Advice please - my dear friend has changed & strongly dislikes muslims

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SAVINGRACE

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Hi everyone,

What would you do if you have a dear friend of 15 years whose views have radicalised over the past year?

I moved to a country town less than a year ago. We caught up recently in the city and I could not believe what was coming out of her mouth.

She was saying some awful things about Muslims, that they are satanic and will take over Australia and the world and kill all of us if we don’t convert. It’s time for a crusade blah blah blah you get the drift. I was speechless and attempted to change the conversation. This tirade happened in more than 3 conversations during the space of a weekend.

My other half would just get up and leave the room without a word as if he was going to the toilet except he never returned. 😊 He said in private that he would not sit still and listen to that drivel.

She is a good friend and is due to visit us next weekend and I want to have a chat with her but unsure as how to bring up the topic. I don’t want her and my hubby to clash because they are both hotheaded.

I don’t want to lose her friendship. I suspect her new friends have influenced her. She has never espoused those views previously.

I’m really stressed because I don’t like ‘confrontation’. Any advice would be appreciated.
 
She’s scared. I follow all the national and international news, and it is scary.
I worry for my own descendents.
On the other hand, fundamentalist talk like hers is also scary. It’s of the same ilk of the Muslim fundamentalists and terrorists whom she fears.

Tel your friend honestly and simply that you don’t want her fundamentalist talk around you or your husband, thereby you show proper respect for your husband and for true Christian values.
If she can’t respect that she isn’t really a friend. If you lose her friendship that is her choice and you have only really lost the fond illusion of a friendship.

A person doesn’t necessarily change. She is still the same person. Her fears have highlighted aspects of her personality that were not previously evident
 
SAVINGRACE said:
Hi everyone,

What would you do if you have a dear friend of 15 years whose views have radicalised over the past year?

I moved to a country town less than a year ago. We caught up recently in the city and I could not believe what was coming out of her mouth.

She was saying some awful things about Muslims, that they are satanic and will take over Australia and the world and kill all of us if we don’t convert. It’s time for a crusade blah blah blah you get the drift. I was speechless and attempted to change the conversation. This tirade happened in more than 3 conversations during the space of a weekend.

My other half would just get up and leave the room without a word as if he was going to the toilet except he never returned. 😊 He said in private that he would not sit still and listen to that drivel.

She is a good friend and is due to visit us next weekend and I want to have a chat with her but unsure as how to bring up the topic. I don’t want her and my hubby to clash because they are both hotheaded.

I don’t want to lose her friendship. I suspect her new friends have influenced her. She has never espoused those views previously.

I’m really stressed because I don’t like ‘confrontation’. Any advice would be appreciated.
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Sadly, your friend is both inadvertently right and very wrong at the same time. Islamophobia seems to be running at an all time high, in places were Islam should not at all be of concern - Australia, the Americas, most of Europe. On the other hand, in locations we should all be extremely concerned with radical fundamentalist violent Islam - Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, other areas of Europe, Africa, parts of far East Asia - the topic is neither properly discussed nor addressed due to being wrongfully perceived as Islamophobic.
 
In Seattle the Muslim population is exploding I can’t go a week without seeing a women in a full face mask
 
SyroMalankara said:
Sadly, your friend is both inadvertently right and very wrong at the same time. Islamophobia seems to be running at an all time high, in places were Islam should not at all be of concern - Australia, the Americas, most of Europe. On the other hand, in locations we should all be extremely concerned with radical fundamentalist violent Islam - Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, other areas of Europe, Africa, parts of far East Asia - the topic is neither properly discussed nor addressed due to being wrongfully perceived as Islamophobic.
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Actually there are places, like in England where Muslims are trojan-horsing and taking over some schools, and various young Muslim people from England and other Western countries are leaving home to join the terrorists extremists in Iraq and Syria and the other serious hotspots, in their rampages, It’s happening in many countries you mention as not involved, and the return of these young men as seasoned terrorists, could be a concern to most countries.

There are many good Muslims, but as we all know, there are serious threats and much harm caused by other Muslims…
Whatever the answer is, it is not that Christians also become any kind of terrorist or hate-filled radicals.
 
SAVINGRACE said:
Hi everyone,

What would you do if you have a dear friend of 15 years whose views have radicalised over the past year?

I moved to a country town less than a year ago. We caught up recently in the city and I could not believe what was coming out of her mouth.

She was saying some awful things about Muslims, that they are satanic and will take over Australia and the world and kill all of us if we don’t convert. It’s time for a crusade blah blah blah you get the drift. I was speechless and attempted to change the conversation. This tirade happened in more than 3 conversations during the space of a weekend.

My other half would just get up and leave the room without a word as if he was going to the toilet except he never returned. 😊 He said in private that he would not sit still and listen to that drivel.

She is a good friend and is due to visit us next weekend and I want to have a chat with her but unsure as how to bring up the topic. I don’t want her and my hubby to clash because they are both hotheaded.

I don’t want to lose her friendship. I suspect her new friends have influenced her. She has never espoused those views previously.

I’m really stressed because I don’t like ‘confrontation’. Any advice would be appreciated.
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Get to know a few kind and patient muslims (if you do not already), and introduce them to her.
 
AussieTrish said:
Actually there are places, like in England where Muslims are trojan-horsing and taking over some schools, and various young Muslim people from England and other Western countries are leaving home to join the terrorists extremists in Iraq and Syria and the other serious hotspots, in their rampages, It’s happening in many countries you mention as not involved, and the return of these young men as seasoned terrorists, could be a concern to most countries.

There are many good Muslims, but as we all know, there are serious threats and much harm caused by other Muslims…
Whatever the answer is, it is not that Christians also become any kind of terrorist or hate-filled radicals.
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Please be careful when discussing the so-called “Trojan Horse” schools. We don’t actually know what was happening fully, and a lot of the rhetoric has deliberately exaggerated things and is being used by people who are opposed to all faith schools. If you idly stand by or, worse, repeat the rumours, you will have no leg to stand on when they turn on us.

The official investigations found no evidence of actual radicalising or extremism, but criticised the schools for things like “not teaching the children about the dangers of extremism”.
 
anon99031074 said:
Get to know a few kind and patient muslims (if you do not already), and introduce them to her.
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Hi Shunyata,

We have Muslim friends/neighbours from Indonesia. They are your average middle class family and moderate Muslims. I’m going to take Trish’s advice on her first post. If my friend agrees to not discuss ‘religion’ whilst in our home, I’ll invite neighbours from both sides of the fence over for dinner while she’s staying with us.

Thanks guys, I feel prepared now. 🙂
 
SAVINGRACE said:
Thank you Trish for your sensible advice. Will take it. 👍
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While in our case it is on a far different topic, we have TOLD friends that a certain topic is completely off-limits and we enforce it. We do it in a fairly gentle reminder and it works.
 
TypesAndShadows said:
Please be careful when discussing the so-called “Trojan Horse” schools. We don’t actually know what was happening fully, and a lot of the rhetoric has deliberately exaggerated things and is being used by people who are opposed to all faith schools. If you idly stand by or, worse, repeat the rumours, you will have no leg to stand on when they turn on us.

The official investigations found no evidence of actual radicalising or extremism, but criticised the schools for things like “not teaching the children about the dangers of extremism”.
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I agree with you, we have to be very careful about what we say is happening in this country. I strongly believe that we are never going to know the truth,if there is one thing, in my opinion, this country excels in, it is hiding the truth.
 
You can understand that the Muslims everywhere are getting extremely bad press. The Syrian crisis has now expanded into Iraq, with terrible massacres. Terrorism has spread across the world in the name of radicalized Islamists.
In Australia which you mention in your posts, the fear of terrorism is behind the public demand for the termination of refugees coming in boats from Indonesia as we do not choose who comes into our country in this manner. The Government has been successful in stopping this form of entry and we are now setting up structures to ensure that any Muslims that leave the country to fight in the Middle East will never be allowed back into the country whether they are citizens or not. ASIO, ASIS and the Signals Directorate have been given specific instructions to trace these 180 or so individuals that have gone to fight and ensure they do not bring back radicalized violence to Australia.
Given this atmosphere it is perhaps understandable that she is afraid.
It may be wise to attempt to temper this fear in any conversations with the principles of respect for every religion we Catholics have been brought up with especially within Australia.

However I have found this change of attitude in some of my friends who used to support the Muslim faith. They are immigrants themselves and used to support the right of Muslims to immigrate legally. Now they want Australia to change its laws to allow immigration from Christian countries whatever that means. We already have unofficial bans on some countries such as the Sudan which is not widely publicized.
Fear is a very potent weapon as the Jews found in Germany. We should be prudent but if we let fear direct our actions in a generalized way against any religion then we are no better than the Nazi.
 
Discerning13 said:
Your friend is right.
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you don’t use hatred to defeat hatred. loving a Muslim does not mean giving a hug to a fully armed terrorist. but if you hate them as they hate you, what makes you different from them? How can you condemn what they do if you also do the same?

can the friend answer these questions?
 
We must not give in to the temptation to feel hatred or contempt or despair. There is a fate worse than death and that is hell. That is why Christ taught that if your enemy strikes you to bless him and turn the other cheek. We are not to lash out or meet hatred with hatred or violence with violence. It is better to die with love than to live with hatred. Our Lord said to fear not him who can kill the body but who can kill the soul.

I am certain that Satan would delight in seeing Christians succumb to fear, hatred and the many sins that would naturally follow. Better to die than to sin. Pray for these Islamic radicals as they are so lost. No doubt they feel that they have the upper hand because of their violence and terror but we know they have been dreadfully deceived.

When these men of violence are alone at night, I wonder do they feel at peace with God and their fellow man? Or are they so consumed by hatred that they are already in a sort of living hell? Our Lord said what is it to gain the whole world but to lose the soul.

Of course I don’t want to die at the hands of some crazed jihadi, but if I were unfortunate to fall into their hands -unlikely as that may be at present - I would beg God to give me the strength to bless them and to not meet violence and hatred on their part with violence and hatred on mine. Because there is a fate worse than death and that is hell.
 
I’m more worried about the Buddhist threat in the world today, and the Hindu extremists proclaiming death to infidels in Sydney. The Jews are also at it again, firing machine guns into the air and announcing jihad. A lot of Taoists are just trouble makers.

Not so with the Muslims. They have been at the forefront of peace-making in the modern world. Not one Muslim has flown a plane into a building, planted a bomb on a train, raped (in company) an Australian woman or killed dozens in a Bali nightclub. They would not dream of massacring Israeli athletes; better to leave that job to the Christians who do it all the time.

I don’t understand where the anti-Islamic sentiment comes from.
 
Sorry, Jharek
I changed my post to go for greater irony.
Point taken about Hindu extremism.
I just don’t see that as much of a worldwide phenomenon, however bad it might be for the locals.
 
Spritus1 said:
We must not give in to the temptation to feel hatred or contempt or despair. There is a fate worse than death and that is hell. That is why Christ taught that if your enemy strikes you to bless him and turn the other cheek. We are not to lash out or meet hatred with hatred or violence with violence. It is better to die with love than to live with hatred. Our Lord said to fear not him who can kill the body but who can kill the soul.

I am certain that Satan would delight in seeing Christians succumb to fear, hatred and the many sins that would naturally follow. Better to die than to sin. Pray for these Islamic radicals as they are so lost. No doubt they feel that they have the upper hand because of their violence and terror but we know they have been dreadfully deceived.

When these men of violence are alone at night, I wonder do they feel at peace with God and their fellow man? Or are they so consumed by hatred that they are already in a sort of living hell? Our Lord said what is it to gain the whole world but to lose the soul.

Of course I don’t want to die at the hands of some crazed jihadi, but if I were unfortunate to fall into their hands -unlikely as that may be at present - I would beg God to give me the strength to bless them and to not meet violence and hatred on their part with violence and hatred on mine. Because there is a fate worse than death and that is hell.
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👍👍
 
You have to admire Muslims. They are true to their faith. It is the non-attendance of many so-called Catholics that threatens the Christian Church, not Muslims. In fact, I want Islam rammed down their disbelieving throats at every opportunity. I want a mosque on every street corner so these so-called Catholics can complain that there is no church for them NOT to attend; no baptism charade for them to go through, or nice wedding venue for them to use (and abuse).

I mean, look at Islam. It’s brilliant. The Muslims haven’t watered down their faith like we have, yet it is the fastest growing religion on the planet. How did they manage that?

Best wishes,
Padster
 
This is an extremely complex topic for me as a Catholic. Obviously I can’t say bomb 'em all to the Stone Age as some do, but on the other hand, I don’t want to bury my head in the sand like an ostrich.

I have read that there have been since close to the beginning two groups of Moslems: those who concentrated on the peaceful verses of the Koran, and those who looked to the war-like verses. Mohammed himself seems to have done the latter…

So this op-ed piece gives me perspective. The writer quotes a German who lived through WW2:
“Very few people were true Nazis,” he said, “but many enjoyed the return of German pride, and many more were too busy to care. I was one of those who just thought the Nazis were a bunch of fools. So, the majority just sat back and let it all happen. Then, before we knew it, they owned us, and we had lost control, and the end of the world had come. My family lost everything. I ended up in a concentration camp and the Allies destroyed my factories.”
(This quote is atteibuted to Dr Emanuel Tanay.)

Anyway… the radial jihadist Moslems who want to take over the world and install a caliphate to regain the lost glories of Islam–*they do exist. *

And the peaceful Moslems who just want to worship in their way and live their lives–*they also exist. *

The situation is very awkward because international law is based on the assumption that only nations are actors–everything else falls under consideration by national governments. The bellicose Moslems don’t see things this way and could even be considered to take advantage of the current set-up. The result is that “local” groups commit atrocities within nations, and other nations mostly cannot act due to the limitations in international law.

So imho in a way both you and your friend are each half-right. The problem is that each of you is missing a half; each of you needs the other to be more fully correct.

ETA: All that being said, I don’t think you need to discuss or dwell upon these matters. Far more effective would be to grow in holiness and pray.
 
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