Abortion: For the good of the baby?

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Ask you dad that if he comes down with symptoms /maybe even a diagnosis that leads to an ending life of suffering…demensia, incontenence, alzheimers…forgetting… ask him when you should put him under. Then correlate this to an unborn baby… It’s playing God and we have been trying to redefine what God wants for us because it doesn’t fit our will. Shouldn’t we be doing what fits His Divine Will?
 
sancte_joseph said:
Me and my dad were having a little discussion. And he, like me, is catholic. So we know the Catholic view on abortion. Long story short…

He said that the only case he would think abortin is right is if it’s for the good of the baby. i.e. if the baby would come out mentally retarded, or comes out with something missing (arm, leg, etc)
Basicly if the baby would suffer after it was born.

How would yall respond to this???
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:eek: 😦

:gopray: :gopray2: :crossrc:
 
sancte_joseph said:
Me and my dad were having a little discussion. And he, like me, is catholic. So we know the Catholic view on abortion. Long story short…

He said that the only case he would think abortin is right is if it’s for the good of the baby. i.e. if the baby would come out mentally retarded, or comes out with something missing (arm, leg, etc)
Basicly if the baby would suffer after it was born.

How would yall respond to this???
Click to expand...
The issue here isn’t really abortion, it’s euthanasia. It is the latter that your father seems to support, not the former.

Life is life and is beyond measure. No amout of suffering can change that.

Ask your father:

“Would it have been ok to abort me if I was missing a finger?”

“Would it have been ok to abort me if I was missing a hand?”

“Would it have been ok to abort me if I was missing an arm?”

He will say no to every question because his love for you is beyond measure.

Remind him that if there is a developing child with down syndrome, there is someone who loves that child like he loves you. It’s cruel to take that love out of the world.
 
I have this same problem with my parents. They too are catholic. Before elections I tried to educate my parents on some of the currents presidents ideas and views. Well we sort of got into and argument.

My parents thing that a teen, an unwed mom, a poor family a family with “too many children” anyone who might have a sick child ect…should have an abortion. I was flabergasted.

No one has the right to take a childs life no mater the what. It is not up to us to decied when a child should die. We are required to protect life from conception to natural death. So it is never ok to abort for any reason.
 
no matter how the baby come out u should not do that cause if u wre aborted u may not like it so that wrong and god loves everyone and just because they came at diffrent so there are just the same
 
I have a relative who has downs and he’s the glue of our family and someone we all get along with! He’ll be turning 50 y/o soon. He’s our saint. We also had a relative from Germany tell me a chilling happening in Nazi Germany. One of his cousins had Downs and was taken away to be exterminated. My relatives father protested and the Nazi’s picked him up and he was gone from the village for a week and returned and said no more about it!! He had been terrorized! I don’t want this for our humanity now and we really need to watch the selective eugenics that has become a part of people’s though processes! Abortion is a slippery slope and never justified
What is good is that you have asked the question and not blindly believed what you heard! Thanks for listening!!!
 
I find some of the arguments or positions here…interesting, yet “disconcerting”… but more than anything else…very selfish and shallow.

Oooooh, if the child is not perfect or genetically what we desired, abort the little cretin…god forbid we “superior examples of humanity” should be saddled with a less than perfect speciment of humanity that will automatically qualify for Harvard or Yale…or its not blonde and stunning, with a really great and sexual body… or whatever the semi-cloners want or advocate. People are starting to sound like the Nazi’s who were really big on eugenics and all that nonsense…

I’m 58, and never had kids of my own…raised some others though, and while I have a different perspective than some… I think in retrospect…I would have gladly accepted a “less than perfect” child…if God deigned it to be… But it was not to be, and I sincerely have a problem with people who worry about the small things and refuse to have anything less than “genetic perfection”…
 
Anyone who imagines that he or she can outdistance God in passing a yes or no on the life of another - unborn or elderly or ill or injured - is imagining that he or she is more than God in love, wisdom, strength, compassion, justice and grace.

I’m grateful to be at the mercy of God -
not at the mercy of creation.

:bighanky:
 
There are a few cases when it’s good for the baby, though. There are a few diseases (not many) where a child will be born, live in agonizing pain for a couple years, and then die. Luckily, there are strong selection pressures against diseases like this, since the kids aren’t having kids, so they’re rare and getting rarer. But I don’t think it is moral or fair in the least to make a mother have to have the baby and skip work for a couple of years just to keep the child alive a little longer knowing full well it’ll die in a year regardless of what anyone can do.

It’s just common sense that someone shouldn’t be forced to throw years and thousands of dollars (both hospital bills and opportunity cost) on a child guaranteed to die extremely early, when such an act makes it so much more difficult to raise a child that will LIVE, and appreciate their life.
 
flaming_hito said:
There are a few cases when it’s good for the baby, though. There are a few diseases (not many) where a child will be born, live in agonizing pain for a couple years, and then die. Luckily, there are strong selection pressures against diseases like this, since the kids aren’t having kids, so they’re rare and getting rarer. But I don’t think it is moral or fair in the least to make a mother have to have the baby and skip work for a couple of years just to keep the child alive a little longer knowing full well it’ll die in a year regardless of what anyone can do.

It’s just common sense that someone shouldn’t be forced to throw years and thousands of dollars (both hospital bills and opportunity cost) on a child guaranteed to die extremely early, when such an act makes it so much more difficult to raise a child that will LIVE, and appreciate their life.
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**It’s difficult to imagine what you’re using for your notions of medical certainty. "The doctor says … " has been insufficient guidance for many generations and is disproved time and again. To step in and take action that is contrary to God’s plan is never acceptable. **
**There are parents (I know some) who say they never knew what selfless living and giving was until they had an disabled child. ****To eliminate such children (or babies or adults) is to decide that one is capable of out-thinking the wisdom of God. ****That can’t be done. **
 
sancte_joseph said:
Me and my dad were having a little discussion. And he, like me, is catholic. So we know the Catholic view on abortion. Long story short…

He said that the only case he would think abortin is right is if it’s for the good of the baby. i.e. if the baby would come out mentally retarded, or comes out with something missing (arm, leg, etc)
Basicly if the baby would suffer after it was born.

How would yall respond to this???
Click to expand...
Ask him how he feels about Euthanasia. Depending on his answer, inform him of the Church’s position on Euthanasia.
 
After reading this post I’m brought back to my research paper that I wrote last semester on this kind of issue. The position your father argues is very similar to something that Peter Singer writes in his Practical Ethics (I won’t quote it here because it expresses the same opinion, and I don’t have the text in front of me.)
The problem with this line of reasoning is that people tend to devalue the human person in order to value other things (since Peter Singer’s position would be to say that your father is practicing utility with creation, keep the best and throw out the rest.) I’m oversimplifying just a bit but I hope you all get the point.
We must see the human person as something special because humans have inherent worth because only humans can use reason and recognize their own existence (and also have the potential to gain these qualities.) Other beings cannot have these qualities so this doesn’t mean we can degrade them, but we can never privilege their status above the human (that’s the next step after the argument presented by your father.)
When we see this point we can also point to the scriptures in Genesis which show the inherent connection between God and humanity. Both points help each other out.
So my basic point is to watch out for the utility argument and show where it leads. I hope this helps.

Sincerely,

afitz211
 
I was supposed to be aborted because it wouldn’t be easy to take care of me and it’d be a lot of money, you get the idea. The abortion was my grandmother’s idea. My mother refused to, though she’s not Catholic. I do suffer every day, and my quality of life is okay. I may have had depression every now and then and wished I had a “real” family. You know… one that cares and loves me, no matter what. All they see is a broken thing they can’t get any use out of. So I’m an outcast among family. Only my youngest sister chats with me.

Believe me, despite all this, abortion and euthanasia are NOT the answer. Love is. People need to learn to stop being cowards and going for everything that’s easy. We should never forget that Jesus surprises us…and often. He’ll use the weakest, the most wretched, you name it. I don’t feel special or anything, but its comforting to know that Jesus usually has big plans for people like me. I’m sure he’s calling me to be a nun. The difficult part is finding a convent or Order that’ll take me. I’m still trying, doggone it.

The rest of the time, I’m happy. Happy beyond belief. Happy because Jesus made me, happy because He loves me, happy because studying and learning is so much fun. I do understand where your father comes from, but its still a dangerous view for him to have. Its amazing people can think of abortion and euthanasia even when Jesus said to love all and your enemies, and not to kill is in the Ten Commandments.
 
Seremina - Thank you for your post. Do be aware that, because you accept your suffering, your prayers for others have a very high value. I am glad you are here with us.
 
Joe_Kelley said:
Seremina - Thank you for your post. Do be aware that, because you accept your suffering, your prayers for others have a very high value. I am glad you are here with us.
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Seremina, I SECOND what Joe has said…!!~!! 👍 👍 👍

I will remember you in my thoughts and prayers!
 
Aww. Joe, Rob, thank you. No one’s ever said they were glad I was here with them, before. Like I said, Jesus surprises us.

Thank you both for your prayers and your kindness. God bless! 👍
 
Aborting for the good of the baby?
it would then follow that we euthanize for the “good of the person”. The thinking is completely wrong and has to be re-directed from the start. Dont’ even go down that path, because it is filled with rationalizations.

As for children born with defects, this man’s life tells us something very different. He has no arms or legs, is a committed Christian and thanks God for his life, disabled as it is.

uk.youtube.com/watch?v=v4uG2kSdd-4

Julie
 
I can’t help but wonder if 60 years ago…if “genetic testing” were available…would Steven Hawking’s parents have elected to have an abortion…and that act of selfishness would have deprived the world of one of the greatest physicists ever in the history of the planet.
 
My tiny 14 year old neice was given an excessive amount of alcohol by her 19 year old cousin after which he had sex with her. All advice from the medical professions have been to abort the baby. She can’t really remember any of the details clearly and he is currently in the process of going to court for having sex with a minor.

She is having her baby with the support from the majority of our extremely large family, because she cannot stand the idea of killing her baby. I’m interested to know what you would suggest she do in this instance?
 
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