Advice from Protestants on Catholic Apologetics with Protestants

[traditionalgal]

On this board, we often see debates between Catholics and Protestants as to who is correct about a certain issue. This is a thread for Protestants to give tips to Catholics about educating Protestants about Catholicism. These are ways to reduce Protestant misconceptions about “the evil Catholic church”.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

On this board, we often see debates between Catholics and Protestants as to who is correct about a certain issue. This is a thread for Protestants to give tips to Catholics about educating Protestants about Catholicism. These are ways to reduce Protestant misconceptions about “the evil Catholic church”.

HMMMMM-- Well-- Can I be honest without sounding disrespectful

What URKS me the most is when I hear “Maybe they will come and joing the One and Only Apostolic Church and have the fullness of the truth”

To me you are telling me that the bible is not enough and to me just feels like a slap in the face to God. It also sounds WAY TOO cocky to me. I dont hear any humility there all I hear is pride.

The other one is calling me seperated brethren in Christ. If we are both in Christ we cant be seperated:shrug: We just worship God in a different church.

Please dont take this as an insult–it is just how** I FEEL**. So take it for what it’s worth.

 

[traditionalgal]

I come from a fundamentalist-evangelical background. Almost every person I run into from this background knows a tidbit here and there as well as misunderstood conclusions as to what they think Catholicism is.

Here are my points of advice when speaking to a person from this background.

1. Ask if they can name any people or groups in a consistent line over the centuries (pre-Reformation) who spread information on salvation and scripture outside of the Catholic Church and Eastern Orthodoxy.
2. Ask them the church affiliations of the men who decided on what books would be in the Bible? Think early councils.
3. Make sure you make it known that Jesus died for your sins and was resurrected.
4. Catholics are a billion member strong and over the globe over centuries. People in the know can’t be as geographically or time era limited as you make them. Does that mean that the majority of people prior to the Reformation went to Hell?

History, History, History-It can help them see you are Christian!

 

[dosdog]

On this board, we often see debates between Catholics and Protestants as to who is correct about a certain issue. This is a thread for Protestants to give tips to Catholics about educating Protestants about Catholicism. These are ways to reduce Protestant misconceptions about “the evil Catholic church”.

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[traditionalgal]

HMMMMM-- Well-- Can I be honest without sounding disrespectful

What URKS me the most is when I hear “Maybe they will come and joing the One and Only Apostolic Church and have the fullness of the truth”

To me you are telling me that the bible is not enough and to me just feels like a slap in the face to God. It also sounds WAY TOO cocky to me. I dont hear any humility there all I hear is pride.

The other one is calling me seperated brethren in Christ. If we are both in Christ we cant be seperated:shrug: We just worship God in a different church.

Please dont take this as an insult–it is just how** I FEEL**. So take it for what it’s worth.

This is off topic from my intent with the thread, but I will give you an answer. Catholics are going to approach themselves as THE totally true church just as Protestant denominations with Fundamentalist-Evangelical leanings think they have THE total truth about the Christian message. They should feel this way or they wouldn’t have any backbone to their convictions.

What my argument is is that many Protestants see Catholicism as NOT Christian. A faith rooted in falsehood and influenced by Satan. Catholics do not see Protestants in this way. In my opinion, Catholics are correct in that they recognize that Protestants recognize the basics of the faith. Protestants ignorantly ignore this about Catholics through a lack of education and prejudice promoted by their churches. I think that Protestants are wrong in this view and should at least know the facts BEFORE forming an opinion.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

This is off topic from my intent with the thread, but I will give you an answer. Catholics are going to approach themselves as THE totally true church just as Protestant denominations with Fundamentalist-Evangelical leanings think they have THE total truth about the Christian message. They should feel this way or they wouldn’t have any backbone to their convictions.

What my argument is is that many Protestants see Catholicism as NOT Christian. A faith rooted in falsehood and influenced by Satan. Catholics do not see Protestants in this way. In my opinion, Catholics are correct in that they recognize that Protestants recognize the basics of the faith. Protestants ignorantly ignore this about Catholics through a lack of education and prejudice promoted by their churches. I think that Protestants are wrong in this view and should at least know the facts BEFORE forming an opinion.

There I go again misreading the OP OOPS IM SORRY Thank you for your response and I agree with you that protestants and catholics alike should know what the others believe.

That is why I dont debate too much here because I dont know enough about catholocism to do so well anyway.

I just ask questions. I dont usually agree with the answers but at least Im getting an education on catholocism.

 

[Kotton]

Catholics are going to approach themselves as THE totally true church just as Protestant denominations with Fundamentalist-Evangelical leanings think they have THE total truth about the Christian message. They should feel this way or they wouldn’t have any backbone to their convictions.

Correct, and if we all see it this way there can be discussion and correction on what each believes backed with documentation.

What my argument is is that many Protestants see Catholicism as NOT Christian. A faith rooted in falsehood and influenced by Satan.

Rather than saying ‘Protestants’, it is the more ‘Fundamentalists’ that argue this way, as most mainline Protestants see us a Christian.

Catholics do not see Protestants in this way. In my opinion, Catholics are correct in that they recognize that Protestants recognize the basics of the faith. Protestants (Fundamentslists) ignorantly ignore this about Catholics through a lack of education and prejudice promoted by their churches. I think that Protestants(Fundamentalists) are wrong in this view and should at least know the facts BEFORE forming an opinion.

As corrected, I agree.

Kotton

 

[mozart-250]

On this board, we often see debates between Catholics and Protestants as to who is correct about a certain issue. This is a thread for Protestants to give tips to Catholics about educating Protestants about Catholicism. These are ways to reduce Protestant misconceptions about “the evil Catholic church”.

Oh goodie…in no particular order…

Please a word other than heresy/heretic. To me it just brings up images of Christians frying at the stake. Not good.

Please be very careful with the broad brush of Protestant/Protestantism. There is very little that is characteristic of all of us except that we aren’t Catholic. I know its hard to keep up with a gazillion or so denominations, but some knowledge of the major strands would be helpful.

Sola Fide and Sola Scriptura arguments are meaningless to most Protestants who are quite unaware of the terms. Be careful, these terms lack any definition in themselves and therefore are susceptible to strawman arguemtns.

Beware of logical fallacies. Although this is an obviously amateur web page, it is actually pretty good at illustrating the logical fallacies Christians use against each other.

Connect the dots please. Too often I read arguments like “They never found the bones of Mary…therefore she was assumed” in which ‘B’ does not necessarily follow from ‘A’. If there are other possible outcomes other than ‘B’ from ‘A’, you are making an invalid inference.

Show cause and effect please. Just because ‘A’ happened followed by ‘B’ does not necessarily mean that ‘A’ caused ‘B’ (example “the reason for a gazillion Protestant denominations is Sola Scriptura”). If ‘C’ is another possible explanation for ‘B’, you do not have cause and effect nailed down.

Yeah…and I agree that a lot of amateur (and professional ones too) apologists come off as real arrogant to this poor heretical Protestant.

Of course I could say some of the same to Protestant apologists also…but since you are the one asking for feedback…

More later as I have the time and motivation…

 

[rr1213]

My advice to Catholics apologists would be “don’t be patronizing”. Just because a Protestant does not agree with your splend Catholic apologetic treatise, this does not necessarily mean that the Protestant fails to understand that treatise. Many times I’ve read something along the lines of “currently you are incapable of understanding” the Catholic position or “someday maybe you will understand”. Maybe I understand perfectly well right now and simply find your position unpersuasive.

 

[Le_Cracquere]

In apologetic discussions, some Catholics tend to refer to notions of Church and sacrament in a way that their Protestant interlocutors don’t even understand enough to disagree with. For many of the cradle Catholics on this list, the idea of Christianity is not separable from the concept of Christ’s visible Church and its Sacraments–the one without the other seems positively incoherent to them. I won’t debate that point here, but it would profit Catholics to understand that this linkage between Christ and visible Church couldn’t be more alien to many Protestants. Explaining the Catholic views of these concepts to your Protestant brother won’t guarantee that you’ll win him over, but you’ll be less likely to talk past each other.

 

[zcharry]

Catholics do not have an understanding of outside denominations. They argue and make accusations lumping in all other denominations. Few know any history outside of the Catholic Church were some of these denomination come directly from.

The first major split came in 1054 causing the Western Church and the Eastern Church

Next split in the Western Church caused a three-way division, The Roman Catholic Church, Lutheran Church, and those of the reformed traditions. The fundamental differences between these three groups’ lies in their approach to the interpretation of Scripture and the role that reason plays in each approach.

 

[Stylteralmaldo]

Kotton:

…most mainline Protestants see us a Christian.

I’m not so sure about that. I know the Lutherans (at least WELS and LCMS) believe we are following the teachings of anti-Christ. We may be Christian, but we’re Christians that are following satan’s teachings.

rr1213:

Just because a Protestant does not agree with your splend Catholic apologetic treatise, this does not necessarily mean that the Protestant fails to understand that treatise.

I sincerely hope they don’t understand the Catholic teaching because if they did and still reject it, then they are likely on a path to hell. This is why we at least hope they merely don’t understand it as opposed to understanding it and still rejecting it.

zcharry:

They argue and make accusations lumping in all other denominations.

This point is a good one. When Catholics do apologetics, we have to keep in mind that we really have no idea who we are encountering and what faith tradition they espire to. Likewise, Protestants should keep in mind that not all Catholics are all that informed of Catholic Church teaching.

It’s good to reference official Catholic teaching documents IMHO to address what the Catholic Church actually teaches. Do Protestants agree with this approach?

 

[zcharry]

I’m not so sure about that. I know the Lutherans (at least WELS and LCMS) believe we are following the teachings of anti-Christ. We may be Christian, but we’re Christians that are following satan’s teachings.

This statement is not a completely factual.

The term antichrist is used only in reference to leaders of groups who claim special Christ-like authority over the group. We would not usually use the term for followers who echo their teachings. The Lutheran Confessions do not label all members of the Roman Catholic Church as “The Antichrist.” Making that statement, the Church or people of the Church, would be taking the Latin Quotation from “Of the Power and Primacy of the Pope” out of context. Throughout the Confessions, the Papacy of the Roman Catholic Church, and the Papacy alone, is labeled as the Antichrist by applying the clear marks by which Scripture says that Antichrist will be identified.
There are two main points that establish the anti-Christian character of the papacy. The first is that he curses the doctrine of justification by faith without works. The second is that he takes to himself the authority to make laws for the church that are not in Scripture. These two points establish that he is an anti-Christ.

This is the view of the Lutheran (WELS) Church.

God Bless

 

[mark_a]

Maybe I understand perfectly well right now and simply find your position unpersuasive.

This is the attitude that gets the most respect from me. Short, sweet, mutually respectful.