Adding to the Sacrifice of the Mass

[JaneFrances]

In wonder and amazement I ponder the point that this sacrament, so central to Catholicism, is yet so not understood, not so much from lack of definition, but because by definition it is a mystery.

There is a lot to it that I think we simply cannot understand and to some extent we are all grasping at straws in trying to explain or even understand it.

We cannot add to Christ’s sacrifice, but we can join with it. Is that a fair encapsulation?

I think that is quite precise. The sacrifice of Christ was determined by God before Adam and Eve even stepped foot into the garden. Such is the mystery and majesty of our Creator. Thus, while Christ’s work on the Cross was an historical event following the Last Supper, we recognize the same Christ in both offerings. And today, we still discern the Body and Blood of this same Savior represented on every altar, among every nation, from the rising to the setting of the sun.

 

[sphilomena]

If I’m not mistaken, this discussion would not even be taking place without all the banal, non-sacred, misleading translations from ICEL. We need to look at the Latin we used to pray and the translations that were already in our missals. Lex orandi, lex credendi.

 

[jemfinch]

If I’m not mistaken, this discussion would not even be taking place without all the banal, non-sacred, misleading translations from ICEL. We need to look at the Latin we used to pray and the translations that were already in our missals. Lex orandi, lex credendi.

I looked at the Suscipiat from the Tridentine mass but didn’t see much that would indicate one way or the other what the term meant.

I can definitely understand the argument being made by the people here, but I’d like to have a better argument if I’m called on to teach other people about it someday.

Jeremy

 

[Truthstalker]

If I’m not mistaken, this discussion would not even be taking place without all the banal, non-sacred, misleading translations from ICEL. We need to look at the Latin we used to pray and the translations that were already in our missals. Lex orandi, lex credendi.

You lost me.

1, What relationship does translation have to to with the theories of what happens regarding the sacrifice of the Mass?
2. What is ICEL?
3. Is the “Latin we used to pray” a reference to the TLM? Are you saying it is better explained in Latin but not in English? The English Mass presumes those there understand what is going on. I wonder if a TLM is harder to follow for the uninitiated observer.
4. Lex orandi, lex credendi: why are you quoting this? For the benefit of the lurkers, please translate.

 

[jemfinch]

I looked at the Suscipiat from the Tridentine mass but didn’t see much that would indicate one way or the other what the term meant.

I can definitely understand the argument being made by the people here, but I’d like to have a better argument if I’m called on to teach other people about it someday.

This question (whether the Suscipiat refers to the bread and wine, or to Christ’s sacrifice in the Eucharist) came up in my mind again, so I did a little bit more research. Here’s a quote from the GIRM:
General Instruction of the Roman Missal:

1. Upon returning to the middle of the altar, the priest, facing the people and extending and then joining his hands, invites the people to pray, saying, Orate, fratres (Pray, brethren). The people rise and make their response: Suscipiat Dominus (May the Lord accept). Then the priest, with hands extended, says the prayer over the offerings. At the end the people make the acclamation, Amen.

It is sacrifices that have offerings, so it seems the suscipiat must be referring to the offering, that is, the bread and the wine that we offering to God, and not to the Christ whom we offer later in the mass.

Just thought I’d mention it.

Jeremy

 

[jemfinch]

In wonder and amazement I ponder the point that this sacrament, so central to Catholicism, is yet so not understood, not so much from lack of definition, but because by definition it is a mystery.

There’s a reason sacraments are known in the Greek as “mysteria.” Eastern Christians have always called them mysteries.

There is a lot to it that I think we simply cannot understand and to some extent we are all grasping at straws in trying to explain or even understand it.

Though they are still mysteries in large part, precious truths have been revealed to us, and we cling to such truths as the bedrock of our faith. One such truth is that Christ is really, substantially present in the Eucharist.

We cannot add to Christ’s sacrifice, but we can join with it. Is that a fair encapsulation?

Depends on what you mean by “add to”–as long as your statement can be interpreted in a way consistent with Colossians 1:24, I wouldn’t oppose it.

Jeremy

 

[Teflon93]

I don’t understand why, if Christ’s sacrifice is the basis of salvation, Catholics pray during the Mass that God would accept the sacrifice at the hands of the priest. This sounds suspiciously like something Catholics disavow. We cannot add anything to Christ’s finished work. So what is being offered if not Christ?

God being eternal and timeless, Mass does not happen sequentially but simultaneously. We are not adding to Christ’s sacrifice, but taking part in it. It is all one sacrifice.

This is much easier to understand when one comprehends the communion of saints, I think.

 

[Chesster]

I don’t understand why, if Christ’s sacrifice is the basis of salvation, Catholics pray during the Mass that God would accept the sacrifice at the hands of the priest. This sounds suspiciously like something Catholics disavow. We cannot add anything to Christ’s finished work. So what is being offered if not Christ?

When Catholics say, “May the Lord accept this sacrifice at your hands for the praise and glory of his name. . .” - it’s not the sacrifice itself that we are asking God to accept but rather the manner in which we are associated with the sacrifice and our dispositions that we ask God to accept.

 

[jpusateri]

Just thought I’d mention it.

Jeremy

Thanks Jeremy, I would not have made the distinction myself. I appreciate the new, correct insight!

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

The sacrifice of the mass is an reenactment of the sacrifice of the cross in an unbloody manner. It is not a separate sacrifice, but united with the sacrifice of the cross as a continuation of Calvary, in an unbloody manner. In effect, it is part of the mystery of our faith.

Deacon Ed B