Abortion and Separation of Church and State

[bbarrick8383]

Yes, but what is the best attitude that we should adopt to help them understand?

Other than getting those videos that I have seen linked on here out to them, I do not know. They are so graphical, I can barely get into a few minutes of them. I do not know how anyone could watch that and turn their back to it.

 

[bbarrick8383]

Maybe liberals are smart so you could try intelligent speech?

They are not smart, they think they are. It is called Pseudo-Intellectualism. They believe because they sit in the book store and sip on their latte reading about travel in Europe that they are on a higher mental level than everyone else.

 

[Angels_Unaware]

They are not smart, they think they are. It is called Pseudo-Intellectualism. They believe because they sit in the book store and sip on their latte reading about travel in Europe that they are on a higher mental level than everyone else.

And fail to see the absoulte deranged absurdity of calling abortion anything except exactly what it is- legalized murder that protects the right to fornicate. Right to choose? Ridiculous. I suppose if children came into the world by the random migrations of the Stork then we might want to have a return policy, but as it stands today, there’s quite a bit of choice involved in conception.

 

[bbarrick8383]

And fail to see the absoulte deranged absurdity of calling abortion anything except exactly what it is- legalized murder that protects the right to fornicate. Right to choose? Ridiculous. I suppose if children came into the world by the random migrations of the Stork then we might want to have a return policy, but as it stands today, there’s quite a bit of choice involved in conception.

Now, do not involve animals in the matter. They will have PETA and Pam Anderson all over you.
:tsktsk:

 

[Texas_Roofer]

They are not smart, they think they are. It is called Pseudo-Intellectualism. They believe because they sit in the book store and sip on their latte reading about travel in Europe that they are on a higher mental level than everyone else.

And how would you know?

 

[bbarrick8383]

And how would you know?

Because I have been around them, I have lived in their world. I almost wanted it at one time, then I realized that they are so fake and blind that they can not see beyond their own nose. I grew up in a conservative world, but wanted out. When I got out, I could not wait to get back in. Liberals may someday rule this country and turn it into another European nation. We will be spending the euro and riding bicycles, abortion will be the norm. That someday may begin tomorrow. I have heard many conservatives speak about what we will do if this happens. It would not be easy, but I’d be more than happy if it came.

 

[Texas_Roofer]

Because I have been around them, I have lived in their world. I almost wanted it at one time, then I realized that they are so fake and blind that they can not see beyond their own nose. I grew up in a conservative world, but wanted out. When I got out, I could not wait to get back in. Liberals may someday rule this country and turn it into another European nation. We will be spending the euro and riding bicycles, abortion will be the norm. That someday may begin tomorrow. I have heard many conservatives speak about what we will do if this happens. It would not be easy, but I’d be more than happy if it came.

Again why would you think they want “euros” or have any relationship with “Europe”? What makes them “fake”? Are you wanting to overthrow the US so voting goes away, thus your defined “conservatives” can remain in charge (kind of like a ruling class)?

 

[bbarrick8383]

Again why would you think they want “euros” or have any relationship with “Europe”? What makes them “fake”? Are you wanting to overthrow the US so voting goes away, thus your defined “conservatives” can remain in charge (kind of like a ruling class)?

Well, I did not want to be baited and dragged into this argument, but here goes.

Liberals are the ones on their knees for Mr. O. They are the ones who look at him as a “Messiah”. He goes to Germany, gives a speach, comes back and screams Socialism, and the liberals come crawling. They are blinded by the facts of life, they want a big socialist government to take care of the things they do not want to be bothered with.
They believe that a bureaucracy created for every problem will eliminate that problem. What they do not realize is that Conservatives can live without them, but they can not live without us.

I believe that if things go too far, such as screwing with the Second Amendment, Conservatives will stand up and either take back what they began or take their own land and recreate it. We can do in a private sector, twice as much as a liberal can do in the public. It’s been proven, its a fact, if they do not like it then keep messing things up and they will be right in line to be the next Cuba.

A ruling class? No, the class that got us where we are. Liberals are the class taking us where we came from.

Like I said, you baited me and I took. That is how a “true” Conservative feels. I will not argue this point any further. Especially if you are a liberal.

 

[Texas_Roofer]

Well, I did not want to be baited and dragged into this argument, but here goes.

Liberals are the ones on their knees for Mr. O.

Can you show a picture of that?

They are the ones who look at him as a “Messiah”.

actually these are your words, no liberal has written that in your post

He goes to Germany, gives a speach, comes back and screams Socialism,

I never heard him scream “socialism” could you document that?

and the liberals come crawling.

do you have a picture?

They are blinded by the facts of life, they want a big socialist government to take care of the things they do not want to be bothered with.

Again how do you know that?

They believe that a bureaucracy created for every problem will eliminate that problem.

Again how do you know that?

What they do not realize is that Conservatives can live without them, but they can not live without us.

Are you calling for a ruling class?

I believe that if things go too far, such as screwing with the Second Amendment, Conservatives will stand up and either take back what they began or take their own land and recreate it.

Did you know the US was created by Liberals? They were proud liberals and rejected the conservative method of a king

We can do in a private sector, twice as much as a liberal can do in the public. It’s been proven, its a fact, if they do not like it then keep messing things up and they will be right in line to be the next Cuba.

Who is your “we” the current administration grew the government by 40% in 8 years are they part of your “we”

A ruling class? No, the class that got us where we are. Liberals are the class taking us where we came from.

Like I said, you baited me and I took. That is how a “true” Conservative feels. I will not argue this point any further. Especially if you are a liberal.

I agree Liberals are the ones taking you where you are going, that is leadership

 

[bbarrick8383]

I’ll save my time for something better to do. The only thing I would like to point out is that the Founders that started this country are not the Liberals that are ruining it today. The Liberals today are trashing the constitution the founders created.

The Liberals today are guilty of 50.5 million murders.

When the time comes as it surely will, when we face that awesome moment, the final judgment, I’ve often thought, as Fulton Sheen wrote, that it is a terrible moment of loneliness. You have no advocates, you are there alone standing before God - and a terror will rip through your soul like nothing you can imagine. But I really think that those in the pro-life movement will not be alone. I think there will be a chorus of voices that have never been heard in this world but are heard beautifully and clearly in the next world - and they will plead for everyone who has been in this movement. They will say to God, ‘Spare him because he loved us,’ - and God will look at you and say not, ‘Did you succeed?’ but ‘Did you try?’

• Rep. Hyde

 

[Texas_Roofer]

I’ll save my time for something better to do. The only thing I would like to point out is that the Founders that started this country are not the Liberals that are ruining it today. The Liberals today are trashing the constitution the founders created.

The Liberals today are guilty of 50.5 million murders.

I think one day you will find your problem lies here, many people you call conservative both committeed some of these abortions, and supported some of these abortions. Additionally, many liberal you condemn as though you speak for God are prolifers. Did you know “Jane Roe” is a pro lifer now(Norma Leah McCorvey}? She was the one who sued for abortion rights.

When the time comes as it surely will, when we face that awesome moment, the final judgment, I’ve often thought, as Fulton Sheen wrote, that it is a terrible moment of loneliness. You have no advocates, you are there alone standing before God - and a terror will rip through your soul like nothing you can imagine. But I really think that those in the pro-life movement will not be alone. I think there will be a chorus of voices that have never been heard in this world but are heard beautifully and clearly in the next world - and they will plead for everyone who has been in this movement. They will say to God, ‘Spare him because he loved us,’ - and God will look at you and say not, ‘Did you succeed?’ but ‘Did you try?’

• Rep. Hyde

Well I do not know if you are quoting Sheen or Hyde both were good men. Neither quote justifies blindly voting republican for life. It would be unwise to assume voting republican means achieving salvation.

 

[JReducation]

We may be getting all over the place now. The question is whether separation of Church and State makes abortion an untouchable “right”.

I can’t see how it does. Abortion is the denial of the right to birth. Every animal has the right to be born, unless that is lost through natural causes. It is a natural law that when the mother becomes pregnant, if nothing interferes (natural or man made) the life within her comes to term and is born.

To interfere in this process is a violation of that right that the unborn has. The right is not given by the State. It is given by natural law. Since the State does not give the right, it does not have the authority to legislate against it.

Man can only change his own laws, not those that are imposed on us at the time of Creation. This is included in our Declaration of Independence and our Constitution. Both documents clearly defend the rights of man based on certain rights that are given to man by the Creator.

If the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution recognize a Creator and the fact that said Creator gives rights, then we cannot claim it an invasion of religion when the Creator and his laws are invoked. To invoke the Creator and his laws is consistent with the invocations in these two documents.

Had the Founding Fathers denied the existence of a Creator and natural law they would not have mentioned him in their writing and the law of the land. We know that they stood for a secular government. Yet, they acknowledged that the secular government was subordinate to rules that came from the Creator.

The right to be born also comes from the Creator.

Fraternally,

JR

 

[bbarrick8383]

I think one day you will find your problem lies here, many people you call conservative both committeed some of these abortions, and supported some of these abortions. Additionally, many liberal you condemn as though you speak for God are prolifers. Did you know “Jane Roe” is a pro lifer now(Norma Leah McCorvey}? She was the one who sued for abortion rights.

In my opinion a person can not be considered “Conservative” and commit/support/affiliate in any way with abortions.

Well I do not know if you are quoting Sheen or Hyde both were good men. Neither quote justifies blindly voting republican for life. It would be unwise to assume voting republican means achieving salvation.

I do not vote blindly Republican, but I will not stand by while the most Liberal of Democrats take over all 3 branches of the Government. Hyde was quoting Sheen there in a speech he had given.

Christian(not Catholic yet), Conservative(Really they go hand in hand to me), Patriot, Republican

That is how I vote, in that order, the democratic party is not what it was. Even my conservative strict democratic grandmother will tell you that. I do not like everything Bush(not a Conservative) did, no, but at least he did not sit in office and stare at the walls like Clinton did.

There is a Conservative movement stirring, its flames are being fanned by the Liberal movement. To get on board with the Liberals would be to accept gay marriage and abortion at will. To get on board with the Conservatives would be to bring this country back to its roots, small government, less taxes, strong moral values.

 

[CWBetts]

Did you know the US was created by Liberals? They were proud liberals and rejected the conservative method of a king.

Not precisely true. Many of our founding fathers espoused a limited government role, among them Thomas Jefferson and John Adams. Granted our founding fathers were of the Enlightentment, and so rejected such ideas as Divine Right of Kings, but these “liberals” have very little in common with the modern leftist. The modern liberal looks to the government to solve all of our problems. The modern left seeks to eradicate personal reponsibility. The modern left seeks to completely misconstrue the establishment clause, and completely remove the free exercise clause. The modern left has as its heroes Marx and Engels who cliam “Religion is the opiate of the people.” The modern left wishes to continue the war aginst the unborn. Its a fact. Find me a pro-life Democrat in the House or Senate. The issue of abortion is not a religious issue. It is a human rights issue. More than 40 million infants have been deprived of their lives outside of due process. And who is standing in the way of the butchers? The conservatives who introduce and support legislation that restricts abortion. Who stands in the way of the liberators? The left wing liberals in Congress and the Senate who push for legisaltion allowing abortion on demand without restriction. Yes it is the left wing liberals who are opposed to the defense of life.

 

[Texas_Roofer]

In my opinion a person can not be considered “Conservative” and commit/support/affiliate in any way with abortions.

you again just ruled out most of who you ruled in, I know you do not understand however the facts are those you are against are those you say you are for.

I do not vote blindly Republican, but I will not stand by while the most Liberal of Democrats take over all 3 branches of the Government.

even if that is the vote? Are you aware from 2001-2007 the republicans were in charge? AND ABORTION STAYED LEGAL

Hyde was quoting Sheen there in a speech he had given.

Christian(not Catholic yet), Conservative(Really they go hand in hand to me), Patriot, Republican

since your definitions of “conservative” fit all and none then christain Patriots are your top category so you may vote liberal

That is how I vote, in that order, the democratic party is not what it was. Even my conservative strict democratic grandmother will tell you that. I do not like everything Bush(not a Conservative) did, no, but at least he did not sit in office and stare at the walls like Clinton did.

there you go again

There is a Conservative movement stirring, its flames are being fanned by the Liberal movement. To get on board with the Liberals would be to accept gay marriage and abortion at will. To get on board with the Conservatives would be to bring this country back to its roots, small government, less taxes, strong moral values.

Did government shrink during republican control?

Were actual taxes lowered during republican control?

( you may need your rose colored glass)

 

[bbarrick8383]

you again just ruled out most of who you ruled in, I know you do not understand however the facts are those you are against are those you say you are for. even if that is the vote?

I’m sorry, but you must have misunderstood. If this post does not help then I am sorry, but you are lost and without someone else to try and explain it to you then I can not be of any more help to you.

Are you aware from 2001-2007 the republicans were in charge? AND ABORTION STAYED LEGAL since your definitions of “conservative” fit all and none then christain Patriots are your top category so you may vote liberal there you go again

So you are calling Christian Patriots, Liberals? I’m sorry, but I do not know any Christians or Patriots who support Gay Marriage, much less want to walk around the mall telling their children to ignore the two kissing guys or girls. Nor do they want anyone to have the ability to abort at will. Liberals have taken over the Democratic party and ruined it, I mean come on, I support animal rights but wanting human milk to be used in ice cream is a bit ridiculous. So, now, the Conservatives must take over the Republican party. To say well, the republican party this or that is fine, but we are not concerned with what they have done but with what they will do. If someone goes into office and does not fight against Abortion, then they are out…that’s it…no more 30 years in office like Biden has done. Politicians have been selling the American People used lemons for a long time now, and they have been good at it.

Did government shrink during republican control?

Were actual taxes lowered during republican control?

Did not mention Republicans, but most of the conservatives I support are in the Republican party. It is just unfortunate that there are not enough of them in the major political arena. And if Pelosi, Dodd and Frank have their way tomorrow we as Christians, Pro-Lifers, or Conservatives however you want to look at it are done for. At least in this countries current geographical state.

( you may need your rose colored glass)

LOL, your profile lists you as Catholic. But, you defend Liberals as though you are one. But, how can that be, to be Catholic is to be completely against Abortion or Gay Marriage. I understand Catholicism calls us to help the poor and needy. It’s just that for a long time, people have thought the best way to do that was through Government. And that is just not the case.

If I put on rose colored glasses, does that not mean that I see life in such a perfect way that I would miss the heinous crimes committed such as Abortion, or that moral issues do not affect this country? I’m sorry, but you need to remove your rose colored glasses my friend.

 

[Texas_Roofer]

I’m sorry, but you must have misunderstood. If this post does not help then I am sorry, but you are lost and without someone else to try and explain it to you then I can not be of any more help to you.

So you are calling Christian Patriots, Liberals? I’m sorry, but I do not know any Christians or Patriots who support Gay Marriage, much less want to walk around the mall telling their children to ignore the two kissing guys or girls. Nor do they want anyone to have the ability to abort at will. Liberals have taken over the Democratic party and ruined it, I mean come on, I support animal rights but wanting human milk to be used in ice cream is a bit ridiculous. So, now, the Conservatives must take over the Republican party. To say well, the republican party this or that is fine, but we are not concerned with what they have done but with what they will do. If someone goes into office and does not fight against Abortion, then they are out…that’s it…no more 30 years in office like Biden has done. Politicians have been selling the American People used lemons for a long time now, and they have been good at it.

Did not mention Republicans, but most of the conservatives I support are in the Republican party. It is just unfortunate that there are not enough of them in the major political arena. And if Pelosi, Dodd and Frank have their way tomorrow we as Christians, Pro-Lifers, or Conservatives however you want to look at it are done for. At least in this countries current geographical state.

LOL, your profile lists you as Catholic. But, you defend Liberals as though you are one. But, how can that be, to be Catholic is to be completely against Abortion or Gay Marriage. I understand Catholicism calls us to help the poor and needy. It’s just that for a long time, people have thought the best way to do that was through Government. And that is just not the case.

If I put on rose colored glasses, does that not mean that I see life in such a perfect way that I would miss the heinous crimes committed such as Abortion, or that moral issues do not affect this country? I’m sorry, but you need to remove your rose colored glasses my friend.

Again how do you know any liberal supports the causes you claim they support?

 

[Sean_Boyle]

Are you aware from 2001-2007 the republicans were in charge? AND ABORTION STAYED LEGAL

Are you aware of a horrible act of violience against humanity called Partial Birth Abortion that was banned in that period!!! And the addition of two supreme court justices that could reverse these crimes against humanity from the same period!!!

One party can’t change the entire country to live according to God’s Will while the other convinces the country to do what make them happy at the moment.

You either support abortion by voting for the party who seeks to protect it as a right or your for keeping God’s Will by voting for the party that is against abortion in their platform, your decision with free will and all.

 

[bilop]

I’d like to hear a politician say this.

“While I as a Christian believe we have an obligation to help the poor, I realized that not all Americans believe this. It would be wrong for me to impose my religious beliefs on other Americans by using taxpayer money to help the poor.”

God Bless

 

[Michael96]

I am just asking whether we should put it onto other people to believe what we do.

I think democracy is the best way; Catholic theocracies in the past have been dismal failures; bringing politics into the centre of the Church has only ever corrupted the Church.

We need to win hearts, minds and souls. And to my mind aggressive/bullying tactics are postively the worst way to go.