Advice on SSPV and Marriage

[ProVobis]

That’s true, both my parents and myself are proof. My father was Anglican and my mother Catholic. I was raised Catholic. My wife is Anglican.

It works because we respect each other and don’t try to change each other.

Makes sense. I suppose the real problems come up when the couple has kids.

 

[floresco]

Well, yeah, if one wants to pursue division and discord…sure.
Finger pointing is such bad form, and not at all what we Catholics should espouse.
Newsflash: Rome doesn’t encourage these divisions.
At this time in history, we should pull together, not argue about who personal opinion of the way is better.

There is no reason to think that merely using terms like “traditionalist Catholic” and "Novus Ordo Catholic’ will cause division and discord.

There are genuine differences in liturgical preferences and spirituality among Catholics. Rome does encourage these. It is possible to talk about these differences in a helpful and edifying way - even while using labels. Complaining every time somebody uses an identifying term does nothing to prevent division and discord. All it does is to create another thing to argue about.

 

[Elizium23]

There is no reason to think that merely using terms like “traditionalist Catholic” and "Novus Ordo Catholic’ will cause division and discord.

There are genuine differences in liturgical preferences and spirituality among Catholics. Rome does encourage these. It is possible to talk about these differences in a helpful and edifying way - even while using labels. Complaining every time somebody uses an identifying term does nothing to prevent division and discord. All it does is to create another thing to argue about.

There are polite descriptive labels and there are derogatory rude labels. The former is polite and the latter is rude. “Novus Ordo” has crossed the Rubicon due to its continual incessant use by Traditionalists to disparage and discredit the Mass. The Ordinary Form has a name explicitly given by the Church and it should be used.

 

[floresco]

There are polite descriptive labels and there are derogatory rude labels. The former is polite and the latter is rude. “Novus Ordo” has crossed the Rubicon due to its continual incessant use by Traditionalists to disparage and discredit the Mass. The Ordinary Form has a name explicitly given by the Church and it should be used.

The term “Novus Ordo” also came from the Church and was used much longer than the relatively recent “Ordinary Form”. The latter has only existed for 8 years. When you encounter it, consider the possibility that the people who say “Novus Ordo” do not intend to be rude. In my experience, they often don’t. Gently let them know that you do not like the term.

Knowing that you feel this way, I will make a point to avoid using the term around you.

 

[Walking_Home]

There are polite descriptive labels and there are derogatory rude labels. The former is polite and the latter is rude. “Novus Ordo” has crossed the Rubicon due to its continual incessant use by Traditionalists to disparage and discredit the Mass. The Ordinary Form has a name explicitly given by the Church and it should be used.

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Ditto.

 

[johnnyc176]

The issue is not the denomination

I definitely see an attitude of us vs. them and an animosity towards SSPX as opposed to other protestant denominations on this forum.

 

[Walking_Home]

I definitely see an attitude of us vs. them and an animosity towards SSPX as opposed to other protestant denominations on this forum.

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It doesn’t give “warm feelings” – when what has been/is coming from the SSPX side is – “modernist” flung at Vat II, the Pope(s) – the OF is modernist/inferior/protestant/etc.etc.

 

[SyroMalankara]

Would your boyfriend like to be called a “schism of a schism” Catholic? I mean, at least the SSPX is trying to reconcile, whatever the SSPV is, they think the SSPX is too liberal and are in limbo as to the ‘sedevacantist question’ - that’s beyond the pale of traditional or even logical. They aren’t even in reconciliatory talks with the SSPX. An entity unto itself: Pope, Magisterium, law, and arbiter. He’d probably refuse to marry in a “Novus Ordo” or in communion with any “Novus Ordo” Catholic Church - rendering the marriage invalid.

 

[OraLabora]

I definitely see an attitude of us vs. them and an animosity towards SSPX as opposed to other protestant denominations on this forum.

The issue, in this case, is not the denomination, it’s the behaviour in the couple. If it were a Protestant/Evangelical/Jew vs Catholic I’d say the same thing.

I know wherefrom I speak, I lived through this in my marriage soon after my conversion. Fortunately sanity, with the help of a very gentle monk, reigned and my wife no longer sees my Catholicism as a threat, and attends Mass from time to time and came with me to Rome for the last World Oblate Congress.

My parents were the example on this front. My Anglican father married my Catholic mother in 1955. They were married in the Church, but the deal was: marriage in the rectory by the priest, not in the church, and my father agreed that the offspring would be raised Catholic.

He took his duty seriously. If my mother couldn’t take me to Mass which was often as she was sickly, he would, and he’d sit in the pew through communion while I went up.

We could all learn a few lessons in humility from him. Alas he passed away when I was 12. I’m 57 and his loss still affects me.

 

[ProVobis]

Some marriages between two Catholics don’t work, as is seen by the huge number of marriage annulments. OTOH, some mixed marriages do work.

Very true and it brings up the situation where in marriage one of the partners decides to pursue a new line of faith altogether. Does that mean divorce/annulment should be sought, even if there are grounds for it? I mean what’s more important, the marriage or similar religious beliefs between the two?

 

[eightydeuce82]

There are polite descriptive labels and there are derogatory rude labels. The former is polite and the latter is rude. “Novus Ordo” has crossed the Rubicon due to its continual incessant use by Traditionalists to disparage and discredit the Mass. The Ordinary Form has a name explicitly given by the Church and it should be used.

Its only Rude if you think it is the term Novus Ordo is the proper term to use. Its not up to you to redefine the terms. Just like you cant redefine marriage or what is a man or a woman is. It is what it is…just because you find it offensive and the rest of you who are really over sensitive about this for some unknown internal reasons. there are just as many people who don’t find it offensive or dividing but proper to distinguish the two.

 

[Walking_Home]

Its only Rude if you think it is the term Novus Ordo is the proper term to use. Its not up to you to redefine the terms. Just like you cant redefine marriage or what is a man or a woman is.** It is what it is…just because you find it offensive and the rest of you who are really over sensitive about this for some unknown internal reasons. there are just as many people who don’t find it offensive or dividing but proper to distinguish the two.**

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Actually the reason is known. Just reading through the various toxic “trad” sites/blogs – it is clearly seen – the derogatory meaning behind the use of Novus Ordo.

Oh and because CA is not a flaming “Trad” site – it ends up labeled as modernist/heterodox.

 

[ProVobis]

The Ordinary Form has a name explicitly given by the Church and it should be used.

Perhaps, but the word “ordinary” can become disparaging as well. It has already been attacked in the naming of most Sundays (in Ordinary Time) rather than “nnth Sunday after Epiphany/Pentecost.” Just sayin…

My defense of the word would be that the Latin meaning of the word “ordinaria” is somewhat different than the English meaning of the word “ordinary.” or the Polish meaning of the word (“crude”), for that matter.

 

[floresco]

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Actually the reason is known. Just reading through the various toxic “trad” sites/blogs – it is clearly seen – the derogatory meaning behind the use of Novus Ordo.

It is common to find many people with a low opinion of the Ordinary Form on such sites and they generally refer to it as Novus Ordo, but that is not the same as it being derogatory. An example of derogatory is “Bogus Ordo” (I have really seen that.)

 

[Walking_Home]

Walking_Home:

Actually the reason is known. Just reading through the various toxic “trad” sites/blogs – it is clearly seen – the derogatory meaning behind the use of Novus Ordo.

It is common to find many people with a low opinion of the Ordinary Form on such sites and they generally refer to it as Novus Ordo, but that is not the same as it being derogatory. An example of derogatory is “Bogus Ordo” (I have really seen that.)

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While some go as far as “Bogus Ordo” – the “low opinion”-- is still derogatory toward the OF-- and some will go “seeking” for advice on how to tear down the OF – to manipulate others into the “mind set” – that the OF is “modernist/inferior/protestant/etc.etc”.

 

[eightydeuce82]

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Actually the reason is known. Just reading through the various toxic “trad” sites/blogs – it is clearly seen – the derogatory meaning behind the use of Novus Ordo.

Oh and because CA is not a flaming “Trad” site – it ends up labeled as modernist/heterodox.

the confederate flag doesn’t represent slavery either. Your argument is full of presumption and labeling. mirrors are your friend.

 

[Walking_Home]

Walking_Home:

Actually the reason is known. Just reading through the various toxic “trad” sites/blogs – it is clearly seen – the derogatory meaning behind the use of Novus Ordo.

Oh and because CA is not a flaming “Trad” site – it ends up labeled as modernist/heterodox.

the confederate flag doesn’t represent slavery either. Your argument is full of presumption and labeling. mirrors are your friend.

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The toxic "Trad’ sites – speak for themselves – so trying to do “damage control”/white washing the toxicity found in those places – just ends up superfluous.

 

[eightydeuce82]

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The toxic "Trad’ sites – speak for themselves – so trying to do “damage control”/white washing the toxicity found in those places – just ends up superfluous.

and the clown mass modernist ones do the same

 

[JackVk]

and the clown mass modernist ones do the same

In all blunt honesty, I don’t know where these clown Masses happen, yet Trads insist they’re everywhere outside of their own inner circle.

To the OP: GET AWAY! SSPV and their Sedevacantist ilk are a pack of elitist lunatics who will demand that you believe, at the expense of your own intellect, that the Jews, Freemasons, Communists, and Protestants are controlling everything from the Vatican to the price of sour cream. They also tend towards creationism, heliocentrism, and Holocaust denial.

And if you question them on any of that, or express any thought independent of their collective opinion, they will rapidly brand you a heretic and a Modernist.

 

[Walking_Home]

Walking_Home:

The toxic "Trad’ sites – speak for themselves – so trying to do “damage control”/white washing the toxicity found in those places – just ends up superfluous.

and the clown mass modernist ones do the same

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Oh yea – when between a rock and a hard place – throw in a “clown” Mass. Still doesn’t make toxic “tradism” any less toxic.