Adoration and knitting?

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You folks are going to do what you want to do anyway.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV 🙂
Your concern is well founded Brother JR, but I hope you will not despair of us. Sometimes, people honestly have not had exposure to the ideas you are sharing. - intentions are good and we want to serve and love and honor Our Lord as best we know how and this may be the best that we know. Acquiring and accepting a different level of knowledge requires exposure…and sometimes blind trust.
Your posts about accepting the authority of the church are helpful. It is possible that many posters have never thought about the Cure of Ars in the way you presented him until today. Your insights about his learning issues were exciting to me. As you noted, much of what is known about learning styles/ the working of the brain (I’m paraphrasing here and counting on your benevolence) is fairly new and part of a specialized school of knowledge).
I am playing catch-up and am grateful for your willingness to share your knowledge. But I can sympathize with your frustration-what is so clear to you is the product of a great deal of education. I’m a novice by comparison…but wanting to get further and i sense that your support on these threads answers a similar need in so many people.
Experience is alternative way to figure these things out, can take time, may not generate sufficient information to lead to change, and can be can be a hard taskmaster. I think of the lost sheep, trying to figure out how to get back to the fold by him/her self.
Perhaps if you think of your support as preparing soil, it will be easier to wait for slower seeds like myself to germinate.:o
In the short time I have been on CAF, your posts have been most helpful.
Thank you for your patience and forbearance. You cultivate and shepherd us well. May God bless you and all of your good work. Amen.
 
No, you really ought to just pray while at Adoration. Adoration isn’t mandatory, so she shouldn’t feel guilty for not participating for a whole hour if she can’t concentrate for that long.
In light of Brother JR’s post, I withdraw my comment. Actually, as I tend to mindlessly fiddle when giving my undivided attention elsewhere, his advice makes a great deal of sense.
 
You folks are going to do what you want to do anyway. Go for it.

I don’t want to hear CAF asking religious superiors and bishops why deacons, priests and brothers do not last on CAF. My response is going to be simple. “You have 30,000 experts. You don’t need us.”

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV 🙂
QFT. 👍 :rotfl:
Members: 374,528
 
Now you do bring up the issue of those in the past perhaps being unaware of the modern developments of science. The issue here is that modern development of science does not say that men and women cannot spend one hour in prayer without doing anything else. **The question here is not whether one could pray while they do other things but whether it is appropriate. **
This inappropriateness was my point as well. We live in a busy, harried world that can crowd out prayer. This hindering is subtle and often times we aren’t aware of it. Everyone is beset with distractions during prayer as it is. When one knits, do you not have to pay a certain attention to the measuring or pattern of what you are knitting? I’ve knitted a few things and altho a novice, I cannot see the activity as that of an automaton. Is this activity not the opposite of recollecting oneself and presenting our whole being, body, mind and spirit before the Lord?
Anyway, lets put this Science aside for a bit. When discussing the matters of prudence, it generally does not mean that it applies to everyone anyway. So if I say that it is imprudent for an unmarried man and a woman to sleep in the same bed, this did not follow because all men and women if sleeping in the same bed will have sex. Rather, it was a decision made from the state of an average person.
In the same way, for an average person, adoration, which is a time you come spend time with Christ, shouldn’t be about knitting. It should be a time where they fully give their hearts and minds to Christ. If they want, they could read some Scripture or other spiritually edifying material. When all the days are spent engaged in secular tasks (again speaking from the average person view), it is better to do something for ones spirit in this time rather than try to knit something together. When you advise that knitting might be ok, I see that as an opportunity you lost to encourage the person to do something actually spiritually edifying or enhancing the experience of adoration.
👍👍

Is not prayer one of the most single important things to God because He dispenses His grace in response to our communication with Him? We OWE due diligence to Him especially in the areas of Adoration and Praise! I do not judge the hearts of others, but what as a society, have we become if we cannot devote one single hour just to our Lord and God alone.
 
The main thing is, if the people around her are okay with the tick tick of the needles then it perfectly okay for her to knit. By knitting she may well be more focused in that hour of Adoration than left to her own thoughts per se.

I can’t even manage 5 minutes of Communion and my mind has been anywhere but with all sorts of dumb questions that aren’t really there and yes for me, the solution is that I now take a kindle and read that. It only five minutes but five minutes ontop of a sunday that has been bad for me or indeed even a whole week at times, that is five minutes blessed peace with God. Thankfully the priest understood and all he wants me to do is ‘relax’ with God at that time. All I wanted was the questions to stop. We both have what we want because the questions have stopped and I do relax with God at that time even if I fail all the rest of the time. That time is now progressing into the rest of the service as I now feel or what I call feel God at times through the service, (and I been going to church 25 year:blush:) So if I find 5 minutes hard to handle and luckily reading works for me, then I am not suprised that your friend may be finding a whole hour hard as such. By knitting away, she isn’t really disturbing anyone and if she is, then with a few patient explanations and in time they wouldn’t be disturbed… and what would it matter that a whole church of people is sat there knitting away… It doesn’t. The essence is adoration and if we are one of those people who are distracted by silence or uncomfortable for some other reason then we are not focused on adoration be it communion or any other time we are being with God. Far better to be occupied with some other personal activity that allows us to focus on God at the same time, especially with the priest understanding. People think it isn’t the ‘done’ thing but that is our thoughts playing tricks on us and the devil winning with our thoughts. She will be just as focused at Adoration for knitting than someone who really doesn’t need anything but keeps shuffling every few minutes because of aches etc:thumbsup: If the priest basically okay’s it and others in the congregation haven’t complained then yes it is appropriate. She may have even sought out the advice from a priest about it first and just not mentioned that to you because there is no need for her to do so because you’re not the priest… xyz. Its good reading books in church I will add. It really has helped me to relax with God rather than er paying lip service.🙂
 
As I said before I am a knitter (along with lots of other needle crafts) and I could very easily knit at Adoration for an hour - there are many things to make that do not require you to check your work and instructions - I make throws, scarfs, etc. for grandchildren and it comes easily. If I’m knitting at home I will be praying a bit - I can sit by the TV and watch/listen to a program while I’m doing a needle craft or reading a book and I can tell you about the book and the TV program - well aware not every can do this and it does bug my husband that I can. 😉 I for one have a bad case of ringing in my ears and I LOVE to be at Adoration alone so I read aloud my prayers because if not the ringing bothers me so much my mind starts to wonder - I can easily see myself knitting to help keep my mind on my prayers and away from the ringing. If you are bothered by someone knitting/crocheting while you are at Adoration tell them - I’m sure they will be happy to stop – if not then shut up - at that point it is up to the Lord to tell them.:signofcross:
 
I will often bring a knitted baby blanket into adoration with me so that I can stitch at least a few rows in front of the Blessed Sacrament. I donate the blankets to our parish for the babies being baptized into the Faith. While I can and do pray for the children and their families while working on the projects at home I try to add something a little ‘special’ by bringing the project and these prayers before the Lord’s True Presence. I always wait, though, until I’m at a point in the project that I no longer have to think very hard about the pattern because the most important part, at that point, is the prayer.
 
I will often bring a knitted baby blanket into adoration with me so that I can stitch at least a few rows in front of the Blessed Sacrament. I donate the blankets to our parish for the babies being baptized into the Faith. While I can and do pray for the children and their families while working on the projects at home I try to add something a little ‘special’ by bringing the project and these prayers before the Lord’s True Presence. I always wait, though, until I’m at a point in the project that I no longer have to think very hard about the pattern because the most important part, at that point, is the prayer.
What a wonderful testament to your belief in the Real Presence!
 
From Celebrating the Holy Eucharist by Francis Cardinal Arinze, the Lord is due five things from us:
  1. Adoration
  2. Praise
  3. Thanksgiving
  4. Propitiation for our sins
  5. Petition
Sadly, I note that these are in order, and that I very often reverse the sequence. It reminds me of the sisters Martha and Mary:

Luke 10:38-42
Knox Bible (KNOX)
38 In one of the villages he entered during his journey, a woman called Martha entertained him in her house. 39 She had a sister called Mary; and Mary took her place at the Lord’s feet, and listened to his words. 40 Martha was distracted by waiting on many needs; so she came to his side, and asked, Lord, art thou content that my sister should leave me to do the serving alone? Come, bid her help me. 41 Jesus answered her, Martha, Martha, how many cares and troubles thou hast! 42 But only one thing is necessary; and Mary has chosen for herself the best part of all, that which shall never be taken away from her.

As I approach the adoration chapel, I remind myself that I am coming into the presence of Greatness. My Lord. My Help. My Judge.

I believe that your friend could greatly benefit from a copy of Vinny Flynn’s 7 Secrets of the Eucharist.

While we are called to adore the Lord who is present to us under the appearance of bread, for years I must admit that I looked upon Jesus Christ and saw only bread. This book helps to change our perception so that we look upon what was once bread but is now Jesus Christ among us.
👍👍
 
A good morning meditation from St. Therese’s Story of a Soul …
O Jesus, Your little bird is happy to be weak and little. What would become of it if it were big? Never would it have the boldness to appear in Your presence, to fall asleep in front of You. Yes, this is still one of the weaknesses of the little bird: when it wants to fix its gaze upon the Diviine Sun, and when the clouds prevent it from seeing a single ray of that Sun, in spite of itself, its little eyes close, its little head is hidden beneath its wing and the poor little thing falls asleep, believing all the time that it is fixing its gaze upon its Dear Star.

When it awakens, it doesn’t feel desolate; its little heart is at peace and it begins once again its work of love.
This saintly Doctor teaches us her little way, and in Jesus’ presence, falls asleep, but wakens unconcerned and untroubled. I doubt seriously that if she were given the opportunity to do anything else in front of the Blessed Sacrament, but failed to keep attentive, it would not disturb the peace of her spirit. That is spiritual childhood at its best. We know she had difficulty with the rosary, as well.

Since we have Jesus with us at all times, I don’t see how we can offend him by knitting, praying, working, adoring, or doing anything whatsoever in his sacred presence, since we offer our very selves to him at each day’s beginning. It would be good to consider adopting childlike simplicity so dear to Jesus.
 
First, please notice how I conclude my post.

For some people, knitting gives them something to do with their hands. There are people who can carry on a conversation while knitting, watch a movie, attend to a child, meditate, pray, even plan dinner.

There are other people who have focusing problems. Such persons should not try to knit or do anything else when praying, having a conversation, watching a movie or attending to a child, because they don’t have the neuropsychological tools necessary to separate motor activity from cognitive activity. Either they knit or they pray, but they can’t do both.

Back in the good old days, people did not understand how the central nervous system works. They couldn’t tell the difference between cognitive activity, which is prayer and motor activity, which is knitting.

In adoration, there is no motor planning or psychomotor activity as there is at mass. Therefore, unless a person has poor neurosensory discrimination, he can do something like knit and adore the Blessed Sacrament at the same time.

If you look at my red response. A person who’s cognitive functions are distracted by his motor functions, should not knit when trying to pray.

We’re acting as if this has never been done before, which is not the case. For this reason, I said that the answer to this question is best left to those whose area of expertise is ascetical and mystical theology. Why? Because theologians who specialize in ascetical and mystical theology are a) experts in prayer, b) knowledgeable of the Church’s spiritual tradition, c) knowledgeable of spiritual theology and moral theology, and d) knowledgeable of human physiology and neuro-anatomy. All of this is involved in to get a doctorate in Ascetical and Mystical Theology.

It really concerns me when one tries to give responses to questions that require a certain area of expertise and either a) does not acknowledge that one does not have the expertise or b) presumes that there is no need for it. Not every question about the faith has a one size fits all answer. We must be very careful not to try to create one size fits all answers, because it can make people feel very guilty or do very irresponsible things, depending on the answer.

It’s also important to remember that God’s ego is not as fragile as our own. God delights in his creation. He is not offended by that which is neutral

St. John Vianney gave this advice and it was very good for St. John Vianney. We must also remember that St. John Vianney was dyslexic and did not know it. In those days, no one knew about dyslexia. We know it today from his writings and from what others wrote about him. For John, doing anything other than sitting quietly in the presence of God would make prayer impossible. It was his dyslexia that almost stopped his ordination. Because of it, he was sent to Ars. They thought he was not very bright. In fact, he just has a neuropsychological defecit that had nothing to do with intelligence, but did interfere with cognitive processes, unless one knew how to get around it.

It’s like the person who is born deaf or blind. To this this is the natural state of affairs. To St. John Vianney, the inability to stay focus when walking and chewing gum was a natural state of affair. He never thought that this was atypical. He probably would have suggested against walking and chewing gum. I’m using this as an example. They didn’t have chewing gum during his time, that I know of.

Another example the we find in the history of the Spiritual Masters is St. Teresa of Avila eating apples during prayer. She always had the need to munch on something. When she was not doing so, she cold not concentrate. Long after her death, we find out that she had serious stomach problems that led to stomach cancer, which killed her. At the time, they knew nothing of such things. Imagine of her confessors and spiritual directors had told her that eating an apple during prayer was wrong. The woman may have been more sick than she was and dead much earlier.

In her mind and that of those around her, she was engaging in a very neutral act that did not distract her from prayer. No one commented on the apple until later years when her spirituality was studied by scholars. Actually, it was missed until the late 1950s when a Carmelite scholar found a small note that Teresa passed on to a sister requesting that an apple be brought to her at chapel during her hour of adoration. Teresa’s companions mentioned her munching fruit all the time, but no one mentioned adoration until this note was found.

Please be careful when giving advice that involves spiritual and moral matters and if one is not an expert, add a disclaimer. It can be as dangerous as dispensing medical advice via the internet.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV 🙂
As always, excellent advice and information!
 
I will often bring a knitted baby blanket into adoration with me so that I can stitch at least a few rows in front of the Blessed Sacrament. I donate the blankets to our parish for the babies being baptized into the Faith. While I can and do pray for the children and their families while working on the projects at home I try to add something a little ‘special’ by bringing the project and these prayers before the Lord’s True Presence. I always wait, though, until I’m at a point in the project that I no longer have to think very hard about the pattern because the most important part, at that point, is the prayer.
👍👍:amen::amen:
 
A good morning meditation from St. Therese’s Story of a Soul …
O Jesus, Your little bird is happy to be weak and little. What would become of it if it were big? Never would it have the boldness to appear in Your presence, to fall asleep in front of You. Yes, this is still one of the weaknesses of the little bird: when it wants to fix its gaze upon the Diviine Sun, and when the clouds prevent it from seeing a single ray of that Sun, in spite of itself, its little eyes close, its little head is hidden beneath its wing and the poor little thing falls asleep, believing all the time that it is fixing its gaze upon its Dear Star.

When it awakens, it doesn’t feel desolate; its little heart is at peace and it begins once again its work of love.
This saintly Doctor teaches us her little way, and in Jesus’ presence, falls asleep, but wakens unconcerned and untroubled. I doubt seriously that if she were given the opportunity to do anything else in front of the Blessed Sacrament, but failed to keep attentive, it would not disturb the peace of her spirit. That is spiritual childhood at its best. We know she had difficulty with the rosary, as well.

Since we have Jesus with us at all times, I don’t see how we can offend him by knitting, praying, working, adoring, or doing anything whatsoever in his sacred presence, since we offer our very selves to him at each day’s beginning. It would be good to consider adopting childlike simplicity so dear to Jesus.
👍👍:amen::amen:
 
I will often bring a knitted baby blanket into adoration with me so that I can stitch at least a few rows in front of the Blessed Sacrament. I donate the blankets to our parish for the babies being baptized into the Faith. While I can and do pray for the children and their families while working on the projects at home I try to add something a little ‘special’ by bringing the project and these prayers before the Lord’s True Presence. I always wait, though, until I’m at a point in the project that I no longer have to think very hard about the pattern because the most important part, at that point, is the prayer.
A good morning meditation from St. Therese’s Story of a Soul …
O Jesus, Your little bird is happy to be weak and little. What would become of it if it were big? Never would it have the boldness to appear in Your presence, to fall asleep in front of You. Yes, this is still one of the weaknesses of the little bird: when it wants to fix its gaze upon the Diviine Sun, and when the clouds prevent it from seeing a single ray of that Sun, in spite of itself, its little eyes close, its little head is hidden beneath its wing and the poor little thing falls asleep, believing all the time that it is fixing its gaze upon its Dear Star.

When it awakens, it doesn’t feel desolate; its little heart is at peace and it begins once again its work of love.
This saintly Doctor teaches us her little way, and in Jesus’ presence, falls asleep, but wakens unconcerned and untroubled. I doubt seriously that if she were given the opportunity to do anything else in front of the Blessed Sacrament, but failed to keep attentive, it would not disturb the peace of her spirit. That is spiritual childhood at its best. We know she had difficulty with the rosary, as well.

Since we have Jesus with us at all times, I don’t see how we can offend him by knitting, praying, working, adoring, or doing anything whatsoever in his sacred presence, since we offer our very selves to him at each day’s beginning. It would be good to consider adopting childlike simplicity so dear to Jesus.
Love both of these ideas. If she’s able to remain focused on the prayer rather than the shawl, I think it’s fine. I used to make rosaries and pray them during Adoration if I was having a hard time concentrating with just my mental prayer and thoughts. Always tripping over my feet to Jesus 😊
 
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