Adam & Eve

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Oh I am not saying it is scientific accurate but seeing that the author of Genesis two provided the names of rivers so to help give a rough location of where this paradise is we can find some of the rivers on a map.

skepticsannotatedbible.com/gen/2.html

From 2:11 to 2:14 are the name of the rivers. Looking on Google maps we can see where the rivers are. From there anyone curious could go looking for some kind of evidence of people living there.
And because you are a fundamentalist, you are stuck in those bible passages. ok 🤷
You are claiming Adam and Eve existed correct? Please provide evidence to show they did. It is far more likely we came from a small group of beings in East Africa than two beings.
Now you want to discuss science?
I am not a geneticist.
And I have no problem with human origin occurring wherever it did.
🤷

You are somewhat pre-judiced.
You assume that all religious people are fundamentalist Christians who take the bible with literalist scientism and as literalist history.
The Catholic Church does not think that way. I’m sorry you do. Fundamentalism is no fun.
 
Yea, you do believe in force. You can’t conceive of a loving God who allows free will choices and consequences.
So, yea, you believe in force as the source of morality rather than freedom.

And you did call God naive, directly.
So, I dunno where you are.
No sir I do not. Hard to conceive of a loving deity that didn’t show it in the books in the bible. Killing off all the world except eight people, check. Smiting someone for not getting his brother’s wife knocked up, check. Killing David’s child because of what David did, check. Near genocide of the Egyptian people via plagues, check. Ordering Saul to commit genocide and then being angry for not doing so, check. Destruction of Sodom for wanting to have relations with agender, asexual angels, check. In no way do I believe most if allof these things happened but by the account the character of God in the bible is in no way loving. Oh and before you bring up the rainbow, Yahweh only pledged not to flood the earth again because of the sacrifice Noah made, not because of feeling sorry.
 
Yes.

How do I know such a person existed (and exists)?

From first hand source. (rather present to the events…and knows him personally…)

God.
*
Divine Revelation.*

I understand you do not accept such - but we are discussing what in this forum?

Sacred Scripture.

Divine Revelation.

Theology.

The Catholic Faith.

Not something else.
Well then that would bring up the question of proving god exists but that isn’t in this thread.
 
No sir I do not. Hard to conceive of a loving deity that didn’t show it in the books in the bible. Killing off all the world except eight people, check. Smiting someone for not getting his brother’s wife knocked up, check. Killing David’s child because of what David did, check. Near genocide of the Egyptian people via plagues, check. Ordering Saul to commit genocide and then being angry for not doing so, check. Destruction of Sodom for wanting to have relations with agender, asexual angels, check. In no way do I believe most if allof these things happened but by the account the character of God in the bible is in no way loving. Oh and before you bring up the rainbow, Yahweh only pledged not to flood the earth again because of the sacrifice Noah made, not because of feeling sorry.
Right, all because you read the bible as a fundamentalist. And a very negative one at that. I am sorry for you.
 
And because you are a fundamentalist, you are stuck in those bible passages. ok 🤷

Now you want to discuss science?
I am not a geneticist.
And I have no problem with human origin occurring wherever it did.
🤷

You are somewhat pre-judiced.
You assume that all religious people are fundamentalist Christians who take the bible with literalist scientism and as literalist history.
The Catholic Church does not think that way. I’m sorry you do. Fundamentalism is no fun.
I am not a fundamentalist. Here try this. You are wanting to convince someone a story is true. So how would one do so. Well one way is to provide locations or details that have a physical place. George Washington chopped down a cherry tree would be an example because, I was taught this happened, it is reasonable. If you were trying to convince someone that Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter was real one would use Lincoln’s birthplace as well as people Lincoln was known to have spoken to so that would add credibility to the story.

That, to me, is what happened in these stories. In order for the people to believe there was some paradise they came from a physical location was mapped out by the orator. Yes the details can be changed, like the rivers no longer being there by way of deus ex machina but they are still enough truth for people to believe.
 
Right, all because you read the bible as a fundamentalist. And a very negative one at that. I am sorry for you.
Actually I was taught this in a Catholic school. I was also told that Jesus created birds out of clay and when he looked at someone cross they would drop dead.
 
Wow…don’t know if I missed it but did anyone actually answer the original question posed?
Why was Adam first then Eve from Adam? We all know who came first…but what is the significance of Male as the first human form and not female? As far as I can tell just as well as been female as male considering that God is so “wholly other” than us that gender type couldn’t possible play a significant role in some sort of reflection of a specific image of God. Is God gender orientated? Is God gender biased? Is there some other reason?
God grant you all the wisdom of knowing his truth…
 
Wow…don’t know if I missed it but did anyone actually answer the original question posed?
Why was Adam first then Eve from Adam? We all know who came first…but what is the significance of Male as the first human form and not female? As far as I can tell just as well as been female as male considering that God is so “wholly other” than us that gender type couldn’t possible play a significant role in some sort of reflection of a specific image of God. Is God gender orientated? Is God gender biased? Is there some other reason?
God grant you all the wisdom of knowing his truth…
Considering the story was told from a strongly patriarchal society we can see why male was first. They just believed that men were first before women. Yahweh, to me, is way more male bent and heavily biased to such. He was a war type deity after all.
 
Seems to me several in this post need to take a big deep breath and come back to reflecting together on seeking out truth and wisdom.
Have we all become too enamored of our own crafty remarks that we’ve forgotten we should all be seeking the same thing, not trying merely to spite the thing we believe isn’t the same as ours?
May God grant to those who lack it…peace.
 
I was also told that Jesus created birds out of clay and when he looked at someone cross they would drop dead.
Wow.

Sorry to hear that.

Seems you received unfortunately what was not Catholic formation in your education. That can lead to various misunderstandings to be sure.
 
Wow.

Sorry to hear that.

Seems you received unfortunately what was not Catholic formation in your education. That can lead to various misunderstandings to be sure.
I do believe that story is in the proto gospel of Thomas. Didn’t make it into the Catholic bible for some reason, maybe because it shows Jesus as a demi deity that has very human qualities. Oh and a sister was the one who related that story to us. I think around third grade.
 
Considering the story was told from a strongly patriarchal society we can see why male was first. They just believed that men were first before women. Yahweh, to me, is way more male bent and heavily biased to such. He was a war type deity after all.
Thank you for your rapid reply. That is a valid observation. I wonder though, are there any other views? If we lean too heavily on comparing Gods proclivities to mans then we are dangerously close to going back to Anthropomorphizing God like the earlier Greeks did and I believe that would be woefully incorrect.
 
Strong disagree. Mostly because the character of Adam isn’t historical. You are putting a huge amount of value on a character that, if the myth was remotely true, sentenced an entire species to suffering. Really think on this. If you had the power to create a creature out of dust and give it life exactly how naïve would that creature be? There was no instruction given and since the creature doesn’t know right from wrong nor really anything unless taught can you fault it for not obeying a command?

The author was writing down a tale handed down orally. Adam is just a name given to the protagonist to help the reader/audience identify with. There wasn’t any Adam that humans descended from, we know this because through genetics and from the theory of evolution we can find a common ancestor and we can see how that ancestor came about from other beings. Go back far enough and we have a strong idea of us coming out of the primordial ooze.
Unfortunately, you have repeated the exact opposite of Catholic teachings. You are not alone on CAF. You and the other readers are certainly welcomed to your own opinions.

I have done my best to give a better perspective. That is I all I can do.
 
Wow…don’t know if I missed it but did anyone actually answer the original question posed?
Why was Adam first then Eve from Adam? We all know who came first…but what is the significance of Male as the first human form and not female? As far as I can tell just as well as been female as male considering that God is so “wholly other” than us that gender type couldn’t possible play a significant role in some sort of reflection of a specific image of God. Is God gender orientated? Is God gender biased? Is there some other reason?
God grant you all the wisdom of knowing his truth…
Why was Adam first?

The simple answer is that God created him first. First is first in my neighborhood. Sorry about other neighborhoods who have trouble with the word first. I have done my best to point out that in the first three wonderful chapters of Sacred Scripture, Adam is created first. I can do no more than that.
 
Actually I was taught this in a Catholic school. I was also told that Jesus created birds out of clay and when he looked at someone cross they would drop dead.
Sorry that common sense is not used when we get older. I have done my best to point out the common sense found in the first three historical chapters in Genesis…
 
Well then that would bring up the question of proving god exists but that isn’t in this thread.
Common sense would say that humans being unique (difference between a beaver dam and the Hoover Dam) a divine super-natural Being had to be in existence. Unfortunately, common sense is not top drawer. I have done my best. That is all I can do.😃
 
Considering the story was told from a strongly patriarchal society we can see why male was first. They just believed that men were first before women. Yahweh, to me, is way more male bent and heavily biased to such. He was a war type deity after all.
Everyone is entitled to their opinions.
But your objection is not with Catholicism it is with a caricature of it that might be more like modern fundamentalism.
Given that, I’m not sure what you’re doing here if there is more fertile ground for your objections to Christianity. Perhaps a Calvinist blog.
Perhaps you are drawn to Catholicism. Great if that is the case.
 
I do believe that story is in the proto gospel of Thomas. Didn’t make it into the Catholic bible for some reason, maybe because it shows Jesus as a demi deity that has very human qualities.
Or just maybe, like the other hundred or so known “Gospels” that didn’t make the cut, it just didn’t reflect Christian faith and teaching. Some are far loopier than what you describe here.
Oh and a sister was the one who related that story to us. I think around third grade.
If we had to defend every silly thing that a sister or groups of sisters said over the last couple of centuries that hasd no basis in Catholic teaching . . .

AMDG
 
I do believe that story is in the proto gospel of Thomas. Didn’t make it into the Catholic bible for some reason, maybe because it shows Jesus as a demi deity that has very human qualities. Oh and a sister was the one who related that story to us. I think around third grade.
Yes was aware of the source…and yes why it is not Scripture (aside from it being dated long after).

Using heretical sources is not the way to teach the faith - though perhaps Sister heard it from somewhere and did not realize what she was doing. Thought it was a “cute story”…

She could have continued the teaching- that in order for a woman to go to heaven - she must become a man (male)!!!
 
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