Adam and Eve

[Katie1723]

Please excuse if this has been addressed before, but I was wondering if someone can help. My son (32) came to me with a question. He thinks there was someone before Eve. In Genesis 1, there is the story of creation. Then again in Genesis 2. He says “to the casual observer, it would appear that man was created twice. I think God created a woman before Eve.(called Lilith). What do you think Mom??” I said I don’t believe that. And the arguement ensued. Long and short: I am not Bible literate. I grew up in the 60’s and the good old Baltimore catechism. We followed things because that’s what we were taught. We took a lot on faith.And for me, my faith is everything. I read the Bible but I don’t try to interpret it.I don’t try to figure out everything, or what everything “means”.That’s me. I wish I were a better Catholic. I can’t explain most of the Bible, nor “why” I believe what I believe, or why we as Catholics do what we do. But I am happy being Catholic and don’t want to be anything else.
So I guess what I am saying is, am I missing something as far as creation, or is my son just being a royal pain??

Kathy

 

[CWBetts]

Please excuse if this has been addressed before, but I was wondering if someone can help. My son (32) came to me with a question. He thinks there was someone before Eve. In Genesis 1, there is the story of creation. Then again in Genesis 2. He says “to the casual observer, it would appear that man was created twice. I think God created a woman before Eve.(called Lilith). What do you think Mom??” I said I don’t believe that. And the arguement ensued. Long and short: I am not Bible literate. I grew up in the 60’s and the good old Baltimore catechism. We followed things because that’s what we were taught. We took a lot on faith.And for me, my faith is everything. I read the Bible but I don’t try to interpret it.I don’t try to figure out everything, or what everything “means”.That’s me. I wish I were a better Catholic. I can’t explain most of the Bible, nor “why” I believe what I believe, or why we as Catholics do what we do. But I am happy being Catholic and don’t want to be anything else.
So I guess what I am saying is, am I missing something as far as creation, or is my son just being a royal pain??

Kathy

Plain and simple the first two chapters of Genesis are two seprate accounts of creation from different sources. There was no seperate creation, but rather chapter one is the creation of the world, and chapter two is a detailed account of the creation of Humans

 

[Katie1723]

Plain and simple the first two chapters of Genesis are two seprate accounts of creation from different sources. There was no seperate creation, but rather chapter one is the creation of the world, and chapter two is a detailed account of the creation of Humans

My son thinks he is so much smarter than anyone else and by his own admission loves to debate and push buttons. I just feel like such a stupid Catholic at times.

I tried to tell him how lots of things are tols over and over from different perspectives. H didn’t want to hear any of that.

Thanks for your help Carl.

Kathy

 

[PJM]

=Katie1723;5073742]Please excuse if this has been addressed before, but I was wondering if someone can help. My son (32) came to me with a question. He thinks there was someone before Eve. In Genesis 1, there is the story of creation. Then again in Genesis 2. He says “to the casual observer, it would appear that man was created twice. I think God created a woman before Eve.(called Lilith). What do you think Mom??” I said I don’t believe that. And the arguement ensued. Long and short: I am not Bible literate. I grew up in the 60’s and the good old Baltimore catechism. We followed things because that’s what we were taught. We took a lot on faith.And for me, my faith is everything. I read the Bible but I don’t try to interpret it.I don’t try to figure out everything, or what everything “means”.That’s me. I wish I were a better Catholic. I can’t explain most of the Bible, nor “why” I believe what I believe, or why we as Catholics do what we do. But I am happy being Catholic and don’t want to be anything else.
So I guess what I am saying is, am I missing something as far as creation, or is my son just being a royal pain??Kathy

I have heard a similar line before, but never with a name attached.

Pope John Paul II wrote a beautiful document on human sexuality called Theology of the Body."

In it he breaks down verse by verse the most revelant parts of the book of Genesis, the “book of Creation.”

It’s very easy reading and can be GOOGLED.

He certainly makes no mention of eariler parents, nor does the BIBLE. So ask your son for evidence of his claim.

Hope this is helpful.

 

[Joe_Kelley]

As I recall Lilith is a Jewish legend; not a part of their belief. I think she is supposed to be a female demon that inhabits desolate desert regions. I think I first encountered her in one of C. S. Lewis’s books, probably the Narnia series.

 

[Cachonga]

While I am no longer Catholic, I am very interested in Scriptural truth. If your son had presented me with this argument (and rejected the clear presentation made by CWBetts), I would have asked for any Biblical proof that Lilith actually existed. That name cannot be found anywhere in Scripture. I would also point out that God doesn’t have a problem pointing out flaws in humans, even in those who are His friends (Abraham lied, David committed adultery and murder, Judah was guilty of incest (unknowingly, but he was prepared to kill his daughter-in-law for whoredom when he was the father), even Moses blew it with God and was not allowed to enter the promised land). If she is a demon, then she never was human (demons are fallen angels, not former humans). I would suggest that, since the name does not appear in Scripture, then the claim that she was Adams first wife is clearly untrue. I would also assert that any stories regarding her are nothing more than fiction (perhaps something that Stephen King would be familiar with). If he chooses to believe the stories of Lilith above the Scriptures, then he is in need of prayer (add in some fasting as well).

Hope this helps!

 

[David_Zampino]

As I recall Lilith is a Jewish legend; not a part of their belief. I think she is supposed to be a female demon that inhabits desolate desert regions. I think I first encountered her in one of C. S. Lewis’s books, probably the Narnia series.

She’s briefly mentioned in “The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe” as an ancestress of Jadis, the White Witch.

She is also present as a (very) negative figure in the Charles Williams novel “Descent Into Hell”.

She is a recurring figure in Jewish folklore and some forms of Jewish mysticism. The name seems to have a Hebrew root. There is one single reference in Scripture to the Hebrew word associated with Lilith in the book of Isaiah. However, there is nothing in Scripture connected in any way with Jewish mythology.

Blessings,

 

[CWBetts]

She’s briefly mentioned in “The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe” as an ancestress of Jadis, the White Witch.

She is also present as a (very) negative figure in the Charles Williams novel “Descent Into Hell”.

She is a recurring figure in Jewish folklore and some forms of Jewish mysticism. The name seems to have a Hebrew root. There is one single reference in Scripture to the Hebrew word associated with Lilith in the book of Isaiah. However, there is nothing in Scripture connected in any way with Jewish mythology.

Blessings,

I believe Lilith makes an appearance in Gostic texts…but I am not 100% sure.

 

[TrinityKnot]

My Bible is adjusted because I’m younger, so I can understand it. It told me that while Adam and Eve most likely existed, they weren’t the first humans. In fact, my bible also tells me the Adam and Eve story is symbolic, but there are still truths to it. Are my Bible’s side note’s right?

 

[buffalo]

Demonology

 

[Cachonga]

TrinityKnot:

My Bible is adjusted because I’m younger, so I can understand it. It told me that while Adam and Eve most likely existed, they weren’t the first humans. In fact, my bible also tells me the Adam and Eve story is symbolic, but there are still truths to it. Are my Bible’s side note’s right?

Scriptures speak clearly of Adam as a real person (1 Cor 15:22 “For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive”, 1 Tim 2:13-14 “For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in transgression.”, Jude 1:14 “And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, …”, as well as appearing in genealogies, etc…) I strongly urge you to dispose of this “bible” and get one that doesn’t create doubt in the written Word of God.

 

[Joe_Kelley]

She’s briefly mentioned in “The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe” as an ancestress of Jadis, the White Witch.

She is also present as a (very) negative figure in the Charles Williams novel “Descent Into Hell”.

She is a recurring figure in Jewish folklore and some forms of Jewish mysticism. The name seems to have a Hebrew root. There is one single reference in Scripture to the Hebrew word associated with Lilith in the book of Isaiah. However, there is nothing in Scripture connected in any way with Jewish mythology.

Blessings,

Thanks David. I regret it when I can post only some vague references, and am grateful when someone follows with the full story.

 

[TrinityKnot]

Scriptures speak clearly of Adam as a real person (1 Cor 15:22 “For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive”, 1 Tim 2:13-14 “For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in transgression.”, Jude 1:14 “And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, …”, as well as appearing in genealogies, etc…) I strongly urge you to dispose of this “bible” and get one that doesn’t create doubt in the written Word of God.

It also told me it wasn’t possible to create the world in 7 24 hour days. It was kind of confusing.

 

[Cachonga]

TrinityKnot:

It also told me it wasn’t possible to create the world in 7 24 hour days. It was kind of confusing.

So whoever made the notes is calling God a liar? Sadly, there are many people who doubt God’s Word and want to spread their unbelief, even within the pages of the God-breathed (see 2 Tim 3:16) Scriptures. What “bible” are you looking at that is attempting to cause doubt in God’s Word? Again, I strongly urge you to get rid of that “bible” and get one that recognizes the Scriptures for what they are - God-breathed!

 

[CWBetts]

It also told me it wasn’t possible to create the world in 7 24 hour days. It was kind of confusing.

The thing is, as Catholics we are free to believe in a longer creation, but Adam and Eve really were two real people. And given that God exists outside of time, the 24 hour day thing is really moot

 

[TrinityKnot]

So whoever made the notes is calling God a liar? Sadly, there are many people who doubt God’s Word and want to spread their unbelief, even within the pages of the God-breathed (see 2 Tim 3:16) Scriptures. What “bible” are you looking at that is attempting to cause doubt in God’s Word? Again, I strongly urge you to get rid of that “bible” and get one that recognizes the Scriptures for what they are - God-breathed!

It’s called BreakThrough! The Bible for Young Catholics

 

[Cachonga]

TrinityKnot:

It’s called BreakThrough! The Bible for Young Catholics

While I am no longer Catholic, and there might be some who would advise you not to listen to me, I will tell you with all the love for God that I have within me - God’s Scriptures are TRUE! Anyone who would deny God could create everything as outlined in Genesis (“evening and morning were the … day” means a literal 24 hour day), then they have NO BASIS to ASSERT that Mary was Immaculately Conceived or Bodily Assumed! While I deny these dogmas, I do believe God is more than capable of creating everything in only 6 24 hour days (remember, He rested on the 7th). I won’t recommend a Bible version (as a non-catholic, that might create a stir), but again, I strongly URGE you to get rid of this version and find one that does NOT create doubt in the written Word of God. At the very least, ignore the notes.

 

[CWBetts]

While I am no longer Catholic, and there might be some who would advise you not to listen to me, I will tell you with all the love for God that I have within me - God’s Scriptures are TRUE! Anyone who would deny God could create everything as outlined in Genesis (“evening and morning were the … day” means a literal 24 hour day), then they have NO BASIS to ASSERT that Mary was Immaculately Conceived or Bodily Assumed! While I deny these dogmas, I do believe God is more than capable of creating everything in only 6 24 hour days (remember, He rested on the 7th). I won’t recommend a Bible version (as a non-catholic, that might create a stir), but again, I strongly URGE you to get rid of this version and find one that does NOT create doubt in the written Word of God. At the very least, ignore the notes.

Can I assume that you left the Church because of reliance on Tradition and Magesterial Authority in addition to the Scriptures?

 

[catholicsuffer]

Please excuse if this has been addressed before, but I was wondering if someone can help. My son (32) came to me with a question. He thinks there was someone before Eve. In Genesis 1, there is the story of creation. Then again in Genesis 2. He says “to the casual observer, it would appear that man was created twice. I think God created a woman before Eve.(called Lilith). What do you think Mom??” I said I don’t believe that. And the arguement ensued. Long and short: I am not Bible literate. I grew up in the 60’s and the good old Baltimore catechism. We followed things because that’s what we were taught. We took a lot on faith.And for me, my faith is everything. I read the Bible but I don’t try to interpret it.I don’t try to figure out everything, or what everything “means”.That’s me. I wish I were a better Catholic. I can’t explain most of the Bible, nor “why” I believe what I believe, or why we as Catholics do what we do. But I am happy being Catholic and don’t want to be anything else.
So I guess what I am saying is, am I missing something as far as creation, or is my son just being a royal pain?? Kathy

Katie, it seems to me that you are guilty of not seeking. It is written seek and you shall find. Does this make you a lazy servant that Christ is speaking of? Any consolation, I am not much better. You then go on to say that you read the bible but do not interpret it and I say that is good because it is the Holy Spirit which guides you through Christ faithful bride. There is plenty of information out there in the Internet-land, I like newadvent.org myself and agapebiblestudy.com just to name a few. Being a none-catholic, it is easy for me to see those that are so easily mis-guided and led astray from the Catholic Church but however, it is your responsibility to seek and ask.

 

[Cachonga]

CWBetts:

Can I assume that you left the Church because of reliance on Tradition and Magesterial Authority in addition to the Scriptures?

I left after much prayer, fasting and seeking God because I saw contradictions with what the Church taught and what I saw in Scripture. Since this goes beyond the scope of this thread, I will end it here.