Abstinence Only Programs?

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What a sad indictment of your “Catholic” school.
Not enough information to draw that conclusion. If the poster’s school was a high school and the ‘contraception information’ provided was complete, including the lackluster ‘protection’ condoms actually provide in typical use and their utter inability to block the spiritual negative effects of fornication then it isn’t sad in my view, it’s just right. But the poster didn’t give us enough info to tell.
 
Not enough information to draw that conclusion. If the poster’s school was a high school and the ‘contraception information’ provided was complete, including the lackluster ‘protection’ condoms actually provide in typical use and their utter inability to block the spiritual negative effects of fornication then it isn’t sad in my view, it’s just right. But the poster didn’t give us enough info to tell.
Good point. There’s no reason contraception can’t be taught as an error in much the same way that Catholic students teach about other religions.

However, I think it is a logical fallacy to compare abstinence programs with contraceptive programs. One is aimed at teaching students to wait for sex. One is aimed at teaching students to avoid pregnancy. Since they have two different objectives, they can’t really be measured on the same result.
 
I stated that *reproduction *of plants, animals, and humans should be taught in biology class. We teach the other major bodily systems there-- respiration, circulation, etc-- and should teach reproduction as it pertains to science.
Ah I see. So basically public schools should not educate students at all on prevention/avoidance of pregnancy and STDs?
“Effectivness” is not relevant in any way.
Not relevant? This is about trying to protect teenagers from becoming pregnant or contracting dangerous diseases that could potentially kill them or ruin their life. Not relevant? 🤷
 
Considering that Christian teenagers fornicate at pretty much the same rate as non Christian teenagers, this whole discussion seems to be a case of taking the speck out of our neighbor’s eyes while ignoring the plank in our own.
What does this have to do with anything?
I just think that Christians should make sure that Christian teenagers aren’t having sex, and then make sure that non-Christian teenagers aren’t having sex. It damages Christian credibility.
 
Ah I see. So basically public schools should not educate students at all on prevention/avoidance of pregnancy and STDs?
Pathologies, sexual and otherwise, can be taught in biology class. How pregancy/reproduction occurs is also a biological fact.

Beyond that, human sexuality is not the realm of science.
Not relevant?
No, not relevant. You have posted a question in the Moral Theology section of a Catholic website. The “effectiveness” of contraception is irrelevant as it is an *intrinsic evil *and can never be taught, supported, or condoned in any way, shape or form. It is to be rejected completely.

As Catholics, we cannot support it in the public sphere any more than we can support abortion or any other moral evil.
This is about trying to protect teenagers from becoming pregnant or contracting dangerous diseases that could potentially kill them or ruin their life. Not relevant? 🤷
It isn’t about that at all.

It’s about proclaiming the Truth of Christ at all times.
 
Pathologies, sexual and otherwise, can be taught in biology class. How pregancy/reproduction occurs is also a biological fact.

Beyond that, human sexuality is not the realm of science.
Haha, ok, so as I said - schools should not educate students at all on prevention/avoidance of pregnancy and STDs. Correct?
No, not relevant. You have posted a question in the Moral Theology section of a Catholic website. The “effectiveness” of contraception is irrelevant as it is an *intrinsic evil *and can never be taught, supported, or condoned in any way, shape or form. It is to be rejected completely.
So allowing these numbers of STDs, teen pregnancies/abortions to grow is a better action than providing safe sex education in an attempt to decrease them?
It isn’t about that at all.
It’s about proclaiming the Truth of Christ at all times.
So now you are saying we are to teach the “Truth of Christ” in public schools??

I am so confused…
 
One more time I am surprised on how self professed Catholics choose to ignore the teachings of the Church in the illusory quest for an utilitarian good. A lot of Catholics still want to play moral theology and philosophy when they do not have a clue of what moral theology is about. Lesson 1- back to the basics: What is God’s plan for salvation in our lives?

The so called abstinence teaching is very effective if properly done. The only problem is that governments are not really interested in supporting such approach and in reality they tend to undermine it by supporting an opposite cultural system through financial funding and explicit approval. Only an idiot would expect that the abstinence only program would be highly effective when nothing else is supporting it. Only someone choosing to be blind would say that the abstinence programs yield more pregnancies and abortions while in reality is the sex infused culture and the false concept of safe sex are the real cause of more pregnancies and abortions.
 
Only someone choosing to be blind would say that the abstinence programs yield more pregnancies and abortions while in reality is the sex infused culture and the false concept of safe sex are the real cause of more pregnancies and abortions.
The evidence I’ve seen out there reveals that the abstinence only programs resulted in MORE teenage pregnancies/STDs/abortions than safe sex programs.

That’s why I made this thread. If this weren’t the case, and abstinence only programs worked just the same as safe sex programs, then of course, the answer would be abstinence only and this thread wouldn’t exist.
 
Haha, ok, so as I said - schools should not educate students at all on prevention/avoidance of pregnancy and STDs. Correct?
You create a false dichotomy.

We can teach biology. Sexuality falls into morality, and that falls under The Truth And Meaning of Human Sexuality.
So allowing these numbers of STDs, teen pregnancies/abortions to grow is a better action than providing safe sex education in an attempt to decrease them?
You again create a false dichotomy. Your premise is flawed.

What we can teach is the Truth. We cannot teach falsities in the name of some sort of utilitarian ethic. That would be a lie.
So now you are saying we are to teach the “Truth of Christ” in public schools?? I am so confused…
We, as Catholics, can only proclaim the Truth. We cannot *support *or *advocate *anything other than the Truth. Therefore, we cannot **support **the teaching of lies in the public schools or anywhere else. We must *advocate *for the teaching of the Truth or of nothing contrary to it. And, we must protect children from these false ideas to the best of our ability should the schools choose to disregard our advocacy of that which is True.

Again, see The Truth And Meaning Of Human Sexuality for the Church’s teaching. The parents are the primary educators of their children on this topic. The State cannot replace them, and we cannot advocate, support, or condone any attempts to do so.
 
You create a false dichotomy.

We can teach biology. Sexuality falls into morality, and that falls under The Truth And Meaning of Human Sexuality.

You again create a false dichotomy. Your premise is flawed.

What we can teach is the Truth. We cannot teach falsities in the name of some sort of utilitarian ethic. That would be a lie.

We, as Catholics, can only proclaim the Truth. We cannot *support *or *advocate *anything other than the Truth. Therefore, we cannot **support **the teaching of lies in the public schools or anywhere else. We must *advocate *for the teaching of the Truth or of nothing contrary to it. And, we must protect children from these false ideas to the best of our ability should the schools choose to disregard our advocacy of that which is True.

Again, see The Truth And Meaning Of Human Sexuality for the Church’s teaching. The parents are the primary educators of their children on this topic. The State cannot replace them, and we cannot advocate, support, or condone any attempts to do so.
I wish you would have answered my questions directly rather than claiming I’m making false dichotomies, but that’s ok. 🤷

I guess I’ve gathered that you would basically go with the 4th option on my poll.

Thanks for the contribution, God bless.
 
The evidence I’ve seen out there reveals that the abstinence only programs resulted in MORE teenage pregnancies/STDs/abortions than safe sex programs.

That’s why I made this thread. If this weren’t the case, and abstinence only programs worked just the same as safe sex programs, then of course, the answer would be abstinence only and this thread wouldn’t exist.
This is still ignoring the elephant hiding behind the grass leaf. In the business world an analysis like that would have gotten the program manager fired on the spot. Correlation does not mean cause and effect. If I have a patient with gangrene in his leg and I amputate it the patient still has a good chance to die because of the gangrene. However, if I overdose him on morphine he does not die of gangrene and he does not suffer but he still dies. That means that amputation is not as effective as morphine in preventing death by gangrene. Is my analysis correct or not?
 
So you think its better students walked out of school not knowing what a condom is?
It is *better *to know the Truth.

My comment regarding the sad state of the education at the Catholic school you mentioned is in reference to the way in which you explained what they taught you. Perhaps your rendition is not an accurate representation.

If the school presented contraception, abstinence, etc, as “choices” and the Church’s teaching as a *preference *or a *rule *or a *choice *rather than the Truth– then yes, your school did you a disservice as that is a shame.
 
So you think its better students walked out of school not knowing what a condom is?
Let me see? :hmmm:

The child is not told lies. He is not put closer to a near occasion of sin. He has not received information that is useless for his Christian life. :hmmm:
 
I wish you would have answered my questions directly rather than claiming I’m making false dichotomies, but that’s ok. 🤷
Your question, based on false dichotomies, had no answer.
I guess I’ve gathered that you would basically go with the 4th option on my poll.
I don’t believe any of your poll options accurately represent what Catholics are to believe and advocate on the matter.
 
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