Adoption/ Pregnancy as God's will?

[lotus1922]

(Apologies for the long post, I have a hard time putting difficult concepts to words)

So let me preface this by clarifying that I am aware of the Church’s teachings regarding marriage, sexuality, openness to life, etc and for the most part have no problem recognizing their wisdom and assenting to observing them. I say “for the most part” because I have some personal extenuating circumstances and other questions regarding how these teaching apply to various “grave situations”, but that’s another topic.

Anyhow, I understand that every marital act must be open to the possibility that a child will be conceived as a result; we cannot artificially alter the intrinsic purpose of the act. NFP is permitted because the act remains intact and the couple accept whatever God’s will is for their marriage and whether or not they are given the gift of children. If God grants children to a couple, it is because it is His will that they become parents and raise their children to know, love, and serve Him. If they are not granted children then that is also God’s will, for His own reasons.

While no one can presume to know God’s will, I propose the following question: If it is God’s will that a couple becomes pregnant, and they put the baby up for adoption, are they not thwarting the will of God for them to have had children? Would it ever be in the nature of God to will someone to get pregnant without also willing for said person to raise the child born to them? Would God ever will for someone to get pregnant in order for someone else to raise the child?

I suppose a corollary to this question could be, if God does not will for a couple to have children, then wouldn’t their adopting a child contradict His will for them? If God Himself is the one who determines who should and should not have children, then how is adoption a “thing”?

Many thanks in advance

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

A couple should not be asking another couple to care for their child unless they are incapable.

However, God does offer life to those who may not be in a marital situation. Those women, and men, should then decide how best to handle the situation. Will they remain single and co-parent? Will they work towards marriage? Will it be more prudent to allow that child to be raised in a better situation?

These are all incredibly difficult thoughts and decisions. They are ones that need to be made prayerfully and for the sake of the soul that has been given by God.

And then you have foster care. These are parents who initially said “yes, we’re capable of raising children” but then failed to meet basic needs or harmed their children out of malice or ignorance. You have children in orphanages from 3rd world countries who have lost parents at a young age. You have children who have been abandoned for socioeconomic reasons. In China, you have children abandoned so they may live.

Married life is a constant discernment between the spouses to what God wants for their family. There are some who ignore God’s call for more children. There are some who have an ideal family and keep having children despite God’s warning for prudence.

Let’s set aside the immoral solutions to fertility issues both with ABC and IVF. For the most part, NFP or natural sterility decide the family size.

So lets talk about adoption. Yes, if a couple purposefully neglects a call to adopt they are disobeying God. It is a much more complicated process than having a baby. There are private infant placements, foster care, international adoptions and orphan hosting. Each come with their own issues. My husband and I were open to Foster Care before we had children. However, given the trauma of the children and the lasting scope of the government into the lives of the biological children in a potential foster family it would not be prudent. If for their own privacy, if nothing else. Infant adoption, to us, is unappealing and risky. So God would very much have to provide the means for expensive international adoption should that be the case.

Adoption is neither simple nor straightforward and it is not a joyful occasion but one that is deeply permeated but the gravity of the loss of family, culture, and values. It is a liftetime of trying to understand just who one is. And I speak that as an older adoptee who learned a bit about my birth culture and a TON about my adoptive culture. I can speak quite a bit of my (100% Native) grandmother’s native language, but I have no rights as an American Indian. My brother knows virtually nothing, but he gets a membership by right of blood.

So it’s complicated. Very, very complicated.

 

[1ke]

If it is God’s will that a couple becomes pregnant, and they put the baby up for adoption, are they not thwarting the will of God for them to have had children?

I think you have the wrong idea.

God permits the natural consequences of sexual intercourse. That is not the same thing as “willing” a couple to have a baby.

If God Himself is the one who determines who should and should not have children, then how is adoption a “thing”?

I’m not really sure where that idea is coming from, it’s not what the Church teaches.

 

[lotus1922]

lotus1922:

If it is God’s will that a couple becomes pregnant, and they put the baby up for adoption, are they not thwarting the will of God for them to have had children?

I think you have the wrong idea.

God permits the natural consequences of sexual intercourse. That is not the same thing as “willing” a couple to have a baby.

If it’s not the will of God, then why do you have couples who desperately try to conceive a child by moral means, but never do? Was their discernment that they should have children incorrect? If a couple never has children despite being open to the possibility or even actively trying to have them, and it doesn’t happen, is that because God permitted them to be childless? If God didn’t will Abraham and Sarah to have a child, how else would they have had one in their 90s?

If God Himself is the one who determines who should and should not have children, then how is adoption a “thing”?

I’m not really sure where that idea is coming from, it’s not what the Church teaches.
[/quote]

I didn’t say it was what the Church teaches. I’m asking a question, hypothetical/ epistemological as it may be.

If people are to discern the will of God, how does one know that their discernment is correct and actually what God does will for them? Is it possible for God to will someone to have children, but not conceive/ birth them? What are the implications of a person adopting a child whom God intended to not have children? People who are not Catholic or even religious at all adopt children all the time; those people aren’t discerning the will of God. Is God’s will coming to pass dependent on a person discerning it first? It doesn’t appear that Abraham and Sarah had discerned that they would have a child in their 90s? I’m not trying to be hostile or combative, I’m trying to make sense of things.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

If it’s not the will of God, then why do you have couples who desperately try to conceive a child by moral means, but never do? Was their discernment that they should have children incorrect? If a couple never has children despite being open to the possibility or even actively trying to have them, and it doesn’t happen, is that because God permitted them to be childless? If God didn’t will Abraham and Sarah to have a child, how else would they have had one in their 90s?

Discerning a child is not a one-time thing. It’s a month by month discernment. Infertility is a burden. No doubt. Is that the conversation you’re looking to have?

I didn’t say it was what the Church teaches. I’m asking a question, hypothetical/ epistemological as it may be.

If people are to discern the will of God, how does one know that their discernment is correct and actually what God does will for them? Is it possible for God to will someone to have children, but not conceive/ birth them? What are the implications of a person adopting a child whom God intended to not have children? People who are not Catholic or even religious at all adopt children all the time; those people aren’t discerning the will of God. Is God’s will coming to pass dependent on a person discerning it first? It doesn’t appear that Abraham and Sarah had discerned that they would have a child in their 90s? I’m not trying to be hostile or combative, I’m trying to make sense of things.

God guides even those non-reigious because God is always present. Even if a person openly rejects God, God still works in their lives.

If you’re listening, God tends to make it pretty clear.

 

[1ke]

If it’s not the will of God, then why do you have couples who desperately try to conceive a child by moral means, but never do? Was their discernment that they should have children incorrect? If a couple never has children despite being open to the possibility or even actively trying to have them, and it doesn’t happen, is that because God permitted them to be childless? If God didn’t will Abraham and Sarah to have a child, how else would they have had one in their 90s?

It’s a fallen world. Fertility problems are a result. It’s the way things work. If your ovaries or your sperm or other reproductive parts are diseased, injured or otherwise defective, God does not typically intervene.
So yes, he permits the natural end of the act be it conception or not.

When he does intervene, that is what we call a miracle. Sometimes, God may perform a miracle in the furtherance of his divine will. Such as Isaac. That is rare, an exception.

 

[lotus1922]

lotus1922:

If it’s not the will of God, then why do you have couples who desperately try to conceive a child by moral means, but never do? Was their discernment that they should have children incorrect? If a couple never has children despite being open to the possibility or even actively trying to have them, and it doesn’t happen, is that because God permitted them to be childless? If God didn’t will Abraham and Sarah to have a child, how else would they have had one in their 90s?

Discerning a child is not a one-time thing. It’s a month by month discernment. Infertility is a burden. No doubt. Is that the conversation you’re looking to have?

I know it’s month-to-month, so if a couple is month-to-month discerning that they should have children but don’t, then how do they know that they discerned correctly? If God does things on His own timetable, then how long before someone realizes that what they think should happen but has thus far failed to happen, is not actually what should happen?

But I think the bigger thing I’m trying to get at is the interplay of our free will vs. God’s will. If we have free will, then how is God’s will to be done when someone exercises their free will to do otherwise? I’ve heard more than one Catholic say that God’s will is inevitable, but if people have free will does that not mean they are capable of frustrating God’s will? And if God’s will is inevitable, doesn’t that negate our having free wil?

People who are not Catholic or even religious at all adopt children all the time; those people aren’t discerning the will of God. Is God’s will coming to pass dependent on a person discerning it first? It doesn’t appear that Abraham and Sarah had discerned that they would have a child in their 90s? I’m not trying to be hostile or combative, I’m trying to make sense of things.

God guides even those non-reigious because God is always present. Even if a person openly rejects God, God still works in their lives.

If you’re listening, God tends to make it pretty clear.

But that’s the thing, atheists aren’t listening for God. How do you listen to something that you don’t even expect exists? That’s kind of like knowing what you don’t know— if you don’t know something, you don’t even know that you don’t know it.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

I know it’s month-to-month, so if a couple is month-to-month discerning that they should have children but don’t, then how do they know that they discerned correctly? If God does things on His own timetable, then how long before someone realizes that what they think should happen but has thus far failed to happen, is not actually what should happen?

But I think the bigger thing I’m trying to get at is the interplay of our free will vs. God’s will. If we have free will, then how is God’s will to be done when someone exercises their free will to do otherwise? I’ve heard more than one Catholic say that God’s will is inevitable, but if people have free will does that not mean they are capable of frustrating God’s will? And if God’s will is inevitable, doesn’t that negate our having free wil?

God can say no. Discerning doesn’t mean that you always get a yes.

But that’s the thing, atheists aren’t listening for God. How do you listen to something that you don’t even expect exists? That’s kind of like knowing what you don’t know— if you don’t know something, you don’t even know that you don’t know it.

God is not held captive to our beliefs. They may feel a feeling they understand–a longing or mercy.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Anyhow, I understand that every marital act must be open to the possibility that a child will be conceived as a result; we cannot artificially alter the intrinsic purpose of the act.

Because precise language is important, know the Church teaches that each marital act must be “ordered toward procreation”. It does help to use the correct terms.

For your following question, the Church does not prohibit a married couple from placing a child in an adoptive home. If the couple cannot care for a child, it is a loving thing to do.

 

[TheLittleLady]

In his letter to the Romans, St. Paul underscores for us just how beautiful adoption is, because each Gentile Christian has BEEN adopted!! (bold added by me)

For those who are led by the Spirit of God are children of God.

For you did not receive a spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you received a spirit of adoption, through which we cry, “Abba,* Father!”

The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,and if children, then heirs, heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if only we suffer with him so that we may also be glorified with him.

 

[Viki63]

I’ve never heard anyone say that God’s will is inevitable. I do know that He can bring good out of less than ideal circumstances.
As said above, God permits children to be born into tough circumstances, though it might not be his perfect will.
Adoption is a good thing, approved by the church, Early Christians used to walk the hills near Rome looking for infants abandoned to die, and raise them as their own.
It’s not too complicated: if you have a child, raise him/her if possible. If you don’t have a child and think you could care for one, foster or adopt one.

 

[lotus1922]

Thanks everyone for the replies!

 

[runningdude]

Vocations are situational. If a couple gives birth to a child, they have a vocation to raise that child. If a couple adopts a child, they too have a God-given vocation to raise that child to the best of their ability. There is no “thwarting” of God’s will. (Even priests do not posses a vocation to the priesthood, until they are accepted and ordained by their bishop)

Surrendering a child to adoption is an imperfect solution; a couple must surrender their vocation to raise the child to another. Absent grave cause or orphan-status, this could very well be spurious or sinful on that couple’s part. Failing to raise and care for one’s children is a serious sin, although arranging their responsible care by another can mitigate that sin.