Church. Would you call Jesus a bad teacher because Peter denied him 3x’s, or because Judas betrayed him, or because many of his disciples walked away from him because they found one of His teachings too hard to accept (Eucharist-I know you don’t agree with us on this subject)? I doubt you would! So why condemn His Church?