Abortion is not the problem, but a manifestation of it

[FaithBuild18]

It is beyond all measures of distinct clarity, that I have come to recognize that we tend to overlook the underlying principles surrounding contemporary political issues. We are so focused on the issue, as merely an issue, whose existence is independent of everything else, whose cause is irrelevant so long as we vote for or against the issue, that we have become blind to the greatest truth ever prophesied. We go out into the world, chanting “no more abortions,” but then we persist in fostering the demands of our culture, enabling our culture to facilitate such grave acts of evil.

Amen we side with the Church on the issues, because She knows the truth. But we ignore Her philosophy, Her cause, Her reason. Abortion is not the bad tree that bears bad fruit, rather it is the bad fruit bore by the bad tree. What good is its defilement, if we praise its cause, and render its origins to be harmless? What good is its rejection, if we stimulate its demand? It is our insolence, our insubordination, our pride, our refusal to submit to truth and morality, our total rejection of authority, that leads to terrible acts such as abortion. Until man again submits to God, instead of himself, and woman again submits to man, instead of herself, intrinsically evil acts will gain prominence under the guise of freedom and liberty. Do not feed the fires of hell; reject those things which are evil, embrace only what is good. Tear yourself apart from the present age; exist only in the age of God. Listen not to what modernity says is true, but suspend belief, for even though we may not see or feel what is around us, we know it is there.

 

[JRKH]

Well said. Too Too often we do this. We treat the symptom and miss the root cause…

Peace
James

 

[Crescentinus]

Indeed.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

There are always reasons why people do certain action. An environment that allows them to think that one reaction to a situation is possible and another is not. The actions themselves can still be judged right or wrong, sinful or not. However, when we work to correct the environment that supports the decision to take sinful actions, we effect the actions.

We need to work on both “fronts”. Continue to point out the horror of abortion, as well as work to root up the bad tree that grows this fruit.

 

[Jonatello]

are you saying abortion is just the result of a prior act that is the true evil? is this prior act sex? are you saying that conceiving a bastard child is more evil than killing it?

 

[Jonatello]

Well said. Too Too often we do this. We treat the symptom and miss the root cause…

Peace
James

what is the root cause?

 

[SurlyMermaid]

Great thread. I agree. :hug1:

 

[Mrs_Sally]

are you saying abortion is just the result of a prior act that is the true evil? is this prior act sex? are you saying that conceiving a bastard child is more evil than killing it?

I don’t think that is what the OP is saying, and it isn’t what I was saying.

The root evil is the idea that life is disposable, that some lives are of a higher “quality” than others.

Implicit in that is the idea that I should be able to do whatever “feels good” with my life.

Also implicit is the idea that both parties to that sex act are not equally culpable for the consequences. He can walk away, and if she chooses not to get an abortion and walk away also, that’s her problem.

All of these are fed by a society that does not look out for each other. That says that I can do what I want, and also that any problems are my own to overcome, whatever the cause.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

This is a good post, but here’s a question: What do you think is the underlying cause of abortion, and how do we oppose it?

 

[JimG]

The bad tree is contraception. It has borne a host of bad fruit, from promiscuity to fatherless families to the disintegration of marriage to abortion. It will also bear the bad fruit of homosexual marriage. The bad tree will continue to bear bad fruit.

 

[Tigg]

What do you think is the underlying cause of abortion, and how do we oppose it?

It’s quite simple to me. We have forgotten that God is the Creator. He is the giver of life. He is omnipotent and sovereign. He loves and provides for His people who have been made in His image. Every fertile egg is the result of His “conception” with the unity of body and soul. Another living being with the potential to give Him eternal praise in everlasting glory.

The alternative to life is death. Every goodness, every blessing God wishes to extend to us, Satan would block with a diametric opposition. Using every means at his disposal, he would encourage corrupt governments and sin that would usurp His rights. He would encourage us to believe we are the masters of our own destiny which includes the right of a woman to choose to terminate the life within her.

It’s the same ole story - light vs darkness, good vs evil, diabolical vs holiness…

Kudos to the OP!

 

[Marc_Anthony]

It’s quite simple to me. We have forgotten that God is the Creator. He is the giver of life. He is omnipotent and sovereign. He loves and provides for His people who have been made in His image. Every fertile egg is the result of His “conception” with the unity of body and soul. Another living being with the potential to give Him eternal praise in everlasting glory.

The alternative to life is death. Every goodness, every blessing God wishes to extend to us, Satan would block with a diametric opposition. Using every means at his disposal, he would encourage corrupt governments and sin that would usurp His rights. He would encourage us to believe we are the masters of our own destiny which includes the right of a woman to choose to terminate the life within her.

It’s the same ole story - light vs darkness, good vs evil, diabolical vs holiness…

Kudos to the OP!

Well, sure. I agree, ultimately that’s how it goes back too. But it will take a long time-it may even NEVER happen-to bring the country’s attention back to God. We should try, of course. But in the meantime, we should still be trying to stop abortion directly, correct? Too many lives on the line not too.

 

[JRKH]

what is the root cause?

When I consider sin…It is much more about underlying faults and attitudes than about discrete actions. These underlying issues are often called the seven deadly sins…
Pride (vanity)
Lust (excessive sexual appetites)
Gluttony (over-indulgence)
Greed (avarice)
Sloth (laziness/idleness)
Wrath (anger)
**Envy **(jealousy)

I leave it to you to suggest which one of these - or which combination of these leads one to get an abortion…

Peace
James

 

[Mrs_Sally]

The bad tree is contraception. It has borne a host of bad fruit, from promiscuity to fatherless families to the disintegration of marriage to abortion. It will also bear the bad fruit of homosexual marriage. The bad tree will continue to bear bad fruit.

In line with HUMANAE VITAE. And behind that are the Deadly Sins that JRKH lists.

 

[timotheos]

Right on! You know, for all of the finger-pointing at Adam and Eve, there is no way the vast majority of us would give up this knowledge of good and evil inherited by all of us. Note that it is knowledge of, and not just knowledge about; and remember, knowledge in the Biblical sense implies a certain experience with it. Direct experience of evil – which leads us in the direction of our own desires and away from God – is in many cases addicting and infatuating. We misinterpret this desire to do evil as “freedom”.

I think abortion itself can be linked to it. Like every other sin too.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

Serious Question:

People are dying every single day because of abortion. What do you suggest we do about it?

 

[timotheos]

Serious Question:

People are dying every single day because of abortion. What do you suggest we do about it?

Serious answer: Death is with us, abortion or not. It’s the manner of death in abortion – homicide – that is the problem. Mortal sin against the fifth commandment. I suggest we pray, seriously pray, not simply to end abortion (physical death of victim) but especially to offer reparation for sin (eternal death of the perpetrator).

I take no delight in contemplating any soul in hell. It is SO terrifying to think of it.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

Serious answer: Death is with us, abortion or not. It’s the manner of death in abortion – homicide – that is the problem. Mortal sin against the fifth commandment. I suggest we pray, seriously pray, not simply to end abortion (physical death of victim) but especially to offer reparation for sin (eternal death of the perpetrator).

I take no delight in contemplating any soul in hell. It is SO terrifying to think of it.

So you think that all we should do to stop the homicides from occurring is pray?

 

[timotheos]

So you think that all we should do to stop the homicides from occurring is pray?

What else can change the human heart?

I think I know what you are saying – ‘if we prevent this crime from happening, the mortal sin will not be committed, and both a baby and a soul will be saved’. But in the majority of cases, consideration of abortion is the last big sin in a series of big sins. I have never been able to convince anyone of the reality of sin, who was not inclined to believe in it in the first place. Only the Holy Spirit can do this. I mean, really, only the Holy Spirit can.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

What else can change the human heart?

I think I know what you are saying – ‘if we prevent this crime from happening, the mortal sin will not be committed, and both a baby and a soul will be saved’. But in the majority of cases, consideration of abortion is the last big sin in a series of big sins. I have never been able to convince anyone of the reality of sin, who was not inclined to believe in it in the first place. Only the Holy Spirit can do this. I mean, really, only the Holy Spirit can.

You’re acting as if the only thing we can do to stop abortion is pray. But there ARE other things we can do. I can give you testimonies of people who have changed their minds on abortions due to silent protesters outside of abortion mills, speakers (I went from limited pro-choice in cases of rape to pro-life because of a speaker), people telling them about crisis pregnancy centers…I think the charity “40 Days for Life” has actually SUCCEEDED in shutting down several abortion clinics.

Not to mention we can vote, we can attend the pro-life rally in Washington D.C. if it we feel so inclined, and we can educate people of the facts…I know an agnostic girl who won’t go on the pill just because she knows of the harmful effects that the pill has on the body.

Is prayer ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY and VITAL to the pro-life movement? It might be the most important part. But doing nothing but pray to stop murder from being committed when there ARE things we can do is not the way to go.

I hate to go “Godwin’s Law” on you all, but imagine if you were in Nazi Germany when Jews were being taken away to death camps. Now imagine that you can speak out against the Nazis without getting in trouble. Now let’s continue to imagine that you know of people who have changed their minds about the Jews because of testimony from “pro-semites”, as we’ll call them.

Would prayer be the only thing you would do for your Jewish neighbor down the street? Or would you be out there trying to convince people that turning in the Jew is wrong because he’s a human being like everybody else? Because this is what we’re dealing with here…our neighbors. These babies are real. They’re being murdered. We have to take action besides prayer.

For a good example of integrating prayer and action when fighting against large scale homicide, check out St. Maximilian Kolbe. I’m sure you already know him. I see our position as no different than his.

No, wait, scratch that, I do. We’re in a MUCH better position because if we speak out for the people being murdered in our society we’re not in nearly the same amount of danger.

We can’t just stop everything but prayer. We need prayer AND action.