Advice please - atheist husband will not attend sacraments

[schaeffer]

As a mother, I DO feel for you, and of course when we make a decision to marry someone we never truly know what all the implications and compromises will be, and some of those surprises are hard to swallow.

But he is an atheist and he truly has supported the children being raised Catholic. As some others have suggested, try not to project what you, the children and everyone else might think or feel about his attendance.

If he doesn’t attend Mass with you, I doubt the children will bat an eyelash that he is not attending this either, there is already precedent. If you don’t make an issue out of it, it might not be an issue at all.

If there is already tension surrounding the faith issue in the home, perhaps he feels this is a way of drawing a clear line.

This does not have to mar any aspect of the event for the family unless the issue is forced.

My own mother didn’t attend my baptism because she was busy setting up the party at home. And she was and is a devout and practicing Catholic.

 

[catholicmom2015]

That is a good point about not making it into a big deal. My son actually did not ask why daddy didn’t attend the mass at Christmas. He may not ask about the communion, since daddy doesn’t go to church but I guess I just want to prepare for the question. I think he will ask simply because a lot of people are attending the communion who do not attend church with us normally.

Perhaps I jumped the gun but I told him daddy was not going to attend the reconciliation that just happened last week and he said why not. That time, I actually could honestly say that daddy had to help uncle S because that was the truth, and my son knew that uncle S had been in the hospital so he didn’t ask any other questions. I was afraid to not mention it and have him ask me in the church which would be worse.

To answer Jimdandy: we received a nuptial blessing as part of the marriage ceremony. The marriage was registered as a sacrament in the Catholic faith. We attended the marriage prep classes that were faith based but not as centred on Catholicism specifically.

 

[underacloud]

There are two issues here and you will have the best chance of success if you can separate them.

Issue a) you want him to support you raising the children in the Catholic faith.

Issue b) you want him to be there for your children’s important events.

At the moment these issues are mixed up. He doesn’t want to attend the sacraments because he would feel it is encouraging a faith he disagrees with. You are trying to convince him that he promised to support you in doing so, and now he’s digging his heals in because his idea of “support” is different than yours.

If you drop this issue (of support) I think the chance that he will come simply because these are important events to your children will dramatically improve, over time that is.

You seem a bit hung up on what sort of support he ought to be providing. Despite being an athiest, he is allowing you to raise the children in the faith. That’s pretty good support really. I don’t really see what further suppport he could offer without being dishonest in the process.

 

[skigirl1689]

I think that you’ll have to let the idea of him “supporting you” go, but as others are suggesting, appeal to him that he ought to go to his child’s special days much like he would go to a school play. It is pretty low to boycott your child’s special event and the message the child might get is that your own dislike of the faith is more important to you than your love for the child. I would approach him with that idea, and make it completely about just being a loving Dad, and not about supporting you in your religious endeavors. I’d also pick the battles - if you have other children, don’t worry about the infant baptism - the baby won’t care, and it doesn’t matter what other people think. Focus on the events that the child would really want to share with their father.

I agree. My dad does not go to church, though he has strong Christian beliefs, and my mom was the one who brought my sisters and me to church on her own. But he always went to our Christmas programs, our confirmations, and even made sure I was baptized after birth before they transferred me to a different hospital. He’ll come to church for the children’s Christmas program…which is kind of weird now because we’re all grown up, and now it seems out of sorts for him to be there.

I was glad he came on these special occasions, though I knew he didn’t agree with everything the church we attended taught. The thing that really troubled me was that the pastor disapproved of my parents’ agreement to not attend church together. He made comments in confirmation class to the effect that my parents shouldn’t have married because they weren’t in total agreement about faith; at fourteen I wasn’t prepared for this. This pastor did not know the meaning of tact, to put it mildly.

So, I wouldn’t worry about his words and actions affecting the boys if it has always been like this. It’s other peoples’ actions and words that will hurt more. Unfortunately, no one can shield them from this.

 

[EasterJoy]

I disagree with the “you knew he was an atheist” camp on this one.

This is a 7 year old having a big day. Dad is being a self-centered word I can’t say on here to be so petty as to not attend his own child’s first communion. I would say this if it were a birthday party, play, recital, or whatever.

The child is 7.

When the child is 18 or over he can deal with his father’s behavior however he sees fit-- i.e. when Dad refuses to attend his child’s wedding because it’s also a sacrament.

But you do not do these things to children.

There is a different place to wage an ideological war, it is not on the back of a 7 year old.

Yes, I think your reasoning is correct, but I will tell you that this is a major place for one of us married to a non-Catholic to find ourselves dead right. It is a mine field. I would not drag my spouse to anything at our parish, including our son’s First Holy Communion, when my spouse despises the whole thing and does not want to be there. I’d even be willing to give whatever explanation to our son that my spouse wants me to give, provided it is not a lie.

My children are Catholic and my husband and most of his family are not. The kids get that. I teach them to appreciate that Dad supports us, even when he doesn’t come. They get that. What would be a disaster would be to make religion into some kind of a battleground that comes between their parents. What is going to lose in that scenario is religion, even if religion is right.

I would talk to my son in advance and explain that Dad won’t be at church on the day of his First Holy Communion, to make sure he is OK with it. If he is not, then I’d go back and talk it over with his dad. It does not hurt to teach a child that as Catholics we have to realize that the whole idea of the first will be last and the last will be first means that some people going to Heaven will not be the first to jump into the Church. That part is up to Providence, and so we pray for mercy on us all and show our love by praying and being understanding about where those are who honestly do not have the great gift of faith yet.

 

[rayne89]

To continue to push your husband could dangerously backfire. He must have very strong feelings to not even attend a Christmas play of his son. He absolutely believes there is no God and he knows his children are being taught there absolutely is a God. Imagine if the role was reversed and you had agreed to raise the children atheist. Lets say for sake of argument atheists have plays for their children which emphasise how we all just evolved without a creator of any kind. A play where you child played a part in showing a Godless world. How hard would it be for you to sit and watch your child participate in such a play? Would you become resentful watching him participate in atheist activities geared as impressing upon your children that there is no God? Would you start to feel compelled to explain to your children why you believe there is a God? Could you keep from becoming resentful and feeling responsible for your children being taught something that you absolutely do not believe?

If you keep pushing your husband into seeing his children actively being part of something he doesn’t believe and has very negative feelings about there’s a good chance you may push into actively working against their faith instruction. And you will be in far worse off position then you are now.

I would suggest you completely stop any requests for attendance. Stop putting their Catholic upbringing in his face. No this is not ideal, but one parent not believing in God would make it not ideal.You will have to work much harder to keep your children active in their faith. But in marrying an atheist this is part of the choice you made. I’m sure you didn’t realize it at the time. Not knowing doesn’t change the fact that you must work with what you have and with what you wish you had.

 

[catholicmom2015]

Thank you all for the continued advice and thoughts!

EasterJoy- how do I explain to my child that my husband supports even when he isn’t there. Would welcome any tips or wording that you have. This is all new, I have not had to deal with this prior - as I said he was ok to attend prior sacraments.

 

[Estevao]

How about you explain to your son that your father is an atheist and hates god and instead of worshiping the creator worships creatures? This would be a good time to make him realize that his father in heaven is more important than his biological father:

“Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.” - Matthew 10:37

You can be damn sure your husband is subtly influencing your son to apostasize to drag him to hell along with himself. He already tried to stop your son from receiving forgiveness of his sins. That is literally satanic. You had better do your part to explain the fallacies of your husband’s worldview.

Also stop talking about “religion” like these secularists do. That is a non-existent concept if I ever heard of one. These secularists call “religion” things as disparate as ISIS executing journalists, westboro baptist cult members protesting funerals with hateful signs and Cardinal John Henry Newman in his study. It’s truly non-sensical.

 

[awsiukiewicz]

Hello!

I have been married for 10 1/2 years to a wonderful man, overall very happy. He was baptised Lutheran as a baby but is definitely an atheist as is his whole family - but to various degrees. As I was raised Catholic with a fairly strong upbringing - we went to church every week, I attended Catholic school - we did talk about religion before we got married. I was upfront and said that I would need any children we had to be raised in the Catholic faith - attend Catholic school, have the sacraments etc. He agreed to this. When we got married, he agreed to support me. Here is the problem- I feel we did discuss him personally attending the sacraments but maybe we didn’t get down to that much detail at that time.

Our marriage was blessed by a family friend and Catholic priest but we were not married in a church. Both our kids were baptised and he attended both baptisms. Right now, my son is in grade 2 and in our particular school they do the sacrament of reconciliation and then the sacrament of communion all in 1 year.

Over the last while religion has been more a part of my life than it had been. in fall of 2014,I ran for Catholic School Board Trustee for the school board (my husband was supportive of my efforts to run). I have also been attending church more and taking the boys with me. I never ask him to attend . I did ask him if he was going to come at Christmas this year when my son was a shepherd in the play. His response: I don’t go to church with you, why would Christmas Eve be any different? I guess in my head I do feel it’s different as my son asked to be in the play. I thought my husband would want to watch him perform and be there to support him.

My son’s sacrament of reconciliation was last week. We had a heated discussion several weeks before the sacrament where he told me exactly what he thought of the Catholic faith and that he wouldn’t be attending the sacraments. As it turned out, he had to help a friend last minute who has been battling a horrible alcohol addiction so he wasn’t able to attend anyway. I commend him for helping his friend, I know it weighs heavy on his mind.

I am trying to move on from this but I feel unsettled. I just feel this is out from left field and I do not think I am asking for too much. The next sacrament is Apr 12. Some of his family have no problem attending - they are doing it to show support to Peter. How I wish my husband would take the same view! Not to mention, I don’t want to have to explain this to my son, why daddy isn’t there. My husband said he would be honest and tell our son that there are different beliefs in the world and daddy doesn’t believe. I said we can’t be telling this to a 7 year old, he won’t want to go then. My hubby did agree that saying that wouldn’t change anything, my son would still need to go.

I want to reapproach this in a different way with my husband. I don’t want it to be confrontational. I do feel though, that him attending 5 sacraments over the next 9 years is not too much to ask. I want to ask him to do it as a favour to me and to support his sons. Marriage is a give and take, this is what I need him to give to me right now.

Sorry this post got a bit long, I just wanted to give some background to help you get the feel for the issue. I welcome your thoughts - thank you so much!!

 

[awsiukiewicz]

I can sympathize with your plight…however…, if I understand correctly, your ‘husband to be’ made it quite clear before you were married where he stood on the matter of Church…including but not limited to your intent to raise your children in the Catholic faith…good for you here…so…with all due respect it should come as no shock to you that he doesn’t want to be involved with anything dealing with the Church…admittedly, it is sad for your children…and one can only imagine why he would not, even given his obvious disinterest in our faith, want to be present for his kids…one can only imagine…it’s one thing ‘not to believe’ it’s another to be so vehemently opposed to entering the church…it would not be an admissin or anything…it amazes me how individuals who claim to disbelieve…go to such lenghts to literally oppose anything related to the Church…Personally…I’m not sure I could have married anyone that felt that strongly about such matters…but …obviously you love your husband…I wouild have my spouse just stay away…rather than have them set an completely atheistic atmosphere for my children who are sooo impressionable…my almighty God Bless you and truly I will devote my next Rosary for your family,husband included…Pax

 

[SJG1759]

I disagree with the “you knew he was an atheist” camp on this one.

This is a 7 year old having a big day. Dad is being a self-centered word I can’t say on here to be so petty as to not attend his own child’s first communion. I would say this if it were a birthday party, play, recital, or whatever.

The child is 7.

When the child is 18 or over he can deal with his father’s behavior however he sees fit-- i.e. when Dad refuses to attend his child’s wedding because it’s also a sacrament.

But you do not do these things to children.

There is a different place to wage an ideological war, it is not on the back of a 7 year old.

I agree 100%. Children get excited about lots of things that adults think are unimportant - T-ball games, recitals, science fairs, school plays - but if you’re an adult who cares deeply about a child, you still need to attend these things. When you refuse to attend something that’s this important to Johnny, he gets the message that you think he isn’t important.

I can justify not going to a Baptism; the baby won’t remember if you were there or not. Reconciliation - well, it’s not as if you’d be allowed in the confessional with little Johnny, so if you don’t come, no big deal. In the US, most kids are older when they receive Confirmation and will be better able to understand why dad isn’t there. But First Communion? This is an important event, and one that happens at a pretty impressionable age. I’m also married to an atheist and I would tell my husband that this is like a wedding or a funeral in terms of Very Big Deals.

One other thought: is there a way to compromise on this? Maybe Dad won’t go to the church, but would he still celebrate with the family after? The two of you could tell Johnny that while everybody else is at church, Dad is cleaning the house or picking up food for the party and we’ll all have a good time afterwards. The party may be what Johnny remembers best later on anyway.

ETA: I’m not suggesting you lie, but hey, the house will probably need to be cleaned before you have people over, and what better time to clean than when everybody else is out?

 

[rayne89]

How about you explain to your son that your father is an atheist and hates god and instead of worshiping the creator worships creatures? This would be a good time to make him realize that his father in heaven is more important than his biological father:

“Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.” - Matthew 10:37

You can be damn sure your husband is subtly influencing your son to apostasize to drag him to hell along with himself. He already tried to stop your son from receiving forgiveness of his sins. That is literally satanic. You had better do your part to explain the fallacies of your husband’s worldview.

This is not at all helpful. Whether or not his father is a believer or not God commands we honor our parents he does not make the exception “unless he is an atheist”. Not to mention it would not be true. Her husband does not hate God, how do you hate something that you don’t believe exists? This may be your interpretation of the father’s actions but the catechism instructs us :
2478 To avoid rash judgment, everyone should be careful to interpret insofar as possible his neighbor’s thoughts, words, and deeds in a favorable way.
2477 Respect for the reputation of persons forbids every attitude and word likely to cause them unjust injury.
Her husband did not say he hates God and tell her son that his father hates God would be the sin of detraction at least.

And if we’re quoting bible verses 1 Cor 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the believing wife; and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the believing husband: otherwise your children should be unclean; but now they are holy.

 

[EasterJoy]

Thank you all for the continued advice and thoughts!

EasterJoy- how do I explain to my child that my husband supports even when he isn’t there. Would welcome any tips or wording that you have. This is all new, I have not had to deal with this prior - as I said he was ok to attend prior sacraments.

I would explain that his dad does not yet have the gift of faith, and because of that he finds the sacraments very difficult. Although he wants to support the Catholics in the family, it has to go both ways, and the Catholics need to be kind to him and patient with him, too. You two have an obligation to attend Mass and receive the sacraments, because you have the gift of faith. When someone does not have that gift, we don’t try to push them into it. That does not work.

The day of First Holy Communion is a great day of faith. For those who believe, it is the most wonderful day, because it is one of the three steps of belonging totally to Jesus and becoming one with everyone in the Church–the other two are baptism and confirmation. For those who do not have that gift, it can sometimes feel very different. Some find it interesting, yes, but some find it hard. To witness the sacraments when you have no faith can be like going to a play where everyone can see and hear and understand what is being said, except you. I think you can imagine how hard that would be."

“That may or may not be the way it is with your dad, but he has said he would not be comfortable being there, and I have decided that it is best to be patient and kind and believe that it would be best to allow him not to go. I just want to make sure that this is OK with you, that you’re willing to allow Dad to stay home and wait to celebrate with us afterwards. Is that OK? I think if we are kind to Dad about this, it will be a sacrifice that will make Jesus pleased. We ought to keep each other from getting lazy about going to church, but I don’t think Jesus wants us to drag people outside the Church inside to be with him. Your dad has allowed me to lead you to Jesus, but he is not ready himself. That is why I think we ought to be nice to your dad about this.”

Whatever you do, explain it in a way that can be repeated out loud to anyone without harm. Hold your son’s dad in high esteem whenever you talk about him and don’t ever say a word that might be taken as looking down on him.

 

[EasterJoy]

How about you explain to your son that your father is an atheist and hates god and instead of worshiping the creator worships creatures?

If she believed this, she would not have married him. If the Church believed this was the case with all those who are not baptized yet, the Church would not give dispensations to marry those who are not baptized. Yet they do.

The OP’s husband has been baptized, but he has lost the gift of faith. If he says he hates God, then I would believe him, but many who hate religion do not hate God. Some who say they hate God do it in the same way that a teenager says she hates her mother. They do not know what they are saying. Some honestly do not think God exists, too, and instead what they hate is the untruth that they conclude religion must be.

Think of being in that awful state. Without the gift of faith being given to us in each moment, that is where every one of us would be! Yes, it is possible to renounce that gift or refuse that gift, but that is not for us to judge. It is better to hope that the lost will be found than to conclude that they are irretrievable. Our Lord died in order to retrieve the lost, not in order to despair, and He never said that all would be retrieved in the same moment. Some of the first will be last and some of the last will be first. Any of us might find this man we are talking about as the first one to meet us by the Lord’s side.

Always teach every child that God thirsts for every soul, including the soul of his parents. This husband cannot or will not approach the Throne of God, that is true, but he does not try to prevent others in his household from approaching it. He ought to be given some credit for that.

 

[catholicmom2015]

Thank you for the replies. To clarify, he has never said he hates God. And as far as our marriage, what we agreed to was what I could accept. If he had said I can’t have our future kids raised catholic, it would have been a deal breaker for me. That is why I am trying to be as respectful as I can. It is a sacrifice to have your kids brought up in a faith you don’t believe in and I want to be happy with what I do have to work with.

I truly do believe he has lost his way. Recently he mentioned that he was in the Christmas pageant as a boy. Clearly religion was a part of his life at some point. I can only hope for tolerance and ideally support in the future.

 

[KnitNut]

…I would be really careful about giving a seven year old any authority over his father’s schedule/activities. “Are you willing to allow him…” is something spoken between parents about a child, not parent speaking with a child, particularly about the other parent.

Along the same vein, setting it up as an “Us v Dad” is another example of a seven year old being put in the middle of the parents’ issues. He is SEVEN. “Dad isn’t coming - we’ll see him afterward and you can tell him all about it. He’s very proud of you.”

 

[catholicmom2015]

Just wanted to say thanks again for all the replies and advice.

I finally had a good opportunity to talk to my husband about this.

He has agreed to be home for the celebration afterward but will not attend the church.

More came out about how he feels. He is not seeing my son’s communion as a big event in his son’s life as he feels this is “all me” and this is “all about me”. The fact that I am raising the children Catholic is something he isn’t standing in the way of. But, he said he can’t believe anyone intelligent believes in any of it. He feels I am brainwashing the children. He is a stronger atheist than I thought.

Rather than get into a big debate/discussion which I know will not go anywhere, I just said he is entitled to his opinion but that I felt it was harsh. He knows how I feel also. He said he may change his mind, though it is unlikely. He doesn’t seem to be bothered that his family although atheists also will attend the church and ceremony.

Anyway, I will try and leave well enough alone on this subject. It’s just really hard!

 

[HelenRose]

Just wanted to say thanks again for all the replies and advice.

I finally had a good opportunity to talk to my husband about this.

He has agreed to be home for the celebration afterward but will not attend the church.

More came out about how he feels. He is not seeing my son’s communion as a big event in his son’s life as he feels this is “all me” and this is “all about me”. The fact that I am raising the children Catholic is something he isn’t standing in the way of. But, he said he can’t believe anyone intelligent believes in any of it. He feels I am brainwashing the children. He is a stronger atheist than I thought.

Rather than get into a big debate/discussion which I know will not go anywhere, I just said he is entitled to his opinion but that I felt it was harsh. He knows how I feel also. He said he may change his mind, though it is unlikely. He doesn’t seem to be bothered that his family although atheists also will attend the church and ceremony.

Anyway, I will try and leave well enough alone on this subject. It’s just really hard!

My husband and I will be married 50 years this coming April. I became a Catholic some 35 years ago. My husband supported me but was not interested in becoming a Catholic. I respected his position just as he respected mine. I never pressured him in any way. Seven years ago, much to my surprise, he announced that he wanted to be baptized and become a Catholic.

My advice is simply respect your husbands position. Let God take care of your husband’s journey. Your son will not appreciate being in the middle of this argument.

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

I’m happy the two of you have found some sort of middle ground on this.

As an unbeliever, I’d like to add that on questions of belief and opinions about organized religions you ask yourself if the answer is something you are ready to stomach. The great lesson I’ve learned is that the very nature of certain parts of the atheistic view are somehow shocking or offensive to believers. In essence, what he said is likely the “tip of the iceberg”. It is difficult to go into any detail when asked without it coming off as “harsh”, hence some of our attempts at peace through silence.

 

[ineeda]

catholicmom2015,

I married my husband in a civil ceremony. I was not a practicing Catholic at the time. I have returned to church and had to work on annulments,(both of us. his was formal, mine was simple) , and we are having our marriage blessed this week. My husband is non-practicing Orthodox. His family were not church goers, with exception of a few holidays.

I would love for my husband to attend church with me. He went through a lot to get annulment. There are many personal questions that must be answered. He believes in God, but does not believe in religion so much. One day, last week, he said that he may go to church with me sometime. I about fell over. That was huge to me! I am not pushing it. I will ask some day, when he would like to go to church with me. I think I will suggest going to Eucharistic adoration with me. All I can do is pray that he will want to go to church again.

It would be nice if your husband went to his ceremony, especially if his relatives are going to be there. However, he is going to be there for the celebration. He will celebrate with your son afterwards. Meanwhile, pray for your husband’s conversion. At least, he is supporting you by agreeing to send your kids to Catholic school.