A question to every person

[Chaco64]

What happens if when we all die, we find out, God isn’t real, or heaven or the devil or hell?

I mean, for some messed up reason, some brilliant master mind faked all the religious proof of God and He isn’t real, what happens then?

 

[savedsinner]

What happens if when we all die, we find out, God isn’t real, or heaven or the devil or hell?

I mean, for some messed up reason, some brilliant master mind faked all the religious proof of God and He isn’t real, what happens then?

Nothing.

 

[roamncatholic]

What happens if when we all die, we find out, God isn’t real, or heaven or the devil or hell?

I mean, for some messed up reason, some brilliant master mind faked all the religious proof of God and He isn’t real, what happens then?

Well your question is a bit pointless, because God does exist, but let’s actually look at it as if it were something valid to consider.

This is actually not a new question, but we could look at “Pascal’s Wager,” or also called “Pascal’s Gambit” to find the result.

Basically, these are the following outcomes:

God exists, and you’ve been living as though He exists-- go to Heaven.

God doesn’t exist, and you’ve been living as though He exists-- you’ll have lived a life in pursuit of the philosophical “Good”.

God exists, and you’ve been living as though He doesn’t-- go to Hell(?).

God doesn’t exist, and you’ve been living as though He doesn’t.-- your gamble paid off.

Basically, it’s a 3:1 odds that living life as though God exists and what the Church teaches us is true is the better way.

SO, what does that mean? Even an unfaithful person should be able to figure out that the best bet is to presume God does exist.

Check out en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascals_wager

God bless!

 

[Through_Anyone]

Well the short and simple answer to your question is that no one knows. You’re basically just asking another variant of “why are we here?” or “why is there something rather than nothing?” You’re saying we would die and then find out there’s no God and nowhere to go either, right? What plane of existence would we be on at that moment? You’re pretty much limited to what Christians believe, what another world religion believes, or an idea you create yourself, or you could say you believe there’s something but no one knows what it is…or you could choose to believe that existence would cease all together at death as many folks do. I’ve never heard someone argue for human existence after death without the existence of a supreme being AND without a plane of existence (spiritual destination) to exist in/on. If our belief isn’t true, then someone else’s must be, or no one’s is and we’re all in the same big boat headed towards the unknown. I used similar concerns to justify non-belief when I was younger. Try to go on in faith (if you have any). Without faith can you have real hope (or just fear)? You have free will in your belief structure, but don’t let your heart become hardened, or you’ll never see Truth in anything, only mathematical/scientific truths that can be understood by human reasoning but come nowhere near answering the question “what happens when we die?” The more you pray, the less you’ll doubt. At least you’re thinking about this stuff though, which is more than can be said for a lot of people today. I hope this helps and I also hope someone with an academic background in philosophy chimes in after me. God bless you.

 

[CentralFLJames]

Agree with the Pascal’s Wager dialog.

It’s a sucker’s-bet to bet against God since one is betting into an empty pot with no prize to be won other than to briefly enjoy the “free gift of life” that “no one” gave and ‘must have just been a freak accident of nature’.

The atheist line of reasoning leads to the the popular secular attitude described in scripture (Isiah 22:13 and elsewhere) since ancient times and which we increasingly see in current society. It’s really a form of despair (itself a grave sin):

(Isiah 22:13) “Let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we may die.”

But if one believes in God they quickly realize that relative to eternity the “tomorrow” of our mortal lifespan always comes too soon since life is nothing but a heartbeat of time. A believer in God quickly should discern that a heathen perspective (i.e. living for fun and pleasure for tomorrow we die) is utterly vacuous of meaning and has eternal consequences - all bad.

Every atheist, if he can not come to believe in God by the natural faith suggested by the vast and grand scale of Nature or by a gift of Divine Faith should at least naturally hope there is a God. In my way of thinking it seems absolutely foolish to not extend at least the benefit of the doubt. By what strange logic would any rational person gamble on an empty pot that pays nothing while risking an eternity of debt by betting against an unlimited pot (a plausible hope of salvation) and living for oneself and betting on one’s own fallibility?

**Ironically if the atheist turns out to be right - he will never even get the satisfaction to know if he won his bet on the empty pot. **Eventually though, most atheists discern this gloomy fact; and this is why suicide is so high among atheists. What is also ironic is they do have a faith of sorts - buts its misdirected. That is, they have an absolute faith in the certain infallability of their own belief. Those that kill themselves are the ones who see the extent of the abject emptiness and lack of purpose in living a heathen life - but how ironic they just can’t put aside their pride and admit that they just might be dead wrong. Atheism is a strange and irrational condition of contradiction where one simultaneously disbelieves in absolutes while absolutely believing in personal infallibility. It hurts my brain to even imagine what goes on inside the head of an atheist.

Therefor, I say that atheism is the highest expression of hubris and pride that any human can ever ascend to since the atheist arrogantly makes himself god in his absolute certainty but while denying his own existence as god.

Thus I also believe that atheists are the strongest counter-evidence on the planet against the Catholic belief that God predestines no one to hell.
Pitzer College Suicide Report:

The website Adherents.com reported the following in respect to atheism and suicide:

“Pitzer College sociologist Phil Zuckerman compiled country-by-country survey, polling and census numbers relating to atheism, agnosticism, disbelief in God and people who state they are non-religious or have no religious preference. These data were published in the chapter titled “Atheism: Contemporary Rates and Patterns” in The Cambridge Companion to Atheism, ed. by Michael Martin, Cambridge University Press: Cambridge, UK (2005). In examining various indicators of societal health, Zuckerman concludes about suicide:
“Concerning suicide rates, this is the one indicator of societal health in which religious nations fare much better than secular nations. According to the 2003 World Health Organization’s report on international male suicides rates (which compared 100 countries), of the top ten nations with the highest male suicide rates, all but one (Sri Lanka) are strongly irreligious nations with high levels of atheism. It is interesting to note, however, that of the top remaining nine nations leading the world in male suicide rates, all are former Soviet/Communist nations, such as Belarus, Ukraine, and Latvia. Of the bottom ten nations with the lowest male suicide rates, all are highly religious nations with statistically insignificant levels of organic atheism.”

James

 

[redhen]

I’ve never heard someone argue for human existence after death without the existence of a supreme being AND without a plane of existence (spiritual destination) to exist in/on.

This is the definition of Buddhism.

 

[rossum]

Well your question is a bit pointless, because God does exist, but let’s actually look at it as if it were something valid to consider.

This is actually not a new question, but we could look at “Pascal’s Wager,” or also called “Pascal’s Gambit” to find the result.

Basically, these are the following outcomes:

God exists, and you’ve been living as though He exists-- go to Heaven.

God doesn’t exist, and you’ve been living as though He exists-- you’ll have lived a life in pursuit of the philosophical “Good”.

God exists, and you’ve been living as though He doesn’t-- go to Hell(?).

God doesn’t exist, and you’ve been living as though He doesn’t.-- your gamble paid off.

There is a further option:
God does exist, but you have followed the wrong God - “Why didn’t you attend my Synagogue on Fridays? Off to Hell with you!” [cue Rowan Atkinson - “Welcome to Hell”]

Given the vast number of proposed gods the chances of picking the right one (if there is only one rather than many) are not good. Better to be a Hindu - buy one god, get 99,999 free. Much better odds.

rossum

 

[roamncatholic]

There is a further option:
God does exist, but you have followed the wrong God - “Why didn’t you attend my Synagogue on Fridays? Off to Hell with you!” [cue Rowan Atkinson - “Welcome to Hell”

]

Given the vast number of proposed gods the chances of picking the right one (if there is only one rather than many) are not good. Better to be a Hindu - buy one god, get 99,999 free. Much better odds.

rossum

Actually,I took care of that option, as well. Did you see my link to the Wikipedia article? It gives you a bit more about Pascal, and his determining that Christianity would be the religion most likely to worship the True God. Go back and check it out!

Pax!

 

[thistle]

What happens if when we all die, we find out, God isn’t real, or heaven or the devil or hell?

I mean, for some messed up reason, some brilliant master mind faked all the religious proof of God and He isn’t real, what happens then?

Your question doesn’t make any sense.
If none of those are real you wouldn’t find out because you would simply be dead and a rotting corpse.

 

[foundthelight]

We wouldn’t even know about it. So who cares?

 

[yellowbicycle]

Then…nothing, I guess.
Still, I think my life is more satisfying with the belief that there IS a God, than when I thought there wasn’t.

 

[Le_Chiot_Noir]

What happens if when we all die, we find out, God isn’t real, or heaven or the devil or hell?

You respawn at your last save point.

 

[strngrnrth]

If there is no afterlife, we don’t find out. We’re unconscious – totaly and eternally – before that point would have come.
If there is an afterlife, we discover a world we never thought existed. What that is depends of course on what religion, if any, is right.
That’s why faith needs to be based on the best evidence and inner searching available while we can. Mine led me where I am and it was very thorough, and this is not where I expected to end up, so I feel sure that the Catholic faith is true.
If it somehow turns out to have ben a weird dream and it turns out the bizarre New Age religion I cobbled together for myself in the 1980’s and 1990’s had been true all along, then I might still be OK, as that religion was very open-ended about the afterlife – but my spirit guides would be very upset with me and might torture me, if they could catch me! Good thing there is no reason the think that could happen.
If it turns out that the Muslims are right I guess I’m a goner, but I see no solid cause for worry about that either.

 

[cranster]

Thinking about Pascal’s wager leads me to ask our atheist friends a question. What is it that you believe you gain by not believing there is a God? There has to be some gain for you or you wouldn’t hold the position, and what do you think you would lose by believing in God? You must believe you would lose something because it is logical to seek to know the source of your being even if that source is God.

 

[T700]

You respawn at your last save point.

My guess is that you, me, and about 1% of the rest of the readers got your joke. That said, I enjoyed it.

Paul
For the Horde!

 

[Aleii]

Thinking about Pascal’s wager leads me to ask our atheist friends a question. What is it that you believe you gain by not believing there is a God? There has to be some gain for you or you wouldn’t hold the position, and what do you think you would lose by believing in God? You must believe you would lose something because it is logical to seek to know the source of your being even if that source is God.

Its not about gaining or losing anything, its about what one thinks is the truth. Could you suddenly decide to honestly believe in Zeus? No, because you don’t think he logically exists, and thus you would be lying to yourself to say otherwise. It is the same with atheists.

 

[Henning]

What happens if when we all die, we find out, God isn’t real, or heaven or the devil or hell?

I mean, for some messed up reason, some brilliant master mind faked all the religious proof of God and He isn’t real, what happens then?

I am dead (Col 3:3)…God is real

 

[redhen]

Its not about gaining or losing anything, its about what one thinks is the truth. Could you suddenly decide to honestly believe in Zeus? No, because you don’t think he logically exists, and thus you would be lying to yourself to say otherwise. It is the same with atheists.

You would think that people in the 21st century would not believe in the ancient Greeks gods, but you would be wrong.

hellenion.org/index.html

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6283907.stm

Humans believe in all kinds of things.

 

[jimmy]

What happens if when we all die, we find out, God isn’t real, or heaven or the devil or hell?

I mean, for some messed up reason, some brilliant master mind faked all the religious proof of God and He isn’t real, what happens then?

This is a meaningless question considering that if it were true then we wouldn’t know if it were true even after we died. There would be no realization of it because we would be dead. We would know about as much about it as a stone knows about its creator.

 

[Swan]

Your question doesn’t make any sense.
If none of those are real you wouldn’t find out because you would simply be dead and a rotting corpse.

I disagree. I personally believe in life after death on another plane/dimension, ??? But I do not believe in any particular God/god. A continuance of the self/soul/whatever-you-want-to-call it is not dependent on belief in the Judeo/Christian or any other God/god.