Additional books of the Orthodox Canon?

[Michael_Francis]

Thread created from PM to me in order to help new member get answers.
MF

John89:

hi, i know the orthodox bible contains the 7 books that the Catholic Bible includes that the kjv Bible doesn’t…but after doing research i found out that they also have books in their bible that not even the catholic bible has…“3 Maccabees” “4 Maccabees” “Psalm 151” and “1 Esdras” would you happen to know anything about these books ?

 

[Yerusalyim]

Not much…Psalm 151 and the other books are disputed. Best to ask one of our Orthodox buddies.

 

[VL93]

Hope I qualify as an Orthodox “buddy”! In any case, here’s a very informative web site listing the contents of various Old Testament canons:

Chart of Old Testament Biblical Canons

Note:another book found in many editions of the Septuagint but missing from the Roman Catholic OT canon is the very moving Prayer of Manasseh which is chanted in the Orthodox Great Compline service.

 

[mariner]

The 1609 Douay included Esdras 3&4 as a ‘witness to the scriptures’
A book which describes the translation of the bible from hebrew to greek can be associated with the bible, even if not part of it
The 1611 King James also included these books although it calls them Esdras 1&2
Few versions of the KJ have these books, as in 1826, they along with the deutrocannon, were removed, reducing the KJ from 80 to 66 books

The Douay version is online:
catholicfirst.com/thefaith/bible/4esdras.cfm
but I am unaware of any printed versions

I rather like 4Esdras14:47 - scripture speaking of scripture
“For in these is the vein of understanding and the fountain
of wisdom and the stream of knowledge”

 

[lak611]

I have this Bible which contains 1 & 2 Esdras, 3 & 4 Maccabees, Psalm 151 and the Prayer of Manasseh.

 

[NotWorthy]

Note:another book found in many editions of the Septuagint but missing from the Roman Catholic OT canon is the very moving Prayer of Manasseh which is chanted in the Orthodox Great Compline service.

I LOVE that prayer!!! I found it in the commentary of the Navarre Bible on Chronicles, when it talked of Manasseh (dude was messed up). I loved it so much, I printed it up and keep it in my car.

 

[lak611]

I LOVE that prayer!!! I found it in the commentary of the Navarre Bible on Chronicles, when it talked of Manasseh (dude was messed up). I loved it so much, I printed it up and keep it in my car.

I love that prayer too. That’s one of the reasons I’m glad I have a KJV and the ecumenical RSV.

 

[DF2]

Thread created from PM to me in order to help new member get answers.
MF

There is no “Orthodox” canon. Different Orthodox Churches have different books that are considered inspired. Since they currently have to way to call or ratify ecumenical councils, the matter will not likely be settled for them.

From the old Catholic Encyclopedia:

III. THE CANON OF THE OLD TESTAMENT OUTSIDE THE CHURCH
A. AMONG THE EASTERN ORTHODOX
The Greek Orthodox Church preserved its ancient Canon in practice as well as theory until recent times, when, under the dominant influence of its Russian offshoot, it is shifting its attitude towards the deuterocanonical Scriptures. The rejection of these books by the Russian theologians and authorities is a lapse which began early in the eighteenth century. The Monophysites, Nestorians, Jacobites, Armenians, and Copts, while concerning themselves little with the Canon, admit the complete catalogue and several apocrypha besides.

and…

E. THE CANON OF THE OLD TESTAMENT DURING THE MIDDLE AGES

The Greek Church

The result of this tendency among the Greeks was that about the beginning of the twelfth century they possessed a canon identical with that of the Latins, except that it took in the apocryphal III Machabees. That all the deuteros were liturgically recognized in the Greek Church at the era of the schism in the ninth century, is indicated by the “Syntagma Canonum” of Photius

---

 

[Fr_Ambrose]

There is no “Orthodox” canon. Different Orthodox Churches have different books that are considered inspired. Since they currently have to way to call or ratify ecumenical councils, the matter will not likely be settled for them.

From the old Catholic Encyclopedia:

III. THE CANON OF THE OLD TESTAMENT OUTSIDE THE CHURCH
A. AMONG THE EASTERN ORTHODOX
The Greek Orthodox Church preserved its ancient Canon in practice as well as theory until recent times, when, under the dominant influence of its Russian offshoot, it is shifting its attitude towards the deuterocanonical Scriptures. The rejection of these books by the Russian theologians and authorities is a lapse which began early in the eighteenth century.

I just want to point out, as a priest of the Russian Orthodox Church, that this is incorrect. I am looking right now at the 1993 edition of the Bible in Russian, printed with the blessing of the Russian Patriarch and the Holy Synod. It includes all the books which the Catholic Encyclopedia says we have rejected. When it comes to Orthodox matters I have found that the Encylopedia is sometimes inaccurate.

 

[Fr_Ambrose]

Note:another book found in many editions of the Septuagint but missing from the Roman Catholic OT canon is the very moving Prayer of Manasseh which is chanted in the Orthodox Great Compline service.

Look into it a little. Prior to the Reformation your Bible included 3 and 4 Esdras and the Prayer of Manasseh as canonical books. Because of the Reformation there was a shake up of the Roman Catholic Bible and Pope Clement VIII authorised a new official Bible in 1590 - the Clementine Vulgate.

The Clementine Vulgate took 3 and 4 Esdras out of their traditional places in the Bible and put them at the end of the Old Testament.

The Clementine Vulgate remained the official Catholic Bible right down to Pope John Paul II. In 1979 he promulgated a new official Catholic Bible, the Nova Vulgata. This 1979 Bible completely removed 3 and 4 Esdras and the Prayer of Manasseh.

So in brief:

1. Up until the 16th century. Catholic Bibles had these books as canonical books.
2. From 1590. They were placed at the end of the Old Testament
3. 1. They were removed entirely.

-oOo-

PS. It is interesting that the Introit of the Requiem Mass retains the phrase from the centuries when Esdras was accpeted as canonical…

“Requiem aeternam, dona eis Domine, et lux perpetua luceat eis.” Eternal rest grant unto them, O Lord, and let perpetual light shine upon them. (2 Esdras 2:34-35).

 

[Isa_Almisry]

I just want to point out, as a priest of the Russian Orthodox Church, that this is incorrect. I am looking right now at the 1993 edition of the Bible in Russian, printed with the blessing of the Russian Patriarch and the Holy Synod. It includes all the books which the Catholic Encyclopedia says we have rejected. When it comes to Orthodox matters I have found that the Encylopedia is sometimes inaccurate.

I have the Slavonic Edition (or reprint actually) and there all there. I also have the reprint of the Bucharest Bible (the first in Romanian) and the latest Romanian Bible pubished by the Bible Society but with the Synod’s blessing, and they’re there.

 

[NotWorthy]

I just want to point out, as a priest of the Russian Orthodox Church, that this is incorrect. I am looking right now at the 1993 edition of the Bible in Russian, printed with the blessing of the Russian Patriarch and the Holy Synod. It includes all the books which the Catholic Encyclopedia says we have rejected. When it comes to Orthodox matters I have found that the Encylopedia is sometimes inaccurate.

I don’t know if this is pertinent, but the claim was made in the “Old Catholic Encyclopedia” - doesn’t that date to the early 1900’s (maybe 1930’s)?

If so, couldn’t the 1993 Bible have corrected this oversight?

 

[Fr_Ambrose]

I don’t know if this is pertinent, but the claim was made in the “Old Catholic Encyclopedia” - doesn’t that date to the early 1900’s (maybe 1930’s)?

If so, couldn’t the 1993 Bible have corrected this oversight?

I hardly think that dropping 10 books from the Bible would be an oversight! The people would notice!!

I have a pre-Revolutionary Russian Bible (in Slavonic.) It includes all the deuterocanonical books.

During the Soviet period of 80 years there was only one (very limited) printing of the Bible.

 

[NotWorthy]

I hardly think that dropping 10 books from the Bible would be an oversight! The people would notice!!

I don’t know, according to my Baptist friends, Catholics could drop 10 books from the OT and the NT, and none of us would notice.

I have a pre-Revolutionary Russian Bible (in Slavonic.) It includes all the deuterocanonical books.

During the Soviet period of 80 years there was only one (very limited) printing of the Bible.

OK, gotcha.