Abortion in OT

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Marriage is a covenant. There are blessings that go with being faithful to a covenant and woes that go with being unfaithful. The priest was merely calling down the woes that would come assuming the woman had broke the covenant.
 
So then you have a problem with miscarraige in general, and you routinely go online to protest miscarraiges? What about volcano eruptions?

IF the potion “worked” and the woman developed a condition in which the fetus died, then that would be no different than your death will one day (hopefully far away!) be… God calls us home when He wills. So what is your issue?
Because if the potion is actually harmless, and the Biblical author knew this, he was being deliberately misleading. If he thought the potion was harmful but was wrong, he was still fully expecting miscarriages to happen as a result of this punishment. Therefore, we have a situation in which the Bible commands a procedure with the expected result of a miscarriage; if we were presented with this situation in any literature but the bible, we would easily conclude that constitutes support for abortion.

So, our options are:
  1. The bible is sometimes deliberately untruthful
  2. The bible sometimes commands priests to be untruthful
  3. The bible sometimes allows abortions
 
-]Marriage is a covenant. There are blessings that go with being faithful to a covenant and woes that go with being unfaithful. The priest was merely calling down the woes that would come assuming the woman had broke the covenant./-]
Induced miscarriage is an appropriate punishment for marital infidelity.
I do not believe that is the case.
 
Because if the potion is actually harmless, and the Biblical author knew this, he was being deliberately misleading. If he thought the potion was harmful but was wrong, he was still fully expecting miscarriages to happen as a result of this punishment. Therefore, we have a situation in which the Bible commands a procedure with the expected result of a miscarriage; if we were presented with this situation in any literature but the bible, we would easily conclude that constitutes support for abortion.

So, our options are:
  1. The bible is sometimes deliberately untruthful
  2. The bible sometimes commands priests to be untruthful
  3. The bible sometimes allows abortions
Do you have a new argument or are you going to repeat what you already said ad infinitum?

How about this: the priest knew the concoction was harmless. So did the woman, the man, and all involved. Ink, dust, and water has never harmed anybody and it’s unreasonable to believe that anyone ever believed it was the “potion itself”. In fact, even the scripture makes clear that it is a CURSE from God which supposedly does the action in the event that the woman is guilty.

Ergo, the priest administers a concoction that he knows is harmless, asks God to administer punishment if the woman is guilty, and then leaves it to God to decide whether the woman suffers such a fate. 🤷 Who knows, maybe prolapsed uterii DID happen as a result from time to time.

At any rate, the priest fully expects that if God wants He will take action, but the ACTION of the priest cannot possibly be described as abortion because IF the woman becomes ill and miscarries, the action is by God, who has all right to human life and ending it at any time for any reason. There is never a point at the process where the priest believes his actions (apart from God) will lead to any sort of consequence on the woman.

Now, as I originally asked, do you have some new question, or are you going to restate the same deficient logical syllogism (devoid of a comprehensive set of possibilities)?
 
Do you have a new argument or are you going to repeat what you already said ad infinitum?

How about this: the priest knew the concoction was harmless. So did the woman, the man, and all involved. Ink, dust, and water has never harmed anybody and it’s unreasonable to believe that anyone ever believed it was the “potion itself”. In fact, even the scripture makes clear that it is a CURSE from God which supposedly does the action in the event that the woman is guilty.

Ergo, the priest administers a concoction that he knows is harmless, asks God to administer punishment if the woman is guilty, and then leaves it to God to decide whether the woman suffers such a fate. 🤷 Who knows, maybe prolapsed uterii DID happen as a result from time to time.

At any rate, the priest fully expects that if God wants He will take action, but the ACTION of the priest cannot possibly be described as abortion because IF the woman becomes ill and miscarries, the action is by God, who has all right to human life and ending it at any time for any reason. There is never a point at the process where the priest believes his actions (apart from God) will lead to any sort of consequence on the woman.

Now, as I originally asked, do you have some new question, or are you going to restate the same deficient logical syllogism (devoid of a comprehensive set of possibilities)?
I suppose it could be that all parties simply believed that God would do all the punishing, but then why concoct such a silly ceremony in the first place? Someone at some point thought it was important that this whole procedure be carried out, but why? Public humiliation or a display of clerical power?
 
I suppose it could be that all parties simply believed that God would do all the punishing, but then why concoct such a silly ceremony in the first place? Someone at some point thought it was important that this whole procedure be carried out, but why? Public humiliation or a display of clerical power?
Or sympathetic magic… so that when nothing happened the woman who, if we look at current practices in the middle east, most likely WAS innocent, could go home and her husband could be placated by the fact that he had seen the ceremony and that it was in God’s hands.

I don’t think it’s unreasonable to state that people need tangible events to crystalize immaterial reality and concepts. To fault judeo-christian traditions for realizing and participating in that is… well… silly.
 
Or sympathetic magic… so that when nothing happened the woman who, if we look at current practices in the middle east, most likely WAS innocent, could go home and her husband could be placated by the fact that he had seen the ceremony and that it was in God’s hands.
So you’re saying that everyone knew the ceremony was pointless except the upset husbands?
 
So you’re saying that everyone knew the ceremony was pointless except the upset husbands?
I guess it doesn’t matter. There is still the implication that a miscarriage is an appropriate punishment for an unfaithful wife.
 
I guess it doesn’t matter. There is still the implication that a miscarriage is an appropriate punishment for an unfaithful wife.
chuckle Um… it’s God we’re talking about here, right?

This seems to be coming up in a LOT of threads… that there is some conception that God does not allow people to die, or that He does not actively kill them. gasp some people say, that would make God a murderer

But the problem with that logic is that God owns the right to every human life in the world. Every single one. God can kill anyone at any time and for any reason (or no reason at all) and it is never unjust that He should do so. I don’t know why the silly notion that somehow we miniscule beings have some claim to a right over God, but the reality is that everyone who has ever lived has died in accordance with God’s will. The best I can do when presented with the pouty “God killed people!” argument is yawn… because it’s nothing special… Christianity is not a “comfortable” religion, and it certainly doesn’t assert that you, me, or all the babies in existance will not die some day…
 
chuckle Um… it’s God we’re talking about here, right?

This seems to be coming up in a LOT of threads… that there is some conception that God does not allow people to die, or that He does not actively kill them. gasp some people say, that would make God a murderer

But the problem with that logic is that God owns the right to every human life in the world. Every single one. God can kill anyone at any time and for any reason (or no reason at all) and it is never unjust that He should do so. I don’t know why the silly notion that somehow we miniscule beings have some claim to a right over God, but the reality is that everyone who has ever lived has died in accordance with God’s will. The best I can do when presented with the pouty “God killed people!” argument is yawn… because it’s nothing special… Christianity is not a “comfortable” religion, and it certainly doesn’t assert that you, me, or all the babies in existance will not die some day…
Well I guess we know which side of the Euthyphro dilemma you come down on.
 
Well I guess we know which side of the Euthyphro dilemma you come down on.
That would seem to be defined in the very position of the Catholic Church, as a Divine Command Deontological system of ethics is our teaching and Divine Command theory posits that morality itself is authored by God…

However, I fail to see where the reference has anything to do with the discussion at hand, because the point of what I’m saying is that all life belongs to God, and whichever side one takes of the Euthyphro dilemma God is still free to act on His belongings as He so chooses…🤷

Perhaps you meant to apply this logic to some other aspect of the story (such as the priest, the husband, or the wife) and could offer some clarification as to why you would bring up this commonly discussed ethics dilemma…?
 
Perhaps you meant to apply this logic to some other aspect of the story (such as the priest, the husband, or the wife) and could offer some clarification as to why you would bring up this commonly discussed ethics dilemma…?
No, it is quite clear. You have taken the position that if God wanted to abort a baby, we cannot question or know the motives. I believe there is no room for discussion left.
 
No, it is quite clear. You have taken the position that if God wanted to abort a baby, we cannot question or know the motives. I believe there is no room for discussion left.
🤷 We can question the motives and know them all we like, but it doesn’t make any difference in the question of “is it just”. Just like we might be offended if we found out that Monet piled some of his art in his fireplace and roasted marshmellows over it as it burned, we would not declare that Monet was unjust or committed a crime in so doing… the same applies to God: He is the owner of our lives, and we are His creation.
 
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