Advice for an unfortunate personal situation that involves my parish

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The sin this woman is guilty of is personal to another family…not against the church…kwim?

It has no bearing on whether she is,a qualified ccd teacher. It has no bearing on her qualifications regarding a parish council rep. She will not be teaching adultery is ok., or flirting it up with maLe parishoners…if she does, then it’s different as it affects the parish.

Of course the op will not want her teaching or interacting with her own kids, and this should be communicated when this time comes. …with the priest… only.

If everyone who sinned in in the past in a way that is personal toward another was not allowed to participate in volunteer work at the church…the church would not have volunteers.

We are,all unworthy to serve the church…but we try and do better. We do not rate sins of others. Especially if they have been forgiven by God.

This perhaps may be the answer the op gets from her priest. It’s a bitter pill to swallow…and this is why at this time I would pray and not act right now. Her family can avoid this woman at mass

The op can stay temporarily and see how things flow. If it becomes too traumatic she can then leave and give a vague reason.It is much better to leave on a positive quiet manner, then to leave under the darkness of scandal. It will help no one.

The key here is if this woman’s behavior has changed, if she repented, if she now is living a life of Catholic virtue, and if sge does not detract from the focus of why the op goes to mass, or prevent healing and forgiveness in the op’s life.

I will say too, that we left our long time parish a few years,ago for different reasons…the reason was politics at that parish. Worship had taken a back seat to all of this nonsense, and it affected our focus. We left quietly and it was all good. I could have given specifics, I could have probably affected,the reputation of others at the church. But we felt it was not conducive to the peace we desired and prayed for. We made the decision of going from volunteer leaders there to quiet prayerful parishoners at our new parish, and we could not be more happy. Our focus now is where it should be.
 
Sorry, I’m not buying all this. All she had to do was simply not put herself in front of these people. She refuses, she wants to be in the forefront. Parish Council, Religious Ed.
All the wronged party asked was for some space. And she can’t muster the dignity to do that. No one seems to recall that the OP is the innocent party.

It absolutely does bear on the other woman’s actions on behalf of the parish. It speaks to selfishness and a lack of humility. Saying you have repented and actually living it are two different things.
We used to have a pastor that was oh so friendly and fun at Mass on Sundays. Everybody loved him! He was so great! He was so funny! He seemed sooooooo spiritual. But behind closed doors…he was a mean, spiteful, rude, and snarky person. Those people he schmoozed on Sunday? You couldn’t believe how he really felt about them, and he would say so, in the parish offices, often. It infected everything he did. It infected the entire parish.
His ministry suffered because he was fundamentally unhappy in ministry. But you know what? He thought everything was great! He thought everyone “bought” the false pretenses. He thought he was really popular! He thought all was well. It wasn’t and the church declined,and declined…great people left, disillusioned by the person who represented the Church. And you know what? Every other priest who knew about this said “oh yeah, he’s like that. Everybody knows that. You guys should know better than to trust him”. :eek:
Now, will everyone know that this person had an affair? Of course not. Will her students know? Of course not.
But repentance means kindness, consideration, and humility. And often, restitution. A small act of restitution would be to not “sit across the aisle” form them, as if that makes anything less painful. :rolleyes:
It would be a supreme act of kindness for her to honor the request of the woman whose marriage was threatened.

Why is that too much to ask?
 
Tis_Bearself said:
Nobody should be “running anybody out” of a parish. Both should stay and receive sacraments. Whether a person who has had an affair like this (husband or other woman) should be permitted to serve in governance or teaching positions is a separate issue and one that can be discussed with pastor and/or DRE, but a Catholic should be able to receive sacraments at any Catholic parish and not feel forced to stay away from Mass and sacraments because some personal situation happened in the past.

Also, we are only getting OP’s side of the story here. We don’t know anything about the other lady’s side. For all we know she could have a past history that made her vulnerable, or the now-contrite husband might have pursued her. We don’t know if it’s easy for her to just up and go to some other parish; maybe she has good reasons for wanting to attend where she does. Maybe she has confessed and repented but doesn’t feel she should have to hide under a rock or wear a scarlet letter forever while the other party to the sin goes about his normal business at the church.

This situation is obviously not just “peachy” for anyone involved, but Catholic parishes are not like some Protestant churches I read about where if you anger some longtime pillar of the local church, you get a call or letter telling you not to come back to services. We are supposed to be inclusive. That means both parties should be welcome. Sit on opposite sides of the room if necessary but nobody gets booted from attending Mass.
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So there are legitimate reasons for infidelity? Really?
And Catechists DO have to have credentials. Who said anything about hiding under a rock? Scarlet letters? You’ve got to be kidding?
How about kindness, consideration, and dignity for the wronged party?
Wow. Nobody said anything about being booted either. She should remove herself from a painful situation, for herself as much as for anyone else.
 
I said nothing about “legitimate reasons for infidelity” and to be honest, you yourself sound way more judgmental than the OP. Jesus told the woman caught in adultery, “go and sin no more”. He didn’t say “but be sure you don’t show your disrespectful face in the local church again either because you might upset people”.

It really saddens me when people seem to ignore every Gospel lesson on forgiveness when they decide the “sin” warrants some special “shunning”.

Have a nice day.
 
MaryT777 said:
Op,
A message board unfortunately is not a good place to get support if you are looking for support for your viewpoint as people have differing opinions.

I might think since this thread is upsetting you that you unsubscribe and find support in ways other than the internet in this manner.

I hope you find support.

There is always the prayer thread where prayer warriors would be happy to pray for your discernment and a good outcome for you, your husband and your family.

God Bless,
Mary,
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Perhaps “support” isn’t the word, but how about compassion? How about reading carefully enough to see ALL of what I said instead of jumping onto one piece of it to berate my husband or act like I’m trying to find a scapegoat?

A Catholic message board should be a place to expect members to see each other as real human beings asking questions from a place of hurt or confusion. I certainly expected different opinions, and I’m a big girl who can handle that. But some posters ignored most of what I described and decided to preach confession and counseling like that’s a tidy solution to my struggles. Done and done.

Guess what? I’m still left with difficulties that require my attention. I’m frankly tired of Catholics who act as if God will sort everything out and it’s our duty to be quiet and let people do what they may without bothering them. Like I said, “Just suck it up. Blame your husband for your trouble.” I’m concerned about what my husband’s former mistress is doing currently, in the past few weeks, and that’s what I asked about.

It was demeaning to be preached at about my level of forgiveness or treated as if I should be doing something I’m not. I have acted with humility and grace from the beginning of this tragedy in my life. If you feel my request for her to “stay away from my children and family” in my message to her the first week of my pain was unreasonable, so be it. Maybe it was. Our faith teaches that we all have responsibility to act in ways that don’t cause others pain (whether they’re strangers to us or not). Our faith teaches sacrifice, and I accept that. But I don’t believe we have to be doormats, especially when there is an absence of truth to the situation. Confession and forgiveness doesn’t shield any of us from natural consequences of our actions.

I may just have to deal with her decisions to act selfishly without humility (that’s how I see it, and I’m entitled to that opinion). I accept that. But I was genuinely curious as to what my options were, as I do not take lightly any thought of causing scandal or telling one other soul I care about. It IS a burden. It is not easy to live with, for anyone who knows (and that is only a few people). She has been much more open to telling people than we have , probably because then she can claim victim status (which is ridiculous).

I thank all of you so much for considering this in a way that recognizes me as a human being in desperate need instead of an unchurched, ignorant woman or gullible wife. I never asked that this other woman be unwelcome at our parish or be barred from sacraments, or branded with an A. (I actually asked if we could attend separate masses in that correspondence). She has never spoken to me. Never replied. Never recognized me as a person at all.

By the way, I appreciate all the private messages. **My parting words from this forum are this, for those of you who were uncharitable, I mean … Please remember there are real people, with hearts and souls, behind every post on this site. Speak with charity and love.

Do you really want to act as if soft hearts or hurting souls aren’t welcome here, MaryT777? If so, I think you should question whether you are here as an extension of Jesus at all. Maybe you’re just here because of what you get it out of it.
**
 
Tis_Bearself said:
I said nothing about “legitimate reasons for infidelity” and to be honest, you yourself sound way more judgmental than the OP. Jesus told the woman caught in adultery, “go and sin no more”. He didn’t say “but be sure you don’t show your disrespectful face in the local church again either because you might upset people”.

It really saddens me when people seem to ignore every Gospel lesson on forgiveness when they decide the “sin” warrants some special “shunning”.

Have a nice day.
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I’m judgemental? Damn right!

This isn’t about shunning. It’s about natural consequences to actions. Forgiveness is not an all-encompassing action for human beings. Even after forgiveness, there is hardly a way to forget. It saddens me to hear this situation so flippantly brushed aside by you in all of your posts on the topic. I judge that you seem quick to dole out responsibility to my husband and quick to see his mistress as a victim. The only victims here were me, her husband, and the seven children who deal with the instability and hurt it caused.

I suspect you have not had to forgive such an enormous hurt ever in your life. Please don’t be so quick to judge those who struggle with hurt and forgiveness.
 
OP I am sorry you took some of the posters here in the wrong way, but I can tell it is because you are coming from a place of deep, unending pain. I do not think anyone here was being spiteful or intentionally hurtful to you.

I will pray for a God’s will & peace in the situation.

.
 
OP, with all due respect, it seems that your husband has been largely shielded from the public consequences of his equally-complicit actions. He has retained his favored status in the parish (your “model couple” description, held out as an example to all), retained his positions in leadership. I’m afraid that the lack of any public consequences for him may well be contributing to this woman’s own interest in participating. She sees his life carrying on pretty much as normal - after waiting a full year, for whatever reason she, too, wants to participate more fully. (I can’t begin to ascribe motive to her.) It doesn’t seem that she’s seeking positions deliberately to interact with him/seek his attention. She also doesn’t seem to be deliberately seeking your attention. There are a lot of plain reasons she could be there - a deeper interest in her faith, a desire to serve the community, it’s possibly the town’s only Catholic church, if I’m understanding correctly.

Having said that - she’s not the one posting, so we can’t give her advice. I suspect that would’ve been quite the thread…but, alas. 😉

It sounds like this is really eating at you. Understandable. (And yes, I’ve been in similar shoes, before I’m accused of being callous. Time heals, but the scars are nasty.) The thing is, you can only control you. It’s understandable to desire justice, and consequences. But there’s no graceful way for you to exact those on your own. Which means finding another option/path for your sanity. Honestly, I would abandon any hope that this woman would suddenly decide to avoid you. You can avoid her. But might I suggest gently that…living well is the best revenge? I’m sure you’re working through the stages of grief - eventually you’ll reach acceptance. Eventually. Until then, what does your conselor suggest? How can you…not “ignore” her, because that suggests a deliberate effort, and really is she worth that much energy? How can you “not notice” her, is more like it. The counselor should have some good ideas for you. Also, your confessor may have good ideas…because you don’t want to risk your own soul over her bad acts. Something as simple as making a sincere effort to pray for her in a genuine way may eventually bring healing. (Catholics help me out - isn’t there a famous Catholic female saint that wrote about dealing with unliked/unwelcomed people? Is it The Flower? I know I’ve seen posts about it/her here.)

Anyway, in my experience the sun keeps coming up every morning, which means one more opportunity to work on “stuff”. Be assured of my prayers on your journey.
 
pianistclare said:
Sorry, I’m not buying all this. All she had to do was simply not put herself in front of these people. She refuses, she wants to be in the forefront. Parish Council, Religious Ed.
All the wronged party asked was for some space. And she can’t muster the dignity to do that. No one seems to recall that the OP is the innocent party.

It absolutely does bear on the other woman’s actions on behalf of the parish. It speaks to selfishness and a lack of humility. Saying you have repented and actually living it are two different things.
We used to have a pastor that was oh so friendly and fun at Mass on Sundays. Everybody loved him! He was so great! He was so funny! He seemed sooooooo spiritual. But behind closed doors…he was a mean, spiteful, rude, and snarky person. Those people he schmoozed on Sunday? You couldn’t believe how he really felt about them, and he would say so, in the parish offices, often. It infected everything he did. It infected the entire parish.
His ministry suffered because he was fundamentally unhappy in ministry. But you know what? He thought everything was great! He thought everyone “bought” the false pretenses. He thought he was really popular! He thought all was well. It wasn’t and the church declined,and declined…great people left, disillusioned by the person who represented the Church. And you know what? Every other priest who knew about this said “oh yeah, he’s like that. Everybody knows that. You guys should know better than to trust him”. :eek:
Now, will everyone know that this person had an affair? Of course not. Will her students know? Of course not.
But repentance means kindness, consideration, and humility. And often, restitution. A small act of restitution would be to not “sit across the aisle” form them, as if that makes anything less painful. :rolleyes:
It would be a supreme act of kindness for her to honor the request of the woman whose marriage was threatened.

Why is that too much to ask?
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Yes but the reality is she is not laying low.

It is evident that the op and this,woman are at different places spiritually. We can’t control the actions of others or expect them to rise to expectations if they are not equipped.

My post about a possible answer she may get from the priest at her parish is perhaps another reality, and the op needs preparedness for this…

The goal I am reading here is for peace and focus at mass, and to lead her family to heaven without compounding anger or resentment for herself and family. And to be able to stay at her beloved parish.

I would speak to a priest only, and perhaps a spiritual director. They can advise on the best way for the op and family to grow spiritually from this and how to navigate this very difficult situation through prayerful responses, not reactions.
 
SuperHappy said:
OP I am sorry you took some of the posters here in the wrong way, but I can tell it is because you are coming from a place of deep, unending pain. I do not think anyone here was being spiteful or intentionally hurtful to you.

I will pray for a God’s will & peace in the situation.

.
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I seriously hope that the deep pain from this is not unending. I hope when the OP’s husband has done the work to rebuild his wife’s wounded trust that she will not experience anything like the distress she is experiencing now. I hope she will eventually feel that she and her husband have found a way to made a spiritual and emotional profit from a very bad situation that no one in their right mind would ever choose to go through.

I could not blame her if she wanted to change parishes in order to avoid this woman, but I can’t blame her because she has chosen not to do that. It is going to be difficult, because the woman is choosing not to put boundaries on herself that the pastor and staff of the parish may or may not put on her, either. I can understand why the OP doesn’t feel the woman is trying to rebuild the trust of those she harmed. This falls in the category of the things that you’d wish were different that aren’t realistically likely to be different.

Forgiveness, the letting go of ill will over a wrong, is not the same as reconciliation. A reconciliation requires the work of rebuilding trust and building a relationship on the foundation of that trust. I can see why the OP feels as if the woman who wronged her is not acting in a way that would reasonably rebuild the OP’s trust. If the woman who committed adultery asked me, I’d suggest that she avoid any parish volunteer work that would give her a high profile or make it likely that she would cross paths with the wife and family that she wronged so grievously. The OP’s husband is doing just that, so his wife is not suggesting a double standard. That woman isn’t here asking for advice, though. The OP is going to have to navigate life in her parish in spite of how little the woman who wronged her is doing to make things easier and better. I wish that weren’t true, but it is.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
Nobody should be “running anybody out” of a parish. Both should stay and receive sacraments. Whether a person who has had an affair like this (husband or other woman) should be permitted to serve in governance or teaching positions is a separate issue and one that can be discussed with pastor and/or DRE, but a Catholic should be able to receive sacraments at any Catholic parish and not feel forced to stay away from Mass and sacraments because some personal situation happened in the past.

Also, we are only getting OP’s side of the story here. We don’t know anything about the other lady’s side. For all we know she could have a past history that made her vulnerable, or the now-contrite husband might have pursued her. We don’t know if it’s easy for her to just up and go to some other parish; maybe she has good reasons for wanting to attend where she does. Maybe she has confessed and repented but doesn’t feel she should have to hide under a rock or wear a scarlet letter forever while the other party to the sin goes about his normal business at the church.

This situation is obviously not just “peachy” for anyone involved, but Catholic parishes are not like some Protestant churches I read about where if you anger some longtime pillar of the local church, you get a call or letter telling you not to come back to services. We are supposed to be inclusive. That means both parties should be welcome. Sit on opposite sides of the room if necessary but nobody gets booted from attending Mass.
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I completely agree.
 
EasterJoy said:
I seriously hope that the deep pain from this is not unending. I hope when the OP’s husband has done the work to rebuild his wife’s wounded trust that she will not experience anything like the distress she is experiencing now. I hope she will eventually feel that she and her husband have found a way to made a spiritual and emotional profit from a very bad situation that no one in their right mind would ever choose to go through.

I could not blame her if she wanted to change parishes in order to avoid this woman, but I can’t blame her because she has chosen not to do that. It is going to be difficult, because the woman is choosing not to put boundaries on herself that the pastor and staff of the parish may or may not put on her, either. I can understand why the OP doesn’t feel the woman is trying to rebuild the trust of those she harmed. This falls in the category of the things that you’d wish were different that aren’t realistically likely to be different.

Forgiveness, the letting go of ill will over a wrong, is not the same as reconciliation. A reconciliation requires the work of rebuilding trust and building a relationship on the foundation of that trust. I can see why the OP feels as if the woman who wronged her is not acting in a way that would reasonably rebuild the OP’s trust. If the woman who committed adultery asked me, I’d suggest that she avoid any parish volunteer work that would give her a high profile or make it likely that she would cross paths with the wife and family that she wronged so grievously. The OP’s husband is doing just that, so his wife is not suggesting a double standard. That woman isn’t here asking for advice, though. The OP is going to have to navigate life in her parish in spite of how little the woman who wronged her is doing to make things easier and better. I wish that weren’t true, but it is.
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I think the woman should apologize to the OP and leave to find a new home in another parish. The OP is the wronged person here. And she wants to stay in this parish, that is the least the woman can do to make amends. The adulterous woman’s husband has been wronged as well, but he is not a practicing Catholic so the church is not an issue for him.

Unfortunately, this is not what is happening. The woman seems to be quite brazen trying to be a CCD teacher and on the parish council all in front of the OP. Her actions do not speak of humility or kindness toward the OP. I wouldn’t trust her ever. And I think the OP doesn’t need this hassle in her life. So my suggestion would be for the OP and her husband to quietly leave this parish and find a new one. It is the sad price to pay for the adultery. The OP did nothing wrong and yet she is collateral damage of this affair. Look how this is tearing her up. Right now the OP needs to heal and I think starting in a new parish is the best way to move forward.

I wish you all the best, OP. You can get past this and your life with your husband can be better than ever.
 
EnglishTeacher said:
I would contact the pastor of the parish and set up a time for you and your husband to meet with him and tell him of the situation, and let him handle it from there. I can’t imagine that the priest would want this woman serving on the pastoral council or as a CCD teacher.
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So, so sorry you are going through this! I am happy that you and your husband seem to be working through this situation. I agree with the above, go to the pastor, but NOT the CCD/DRE leader as they may not be discreet with the knowledge. If after going to the pastor you do not feel your concerns were met, they I would suggest going to the DRE leader and telling her that for personal reasons (unspecified), you would demand that this women not teach any of your children. They can make accommodations in most cases. I wouldn’t want to leave the parish either. If the above accommodations cannot be made you might consider CCD classes at another parish, but I wouldn’t move my family to another parish entirely since it has been your parish since childhood.

Praying for you and your family…
 
I understand where you are coming from OP. This happened to me a year and half ago. We were married for many years and I never thought he would do something like that. The affair was only for a couple of months. They knew each other for years being in the choir together. Her family and ours socialized frequently. When she began talking about leaving her husband that’s when my husband changed.

I found out, on vacation, when I saw him texting and he wouldn’t tell me who it was, though I felt something wasn’t right for a few weeks. We ended up having a long talk. He called our priest, they know him well. He was told to stop texting and end it immediately.

When we got back, we went to talk to our priest. I would suggest you do too. In our situation, the other women was asked/told to stay at the other parish.

We didn’t tell anyone. We have healed, our marriage is stronger now. I don’t know about her. I spoke to her husband after it happened and they were getting counseling.

It’s painful, very painful. You seeing her in the church you have always gone to and she just started there hurts. I know what it’s like. I don’t understand why she won’t just keep going to the other one she went to.

I would not want her teaching my children either, and as a Religious Ed teacher myself, she doesn’t seem like the type person who should be teaching.

You seem to have your relationship under control at this point, I wish you well in your marriage’s healing. Pray, talk to your pastor, or if you have a deacon, he might be better. I wouldn’t tell anyone else what happened. It isn’t their business. Just tell the DRE that there are personal reason for moving your child if need be.

I would not leave my “home” either. You might have to just pray for acceptance if your priest can’t resolve the situation.
 
This problem shouldn’t be yours to fix. It is your husband’s to fix. It may be you need to pack up and relocate, to spare your kids the truth of what happened. I realize this isn’t an easy thing to do, but your husband created a huge mess that needs to be cleaned up. You are right when you say she has as much right as he does to attend the parish. I am so sorry you are going through this.
 
There’s not much to be done about the parish council. However, no kid should have to interact with their parents’ adulterous partners. I think the OP and her husband should go tot he pastor and explain the situation. This woman should not be teaching the OPs children.
 
Here are some thoughts
  1. Shunning the former mistress from the parish is wrong. She should be welcome to the parish for confession and help rebuild her relationship with Jesus.
  2. She should be allowed to participate in leadership positions as long as it doesn’t bring scandal and accommodations can be made for the OP’s kids. She was in an adulterous affair, not child abuse.
  3. The affair has been largely kept private and the OP’s status has been largely kept unblemished. The OP should prepare herself for more of the consequences of the adulterous sin. The sin may have been forgiven, but the consequences may not be avoided. If rumor spreads or etc… it will stain the family, and this may not be avoidable. Also maybe due to scandal of the rumors, her husband may lose his leadership position. Keep this in mind.
  4. Focus on prayers, fasting, and mortifications to continue rebuilding your relationship with God as the center of your marriage and also your husband should be contributing to this rebuilding.
 
OP,

after reading your post, I remembered a quote sent to me by a friend… It says :

Stop trying to fight for the positions in church where the number 1 position obviously belong to GOD

Does that ring a bell? Do you think God is sending you a message here? Are you willing to give up your Social life in the Parish to go to a new parish and REALLY PRAY AND SPEND TIME WITH GOD…?

I am sorry for your suffering. If I were in your shoes I would move to a new parish, give to God what belongs to God and start all over with my family…Friends from your current parish, if they are really friends would still be your friends no matter what…

Please don’t take my advice the wrong way. I know you have been hurt and deserve so much healing. May God grant you the peace that you deserve

God bless!
 
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