Abortion, Deathpenalty, Intrinsic Value of Life?

[SoCalRC]

After all this time you’re just now realizing that I’ve been disagreeing with 2267?

No, I’m just making it clear. You are asserting that the Pope, aided and abetted by the college, has exceeded his authority and altered Church doctrine.

Surely you realize this is not so. I can’t take this comment seriously.

Then what other explanation is there? Remember, we are not talking about a just public remarks, or even multiple books. We are talking about an Encyclical, a Post-synodic apostilic exhortation, the Catechism, local Catechisms, and almost countless statements of collective affirmation from bishops world wide.

How is this different from the schism over the Pauline Mass?

Remember, you are not arguing that you disagree with the teaching and cannot ignore the absolute certainty of your moral conscience and follow it, you are arguing that the Church is in error.

 

[vern_humphrey]

This is disingenuous; I thought my explanation was clear enough.

He’s always disingenuous. That’s his stock-in-trade. He’s a master of the straw man, where he makes up an argument and attributes it to his opponent.

 

[Ender]

You are asserting that the Pope, aided and abetted by the college, has exceeded his authority and altered Church doctrine.

I am asserting that I disagree with JPII’s opinion. Since Church doctrine is not determined by a mere opinion, even of a pope, he did not alter doctrine, he did not exceed his authority, and I do not dissent from doctrine since the issue I dispute is not doctrine (understood as at least an ordinary teaching).

Remember, you are not arguing that you disagree with the teaching and cannot ignore the absolute certainty of your moral conscience and follow it, you are arguing that the Church is in error.

Since I don’t dispute what the Church teaches as doctrine I am not arguing that she is in error. I am absolutely arguing that I disagree with the teaching in 2267. I am also contending that this is not an ordinary teaching but a prudential one (as you have previously admitted) about which I am permitted to form my own opinion.

I really find these charges tedious. You focus all your efforts on portraying me as a dissenter so you don’t have to deal with the logic of my argument. If I’m wrong it should be simple to rebut me, after all, you’ve got the pope and all the bishops on your side. So, why haven’t you taken advantage of all the resources available to you to do that? Why not deal with the specifics of my position. I suspect you don’t because you can’t.

Ender