Afghans accused of Christian conversion

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Hey, aren’t we at war in that country? I think I heard that we have troops in Afghanistan. I wonder why this could be happening? :eek: How many more Afghans have to die?
 
Sister_Amy said:
Hey, aren’t we at war in that country? I think I heard that we have troops in Afghanistan. I wonder why this could be happening? :eek: How many more Afghans have to die?
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Are you saying it is the fault of America that Afghans are executing people who convert away from Islam? Is it America’s fault that the same thing happens in those Arabian countries?

And you wonder why you’re all painted with the same brush?
 
Nine_Two said:
Are you saying it is the fault of America that Afghans are executing people who convert away from Islam? Is it America’s fault that the same thing happens in those Arabian countries?

And you wonder why you’re all painted with the same brush?
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I’m sorry–it sounds like you’re saying that Afghanistan is one of “those Arabian countries.”

I’m not blaming America for the absurd, horrid, contemptable, insane tribalism found in a country that suffers not only from nearly a decade of foreign troops roaming about and bombs being dropped on its wedding parties, but what could also be one of the most corrupt and inept governments on the face of the planet.

Surely it’s more complex than hoisting all the blame in one direction, right?
 
The question remains: What do any of those things have to do with the substance of the story described in the link?
 
Sister_Amy said:
Hey, aren’t we at war in that country? I think I heard that we have troops in Afghanistan. I wonder why this could be happening? :eek: How many more Afghans have to die?
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What about the Afghans that got slaughted under talaban rule? Would the Afghan people rather be free, or under a rule that wouldnt allow them to do anything, that kept women in the home uneducated, been hung if caught out of the house,. men got killed who didnt have beards… i could go on.
Im sick and tired of muslims saying that the usa has started this war etc. Afghan wouldnt have been invaded if the talaban didnt attack the usa first by flying planes into buildings.
And people would have still been killed under talaban rule.
The people of afghanistan now have education, freedom and a decent way of life thanks to the usa.
THINK Amy before you make such remarks again.
Back to the topic
 
dolphinlove said:
What about the Afghans that got slaughted under talaban rule? Would the Afghan people rather be free, or under a rule that wouldnt allow them to do anything, that kept women in the home uneducated, been hung if caught out of the house,. men got killed who didnt have beards… i could go on.
Im sick and tired of muslims saying that the usa has started this war etc. Afghan wouldnt have been invaded if the talaban didnt attack the usa first by flying planes into buildings.
And people would have still been killed under talaban rule.
The people of afghanistan now have education, freedom and a decent way of life thanks to the usa.
THINK Amy before you make such remarks again.
Back to the topic
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I think quite a bit, instead of just swallowing everything I read.

The Afghans were not free, but they’re still not free. As indicated by your post. A decade of war hasn’t solved the problem. Women still aren’t getting to go to school, the people are still impoverished, the Taliban is as strong or stronger than it was.

If the people really were free, you wouldn’t hear that they’re being accused of converting to Christianity, and having their lives threatened on account of nothing else.

If they’re so free, why are we reading this article? (BTW, I’m actually on your side here.)
 
Sister_Amy said:
I’m sorry–it sounds like you’re saying that Afghanistan is one of “those Arabian countries.”
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Culturally the very much are. They may speak Pashto but they live by a tribal law that from my perspective is exactly the same as that of the Arabs. But that’s neither here nor there.
I’m not blaming America for the absurd, horrid, contemptable, insane tribalism found in a country that suffers not only from nearly a decade of foreign troops roaming about and bombs being dropped on its wedding parties, but what could also be one of the most corrupt and inept governments on the face of the planet.
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Oh, so you’re diverting attention from the topic at hand then? Given that the thread has nothing to do with them you sure seem to be bringing them up a lot. Again, why do you wonder at the Islamophobia when you people are incapable of criticizing your own. I must assume you either agree with them, or you believe in solidarity to the point of idiocy.
Surely it’s more complex than hoisting all the blame in one direction, right?
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They would have brought converts to Christianity to trial with or without the NATO assisted overthrow of the Taliban (keep in mind it was the Northern Alliance who overthrew the Taliban.) Despite this you think it a good idea to blame the Americans. The US has nothing to do with this. Yes blame goes in one direction, it goes to those barbaric laws your religion has punishing those who convert away from it by killing them.
 
dolphinlove said:
So much for ‘no compulsion in religion’
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Unfortunately, it’s part of the Islamic dogma, no one dare to change that, Muhammed said it so his followers are following his instructions:

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 84, Number 57:
“Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah’s Apostle forbade it, saying, ‘Do not punish anybody with Allah’s punishment (fire).’ I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah’s Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.’” (E)

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 84, Number 58:
"*…Behold: There was a fettered man beside Abu Muisa. Mu’adh asked, “Who is this (man)?” Abu Muisa said, “He was a Jew and became a Muslim and then reverted back to Judaism.” Then Abu Muisa requested Mu’adh to sit down but Mu’adh said, "I will not sit down till he has been killed. This is the judgment of Allah and His Apostle (for such cases) *and repeated it thrice. Then Abu Musa ordered that the man be killed, and he was killed…"(E)

Sahih Muslim, Book 016, Number 4152:
"'Abdullah (b. Mas’ud) reported Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: It is not permissible to take the life of a Muslim who bears testimony (to the fact that there is no god but Allah, and I am the Messenger of Allah, but in one of the three cases: the married adulterer, a life for life, and the deserter of his Din (Islam), abandoning the community."(E)
 
This is really big problem

my country will cut my head of they knew i am christian now

why they dont want us to know jesus christ?
 
😦

The only answer I can think of is that it threatens the complete grip of Islam over your country and its people. Like how in the early Islamic community, leaving the religion was seen as an act of political treason (this is what Muslims on this messageboard told me to explain why Muhammad said that anyone who leaves his religion should be killed). Jesus’ divinity and message has always threatened the powerful, kings and religious leaders included. If everyone in Saudi knew the Savior, the Islamic leadership would lose its ability to control the people by reminding them of Shari’a, Qur’an and all the punishments in them. To know Christ is the true freedom that is incompatible with Islamic government and other earthly systems.

Welcome to the forum, Arabic Catholic. May the Lord keep you safe.
 
Nine_Two said:
Culturally the very much are. They may speak Pashto but they live by a tribal law that from my perspective is exactly the same as that of the Arabs. But that’s neither here nor there.

Oh, so you’re diverting attention from the topic at hand then? Given that the thread has nothing to do with them you sure seem to be bringing them up a lot. Again, why do you wonder at the Islamophobia when you people are incapable of criticizing your own. I must assume you either agree with them, or you believe in solidarity to the point of idiocy.

They would have brought converts to Christianity to trial with or without the NATO assisted overthrow of the Taliban (keep in mind it was the Northern Alliance who overthrew the Taliban.) Despite this you think it a good idea to blame the Americans. The US has nothing to do with this. Yes blame goes in one direction, it goes to those barbaric laws your religion has punishing those who convert away from it by killing them.
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Funny how you said I’m incapable of criticizing “my own” (whoever that is supposed to be) when I wrote a post sharply critical of the Afghan response. I’m not defending them at all.
 
The problem, Amy, is that your condemnation came with a heaping helping of “look at what everyone else has done to Afghanistan”, when this story is about what Afghans are doing to other Afghans. Unless you are trying to make the argument that apostates from Islam are only murdered by their former co-religionists in countries where U.S. troops are currently engaged in combat, I don’t see the point of bringing the war up. Surely this person would have faced death under the Taliban as well, so while I agree with you that Afghanistan is no more free today than it was before the U.S. war, bringing these issues into the discussion does nothing but muddy the waters and weaken your condemnation.
 
I’m simply challenging the weak-minded view that Islam is to blame for everything, and encouraging readers to look at a bigger picture. It’s not enough to look at a scenario and say that it’s bad (which it is), but we should try to understand why that situation occurs and scapegoating a religion, i.e., Islam or a foreign power, i.e., America is not enough. And we also need to examine possible solutions for that problem.
 
Since the potential ruling of death (and the pre-ruling imprisonment) is pursued on religious grounds, I think you’re barking up the wrong tree with this “Islam is being scapegoated/Islam is not the problem here” reasoning in this case. Those critical of the situation are not the ones making this about Islam – those creating the situation (law enforcement and the courts, acting in accordance with the interpretation of Islamic law that is enshrined in Afghanistan’s constitution) are.
 
dzheremi said:
Since the potential ruling of death (and the pre-ruling imprisonment) is pursued on religious grounds, I think you’re barking up the wrong tree with this “Islam is being scapegoated/Islam is not the problem here” reasoning in this case. Those critical of the situation are not the ones making this about Islam – those creating the situation (law enforcement and the courts, acting in accordance with the interpretation of Islamic law that is enshrined in Afghanistan’s constitution) are.
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Anyone thinking that Islamic law is enshrined in Afghanistan’s constitution needs a reality check. Stop oversimplifying the religion.
 
Amy, I am not going to argue with you on this. You are free to peruse the Constitution of the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan at your leisure. If Afghanistan does not live up to your definition of what an Islamic state should be, that’s fine. But it also does not erase the oft-repeated provision therein that nothing contravene the “holy religion of Islam”. Again, by declaring themselves an Islamic state, the AFGHAN STATE (not me, or anyone else) has made situations like this about Islam. If you don’t like it, don’t complain to me that I am “oversimplifying the religion”. I am not Hamid Karzai or any of the people involved in drafting Afghanistan’s law code that mandates that situations like this should happen.

Here is a list of contacts for the Afghan government. I urge everyone who is upset about this situation, no matter what their reasoning, to write and express their opinion.
 
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