Adam born perfect?

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Corrgc69

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Greetings!

Was Adam created morally impeccable? Or is this an assumption or tradition that was passed down from the Early Church Fathers?

Is their scripture support that Adam and Eve were born “full of grace”?

Sincerely in Christ,

Corrgc
 
Adam and Eve were both special creations. God gave them certain gifts called preternatural:
Code: 
impassibility (freedom from pain)
immortality (freedom from death)
integrity (freedom from concupiscence, or disordered
desires)
infused knowledge (freedom from ignorance in matters
essential for happiness)
They did not have our ‘disordered desires.’ When they disobeyed God’s one command, they lost these gifts.
 
I remember reading " The Lost Books of the Bible " -
and the book had Adam and Eve - going along - as somewhat desperate -
and if I remember right, Adam even may have attempted suicide.

This book is a written history of what happened in the days of Adam and Eve
after they were cast out of the garden. Although considered to be pseudepigraphic by some,
it carries significant meaning and insight into events of that time.
It is doubtful that these writings could have survived all the many centuries
if there were no substance to them. This book is simply a version of an account
handed down by word of mouth, from generation to generation,
linking the time that the first human life was created to the time
when somebody finally decided to write it down.
This particular version is the work of unknown Egyptians.
 
Corrgc69 said:
Greetings!
Was Adam created morally impeccable? Or is this an assumption or tradition that was passed down from the Early Church Fathers?

Is their scripture support that Adam and Eve were born “full of grace”?
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Consider this. In Genesis 1 (0r 2) God says “let us make man in our own image and likeness.” If made in the image and likeness of God, how could Adam be anything but impeccable? After all, God is impeccable, right?
Shalom
 
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joeybaggz said:
If made in the image and likeness of God, how could Adam be anything but impeccable?
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Aren’t you made “in the image likeness of God”? Are you capable of sin? 🍿
edwest211 said:
God gave them certain gifts called preternatural
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I recognize you got this from the Catholic Answers site, but… I’m looking for a reference in the catechism (or elsewhere, in magisterial teaching) that says that Adam & Eve had infused knowledge. I’m not finding it. Got any citations or references for me?
 
They had no disordered desires, yet the temptation of eating from the forbidden tree still worked.

Didn’t they desire to be God? Isn’t that a disordered desire?

I’m puzzled!! 🤔
 
If he was born perfect morally impeccable, then he would not have consented to the temptation and sinned.
 
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He wasn’t born. Adam and Eve were ‘beguiled’ by an actual being who spoke. Both had free will. They could choose. God did not make obedient robots. Deception is from the devil.
 
Gorgias said:
Aren’t you made “in the image likeness of God”? Are you capable of sin? 🍿
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The OP’s question was, “Was Adam created morally impeccable?” Created, not made. Created by God in God’s image and likeness. Are you inferring by your quote that God created a morally deficient being? I thought God only created good, not sin, not evil. That Adam chose to be disobedient cannot be laid at God’s feet. God created man and woman to be like Him in all things but sin. Otherwise, God created evil.
Thought that was understood.
 
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joeybaggz said:
Are you inferring by your quote that God created a morally deficient being?
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No… just one who has free will, and therefore, is not impeccable.
joeybaggz said:
That Adam chose to be disobedient cannot be laid at God’s feet. God created man and woman to be like Him in all things but sin. Otherwise, God created evil.

Thought that was understood.
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I have no idea what you think you’ve proven. 🤔
 
Agathon said:
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Gorgias:
No… just one who has free will, and therefore, is not impeccable
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Now I have no idea what you’re trying to prove.
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LOL! @joeybaggz suggested that being made “in the image and likeness of God” meant being made ‘impeccable.’ That doesn’t make sense. After all, we’re all made in the image and likeness of God, and we’re all sinners.

@joeybaggz responded to me that my quote implies that “God created a morally deficient being”. That doesn’t hold up, either. We’re not “morally deficient”, we’re just given free will and asked to use it well. Having free will doesn’t mean “impeccable”; in fact, it means the opposite: it means we’re capable of sinning.
 
Blessings
ISAIAH 45/7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
He created the angels. Lucifer fell w the sin of PRIDE.
If God is the beginning of all. He had to create both. There was no other creator. If we don’t have evil, how would we know good was good.
In Christ’s Love
Tweedlealice
 
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

Dang. I knew this was a trick question.
 
Gorgias said:
We’re not “morally deficient”, we’re just given free will and asked to use it well. Having free will doesn’t mean “impeccable”; in fact, it means the opposite: it means we’re capable of sinning.
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So by that logic Jesus and Mary weren’t impeccable since they had free will.
 
Corrgc69 said:
Greetings!

Was Adam created morally impeccable? Or is this an assumption or tradition that was passed down from the Early Church Fathers?

Is their scripture support that Adam and Eve were born “full of grace”?

Sincerely in Christ,

Corrgc
Click to expand...
No, Adam was not created morally impeccable, meaning he has freewill. He was only created in the image (likeness) of God, not like God.

He (and Eve) was created “full of grace” in the sense that like Mary, they did not have original sin.

We can say the Mary is the second Eve except that she does not sin; or Jesus is the second Adam for that matter except that he does not sin, while both our fore-parents sinned.

God bless.
 
They were created without sin, of course, and without concupiscence, while possessing the freedom to sin. Their perfection was lacking, however, until they would choose not to sin. The principle found in the Catechism here applied to them as well as it does to us now:

1731 Freedom is the power, rooted in reason and will, to act or not to act, to do this or that, and so to perform deliberate actions on one’s own responsibility. By free will one shapes one’s own life. Human freedom is a force for growth and maturity in truth and goodness; it attains its perfection when directed toward God, our beatitude.

1732 As long as freedom has not bound itself definitively to its ultimate good which is God, there is the possibility of choosing between good and evil, and thus of growing in perfection or of failing and sinning. This freedom characterizes properly human acts. It is the basis of praise or blame, merit or reproach.
 
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Impeccable definition is — not capable of sinning or liable to sin; free from fault or blame : flawless.
Jesus was impeccable as he was the son of God. Mary in contrast was born a human with the disposition to do sin. There is no reference in the Bible that Mary was sinless. This is just an assumption by the Catholic church.
 
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