A Russian church for a Saudi mosque?

[MugenOne]

Go Russians go!

This delightful story just came in thanks to getreligion.org: The Saudis have recently asked permission to build a mosque in Moscow, a city where there are only four mosques and 2 million Muslims. The Russians, however, are saying they want, in return, an Orthodox church in Saudi Arabia.
As we all know, the Saudis have a habit of constructing mosques in dozens of world capitals while forbidding houses of worship for any religion whatsoever outside its Wahabist brand of Islam. They’ve gotten some bad PR locally for some of the hate language in textbooks at the Saudi Academy in northern Virginia. Not only are hapless Christians terrorized and jailed for daring to hold private prayer services in Saudi Arabia, but God help them should they try to convert someone to their religion. And that’s for a fellow People of the Book: One can only guess at what the treatment of Buddhists and Hindus must be like.
Wouldn’t it be so ironic if the Russians were the first Christian body to win acceptance of the right to build a church in, say, Riyadh? (Some of the Russians are calling for a church in Mecca, but the chances of any other religion getting a foothold within walking distance of the world center of Islam is less than zero.) Of course we all know the Saudis aren’t about ready to let Bibles or other religious literature, let alone a church, anywhere near their homeland, but all the same, it’s amusing to see the Russians give the Saudis a taste of their own medicine.
-Julia Duin, religion editor

washingtontimes.com/weblogs/belief-blog/2008/Dec/03/russian-church-saudi-mosque/

 

[bpbasilphx]

When there’s an Orthodox Patriarchate of Mecca with a Cathedral there, then I’ll be impressed.

In the meantime, good for the Russians!

Isa akbar!

**Isa akbar!

ISA AKBAR!

I bear witness there is NO GOD but Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and Jesus is God Incarnate risen from the dead.**

 

[inJESUS]

“And in support of their argument, the three groups cite the comment of Jean-Louis Cardinal Toran, the head of the Papal Council on Inter-religious Dialogue that “if Muslims consider it correct to have a large and beautiful mosque in Rome, then it is equally correct for Christians to have a church in Riyadh.””

It’s high time.

 

[cathopologist]

"And in support of their argument, the three groups cite the comment of Jean-Louis Cardinal Toran, the head of the Papal Council on Inter-religious Dialogue that “if Muslims consider it correct to have a large and beautiful mosque in Rome, then it is equally correct for Christians to have a church in Riyadh.”"

It’s high time.

Exactly. Religious rights must be reciprocrated in order to be respected from both sides.

 

[Kaninchen]

So much easier to refuse when you’re a major oil/gas producer yourself, of course.

 

[paarsurrey]

Hi

Is it going to be a barter deal?

There are so many churches in so many Muslim countries; Moscow is not a Vatican, I think. It is just like London. If Muslims could have mosques in London or Delhi; they should have one or many in Moscow also. Russia is supposed to be a secular country not a religious stronghold.

I love Jesus and Mary as I do love Buddha and Krishna

Thanks

 

[cathopologist]

Hi

Is it going to be a barter deal?

There are so many churches in so many Muslim countries; Moscow is not a Vatican.

I love Jesus and Mary as I do love Buddha and Krishna

Thanks

Give us a list of the number of churches in Islamic gulf states.
Nobody said Moscow is the Vatican, but Moscow has the right to voice its opinion.

 

[LDNCatholic]

Hi

Is it going to be a barter deal?

There are so many churches in so many Muslim countries; Moscow is not a Vatican.

But Moscow is the seat for the Patriarch of the Russian Orthodox Church (correct me if I am wrong), therefore it is a very important city for Orthodox Christians.

There are so many Christians in the Kingdom, it is about time the Saudis admitted this and allowed them a place to worship.

 

[cathopologist]

But Moscow is the seat for the Patriarch of the Russian Orthodox Church (correct me if I am wrong), therefore it is a very important city for Orthodox Christians.

Right. Moscow sees itself as the heir of New Rome.

 

[paarsurrey]

Give us a list of the number of churches in Islamic gulf states.
Nobody said Moscow is the Vatican, but Moscow has the right to voice its opinion.

Hi

I think there are so many churches in Syria or Lebanon and even in Jerusalem. Don’t they have?

Thanks

 

[cathopologist]

Hi

I think there are so many churches in Syria or Lebanon and even in Jerusalem. Don’t they have?

Thanks

I specifically mentioned Islamic gulf states - surely you can differentiate them? Lebanon was once overwhemingly Maronite. Syria was once overwhemingly Syro-Orthodox and Syro-Catholic. Jerusalem is an Islamic state? Are you still living in the pre-Crusade era?

 

[cathopologist]

Hi

I think there are so many churches in Syria or Lebanon and even in Jerusalem. Don’t they have?

Thanks

I specifically mentioned Islamic gulf states - surely you can differentiate them? Lebanon was once overwhemingly Maronite. Syria was once overwhemingly Syro-Orthodox and Syro-Catholic. Are you going to tell us now Islam peacefully crept into their lands? Jerusalem is an Islamic state? Are you still living in the pre-Crusade era? I hope not?

 

[LDNCatholic]

Hi

I think there are so many churches in Syria or Lebanon and even in Jerusalem. Don’t they have?

Thanks

How many are in Saudi Arabia?

 

[paarsurrey]

Hi

I don’t mind if you have one in Riyadh; but it is you to decide or they to decide. Many Muslims don’t follow SA line and if one amongst them wants to have a mosque in Moscow;why to refuse it?

Jerusalem has been under Muslim rule, I think, for quite a long time. Ancient churches have remained there, I think.

Thanks

 

[paarsurrey]

Hi

Thanks for your angry yet good reasoning.

Regards

 

[cathopologist]

I don’t mind if you have one in Riyadh; but it is you to decide or they to decide. Many Muslims don’t follow SA line and if one amongst them wants to have a mosque in Moscow;why to refuse it?

I think this is a matter of testing Islam’s sincerity towards people they consider as second-class citizens in Islamic states. If Riyadh says no to building churches there, then Moscow reserves the right to say no to them also, as should Rome. Religious rights must be reciprocated in order to have true, mutual respect.

Jerusalem has been under Muslim rule, I think, for quite a long time. Ancient churches have remained there, I think.

Thanks

The Church of the Holy Sepulchre was burnt down under Muslim rule and so were other churches. Many Christians were forced to wear armbands to differentiate them from their Muslim inhabitants - no different than what Nazi Germany did to non-Aryans. What about the Jizya and the fact Muslims could storm into any Christian home and snatch their first born sons to force them to become Muslims and fight for their army? There was no peace but fear.

 

[paarsurrey]

Hi

I now even more understand your non-angry arguments. I am also in favour of peaceful spread of Islam. I understand that initially Islam reached Chehinya very peacefully for so many centuries. I don’t want to indulge in the political debacle now. This does not come under the purview of our present discussion.

I can appreciate your view point however; and that is why we are here my friend.

Together we learn.

Thanks

 

[paarsurrey]

The Church of the Holy Sepulchre was burnt down under Muslim rule and so were other churches.

Hi

I don’t see any teachings to that effect in Quran. In fact Quran teaches that all Worship Places, whatever the religion, together with their clergy must be protected. I could quote f rom Quran if you like.

The rest is only politics, to me.

Thanks

 

[paarsurrey]

Hi

That I understand.

Thanks

 

[cathopologist]

I am also in favour of peaceful spread of Islam. I understand that initially Islam reached Chehinya very peacefully for so many centuries.Thanks

Chechen Muslims are Sufi’s (orthodox Islam considers them heretical) - they reject violence on the most part but increasingly have been exposed to Mujahadeen idealogy eversince it arrived on their soils in the late 18th century, not ‘for many centuries’.