No, the Roman collar is the sigh of the clerical state ( those in Holy Orders, and those Minor Orders who might be about)Is an (installed) acolyte to wear the roman collar during his liturgical duties? I know that he isn’t to wear it in every day life, but would it be proper for him to wear it while assisting at Mass? Is this a diocese-by-diocese thing?
Anyone can wear the Roman Collar. Within the context of the Mass it is not a sign of ordination (or pending ordination) – the stole is. Watch a Mass from Saint Peter’s in the Vatican – many boys and non-ordained men even in the choir wear the collar.Is an (installed) acolyte to wear the roman collar during his liturgical duties? I know that he isn’t to wear it in every day life, but would it be proper for him to wear it while assisting at Mass? Is this a diocese-by-diocese thing?
Seminarians and deacons routinely wear the roman collar, even in the USA.From a strictly personal point of view, I don’t think they should wear the Roman Collar until they’re ordained a priest. I’d say that up till then, in the situation previously described, they could wear a non-black priest shirt, but without the white collar in the middle (it’s hard to describe, but I think you know what I mean).
But like I said, that’s my personal opinion. In my diocese, seminarians beyond a certain level wear the Roman Collar at Masses (but only a couple ever dress like that in public-but that’s for another forum).
That is not true. The Roman collar is a sign of clerical status ( which is actually different from Ordination)Anyone can wear the Roman Collar. Within the context of the Mass it is not a sign of ordination (or pending ordination) – the stole is. Watch a Mass from Saint Peter’s in the Vatican – many boys and non-ordained men even in the choir wear the collar…
True, it does denote clerical status, and yes, it’s not something one can arrogate to oneself. But as to the last point about being specifically allowed, I think that conveys more of a formal process than is really necessary, as by this point it’s basically a matter of local custom. Take Rome, for instance, where it seems rather common for altar boys and choir members to wear the collar. It’s not as if every single one of them has sent a letter to Cdl. Ruini requesting the use of the collar during liturgical functions. Rather, it is the approved custom of the locality that they are able to do so. Customs require a certain amoung of toleration or approval to get rolling, but once that occurs it doesn’t require further *specific *permission for individuals or parishes to observe the practice.That is not true. The Roman collar is a sign of clerical status ( which is actually different from Ordination)
We have a Chaldean Sub-Deacon in our parish. He joined our Latin parish when he moved into the area, and there was not a Chaldean parish nearby. He is a cleric, and thus he wears the a Cassock with a Roman Collar when acting as a Reader (which he does). But, as a Sub-Deacon, he is not in Holy Orders.
Now a bishop may offer the collar to altar boys or men who emulate a clerical office, including choir, but they may not ‘just wear it’, the bishop must specifically allow it.
Absolutely anyone can wear a Roman collar during the Mass – altar boy, readers (hopefully male only), choir members, lay MCs, etc. The Roman collar is not a “sign of clerical status” except that people (particularly outside of Europe) equate it to the priesthood. And that’s the reason it is not typically worn by the laity during Mass in the USA. It’s never been a tradition to do so and doing it would cause confusion and anxiety if some males (particularly older, married ones) did.That is not true. The Roman collar is a sign of clerical status ( which is actually different from Ordination)
We have a Chaldean Sub-Deacon in our parish. He joined our Latin parish when he moved into the area, and there was not a Chaldean parish nearby. He is a cleric, and thus he wears the a Cassock with a Roman Collar when acting as a Reader (which he does). But, as a Sub-Deacon, he is not in Holy Orders.
Now a bishop may offer the collar to altar boys or men who emulate a clerical office, including choir, but they may not ‘just wear it’, the bishop must specifically allow it.
Quite true for the most part.True, it does denote clerical status, and yes, it’s not something one can arrogate to oneself. But as to the last point about being specifically allowed, I think that conveys more of a formal process than is really necessary, as by this point it’s basically a matter of local custom. Take Rome, for instance, where it seems rather common for altar boys and choir members to wear the collar. It’s not as if every single one of them has sent a letter to Cdl. Ruini requesting the use of the collar during liturgical functions. Rather, it is the approved custom of the locality that they are able to do so. Customs require a certain amoung of toleration or approval to get rolling, but once that occurs it doesn’t require further *specific *permission for individuals or parishes to observe the practice.
or a transitional OR permanent DeaconFrom a strictly personal point of view, I don’t think they should wear the Roman Collar until they’re ordained a priest…).
Your analysis really only reaches back 35 years to Ministeria Quaedam, which restricted clerical status to those in the remaining major orders. But when we talk about collars denoting clerical status, we’re reaching back through the far longer tradition of the Church with clerical status beginning at first tonsure. Throughout many centuries prior to our own, serving at the altar, singing in the choir, etc., were all clerical functions. If for various reasons these were not performed by actual clerics, it became customary for the laymen filling in to dress *like clerics *while they functioned in a clerical capacity. That’s why Roman, for instance, choir members wear cassocks and collars - because until the high Middle Ages singing in the choir was a clerical function (and thus women were barred from it) and the dress has continued in some locales long after the restriction to clerics faded from view. This also shows why not just anyone can wear a Roman collar to Mass (as if Grandpa Jones in the last pew could waltz on in with a clerical shirt and collar!) - not everyone is functioning in a clerical capacity.Absolutely anyone can wear a Roman collar during the Mass – altar boy, readers (hopefully male only), choir members, lay MCs, etc. The Roman collar is not a “sign of clerical status” except that people (particularly outside of Europe) equate it to the priesthood. And that’s the reason it is not typically worn by the laity during Mass in the USA. It’s never been a tradition to do so and doing it would cause confusion and anxiety if some males (particularly older, married ones) did.
The stole is the garment of the Mass that defines a priest or deacon. So while it’s against secular law to impersonate clergy, I ask that you please produce a Church document that prohibits males from wearing the Roman collar during the Mass without their bishop’s specific approval.