Age and Maturity (Revisited)

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Hello, all!

I have read many comments on threads in this forum saying that when it comes to finding a spouse, it’s important to avoid maturity differences more so than age differences (within reason, of course).

I found this advice very insightful! 👍

However, since maturity is such an abstract notion, this advice also leaves me with several questions.

#1. How do you evaluate your own level of maturity?

#2. How do you evaluate someone else’s level of maturity?

#3. How do you accurately compare your own maturity-level to someone else’s?

Can anyone answer these questions for me? I would greatly appreciate being told about specific signs/examples of maturity, because I think I have a pretty good understanding of the more general things to look for (i.e. responsibility and self-discipline).

Also, I figure I should let you all know that I’m a male college student (because I imagine the answers can vary according to age and gender).

Thanks for the help, and God bless! :highprayer:
 
There are a few things I think of, but a big one would be behavior in a crisis or less than ideal situation. If a person constantly seeks to put blame on others and denies that they have any agency at all to influence their situation, that would be an indication of a low level of maturity, IMO.

We all have moments where we don’t want to be responsible, but that’s different than a trend of excuses and blaming.

(I’m 28, female, and married with kids.)
 
There are a few things I think of, but a big one would be behavior in a crisis or less than ideal situation. If a person constantly seeks to put blame on others and denies that they have any agency at all to influence their situation, that would be an indication of a low level of maturity, IMO.

We all have moments where we don’t want to be responsible, but that’s different than a trend of excuses and blaming.
Yeah
 
I have met 14. Year old boys that can work like any hard working adult male ,
Hang onto a jackhammer and shovel rock all day , and I have met 30 year old males that don’t get outa bed till afternoon because they played computer games for 20 hours straight ,
Couldn’t even butter bread, no idea how to push a lawn mower ,
What is Maturity ? How does one evaluate maturity ?
I would evaluate maturity by how a person conducts themselves , do they accept responsibility for providing for themselves, do they speak with respect or do they talk Dribble about things of no consequence, do they have a sense of hygiene,do they play computer games all night, it’s all really in the eye of the beholder,
 
Hello, all!

I have read many comments on threads in this forum saying that when it comes to finding a spouse, it’s important to avoid maturity differences more so than age differences (within reason, of course).

I found this advice very insightful! 👍

However, since maturity is such an abstract notion, this advice also leaves me with several questions.

#1. How do you evaluate your own level of maturity?

#2. How do you evaluate someone else’s level of maturity?

#3. How do you accurately compare your own maturity-level to someone else’s?

Can anyone answer these questions for me? I would greatly appreciate being told about specific signs/examples of maturity, because I think I have a pretty good understanding of the more general things to look for (i.e. responsibility and self-discipline).

Also, I figure I should let you all know that I’m a male college student (because I imagine the answers can vary according to age and gender).

Thanks for the help, and God bless! :highprayer:
39-year-old mother of three here, married nearly 17 years.

Here are some possible questions to think about:
  1. Is this person continually surrounded by drama? Is everybody always doing them wrong? Do they job hop sideways and down, rather than up? Are they always the victim of every situation? Do they feel the need to drag you into every interpersonal conflict that they experience, to slay the dragons that they seem to invariably attract?
2… Is this person leading an age-appropriate life style? Are they taking a reasonable amount of responsibility for themselves, given their age, life stage and physical abilities?
  1. Are their highs really high and their lows really low? Do they have ambitious plans that they talk a lot about but they aren’t progressing at all toward achieving?
  2. Do you need to (metaphorically speaking) emotionally pick them up and carry them all the time, but they never seem to be available to return the favor?
  3. Do they make a lot of bad decisions. Bonus points: Do they make the same bad decisions over and over again?
  4. Do they have expensive bad habits?
  5. If they have repented of past mistakes, do they have at least some track record of success in following the new regimen?
  6. Are they expecting you to fix their life? Are you expecting them to fix your life?
  7. Do they make your life better?
  8. Do they need you to survive? (Correct answer: no.)
That’s not exactly what you asked for, but I hope it will be helpful.
 
Many of the previous posters listed questions related to this, but it seems that most are geared towards self-centeredness.

Does this person think she is the center of the world? Everything revolves around her? She is “owed” things?

A mature person recognizes that others should come first.
 
Everything Xantippe said (and she said it well).

Maybe a few more:
  1. Is their environment better or worse for their presence in it? My last boss was well educated and intelligent…and often quite crude, told a lot of off color jokes, etc.
  2. Do they have some degree of pride in what they do? As Ross Perot said “if all you can be is a chicken plucker, be a great chicken plucker!” Are they trying to better themselves? Or do they float through life? Are they happy with mediocrity?
  3. How do they treat money? Are they a spendthrift? Do they save? Do they have some sense of being responsible with money?
  4. Are they giving of their time to others? Or is their fixation themselves?
 
Hello, all!

I have read many comments on threads in this forum saying that when it comes to finding a spouse, it’s important to avoid maturity differences more so than age differences (within reason, of course).

I found this advice very insightful! 👍

However, since maturity is such an abstract notion, this advice also leaves me with several questions.

#1. How do you evaluate your own level of maturity?

#2. How do you evaluate someone else’s level of maturity?

#3. How do you accurately compare your own maturity-level to someone else’s?

Can anyone answer these questions for me? I would greatly appreciate being told about specific signs/examples of maturity, because I think I have a pretty good understanding of the more general things to look for (i.e. responsibility and self-discipline).

Also, I figure I should let you all know that I’m a male college student (because I imagine the answers can vary according to age and gender).

Thanks for the help, and God bless! :highprayer:
Psychologists evaluate maturity with neurological scans, video games, and testing. Neurological imaging data shows, for example, that an adolescent brain has not yet reached full maturity. Statistics (from games) show that the average children engage in more reckless behavior than adults. Psychological tests show that decisions are made differently as people age.
 
For me, emotional immaturity would be the biggest barrier in a relationship. I wouldn’t mind so much if they were clueless about doing certain things, but if they had a quick temper (lack of self-control), liked to blame others for their mistakes (unable to take responsibility for their actions) and always wanted to ‘win’ no matter what (over-competitive in a bad way), then I’d walk very fast in the other direction!

I am in my 50s and now very happily married to the best man in the world - but 7 years ago, I was married to someone who had all of the above traits. In terms of being a practical man who could do practical things, he had many skills - but in a relationship, those things matter little.
 
Psychologists evaluate maturity with neurological scans, video games, and testing. Neurological imaging data shows, for example, that an adolescent brain has not yet reached full maturity. Statistics (from games) show that the average children engage in more reckless behavior than adults. Psychological tests show that decisions are made differently as people age.
Under the best possible circumstances. Unfortunately, there are people that continue with adolescent-style decision making well into middle age.
 
I tried to boil it down into one sentence and came up with this: maturity is the extent to which you do what you don’t want to do simply because you should do it, and the extent to which you refrain from doing what you do want to do simply because you shouldn’t do it.

It’s more complicated than that of course, but that’s probably a good estimate. As to age, it depends tremendously on upbringing. People who have been given responsibility when they are young are probably going to mature faster. People who have been shown good examples of responsibility by their parents are also probably going to mature faster.
 
Thank you all for responding! Your advice was really helpful! 😃

I’m unusually young for a college student, so this is an issue that I’ve been wrestling with for a very long time.

I think God wants me to start dating, but I’ve had several huge reservations about dating–and this whole age-and-maturity thing was probably the biggest one.

Once again, THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH!!! 👍
 
Thank you all for responding! Your advice was really helpful! 😃

**I’m unusually young for a college student, so this is an issue that I’ve been wrestling with for a very long time. **

I think God wants me to start dating, but I’ve had several huge reservations about dating–and this whole age-and-maturity thing was probably the biggest one.

Once again, THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH!!! 👍
Ooooh, yeah, been there. It’s tough.

Glad to be of help!
 
Oh, now that I know what you need the information for, here’s a thread I did earlier this year.

It’s based on an article entitled “Why I deeply dislike your older boyfriend”:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=948336

I’ve also been a younger college student, and it is definitely true that one of the hazards of the situation is not noticing when people are immature for their age or a relationship is exploitative.

Good luck!
 
Under the best possible circumstances. Unfortunately, there are people that continue with adolescent-style decision making well into middle age.
Particularly, addictions will manifest as a lack of maturity.
 
Hello, all!

I have read many comments on threads in this forum saying that when it comes to finding a spouse, it’s important to avoid maturity differences more so than age differences (within reason, of course).

Also, I figure I should let you all know that I’m a male college student (because I imagine the answers can vary according to age and gender).

Thanks for the help, and God bless! :highprayer:
Danus:

Good questions about maturity. A few weeks ago, I was having a fruitful discussion with a 23 year old Knight of Columbus. He was saying that a large number of today’s 18 and 21 year olds are not very mature when it comes to judgment and responsibility. Today, the average 30 year old man is what a 23 year old was two generations ago. Today, there is a disconnect with authority figures, parents who just want to be friends with their children, distractions from the media, etc.

I am in my mid-40’s, and I do recall a lot of my generation between 18 and 21 being very immature, even when I went to college the first time (I did a few dumb things myself too - I felt my maturity went down in my frat house days). However, I did feel that in my early 20’s (except for running fire department ambulance as a volunteer), most employers were reluctant to give me a level of responsibility that I would have liked to have handled.

Generations ago, a 25 year old had a higher level of responsibility, and I think some of that responsibility is still evident in some military commands (the average age of enlisted personnel serving on a U.S. Navy aircraft carrier today is about 20 or 21), but not much else. Look at World War II, where several Colonels (like Paul Tibbets, who commanded the Enola Gay mission) were only 30 years old, and pilots like George H.W. Bush and Donald “Deke” Slayton were barely out of high school flying missions. John Glenn himself was only 22 when he entered active duty as a pilot in World War II. The men who staffed the control room during the Gemini and Apollo days (1965-1972) were primarily under 35 years old. That’s a lot of responsibility.
 
Danus:

Good questions about maturity. A few weeks ago, I was having a fruitful discussion with a 23 year old Knight of Columbus. He was saying that a large number of today’s 18 and 21 year olds are not very mature when it comes to judgment and responsibility. Today, the average 30 year old man is what a 23 year old was two generations ago. Today, there is a disconnect with authority figures, parents who just want to be friends with their children, distractions from the media, etc.

I am in my mid-40’s, and I do recall a lot of my generation between 18 and 21 being very immature, even when I went to college the first time (I did a few dumb things myself too - I felt my maturity went down in my frat house days). However, I did feel that in my early 20’s (except for running fire department ambulance as a volunteer), most employers were reluctant to give me a level of responsibility that I would have liked to have handled.

Generations ago, a 25 year old had a higher level of responsibility, and I think some of that responsibility is still evident in some military commands (the average age of enlisted personnel serving on a U.S. Navy aircraft carrier today is about 20 or 21), but not much else. Look at World War II, where several Colonels (like Paul Tibbets, who commanded the Enola Gay mission) were only 30 years old, and pilots like George H.W. Bush and Donald “Deke” Slayton were barely out of high school flying missions. John Glenn himself was only 22 when he entered active duty as a pilot in World War II. The men who staffed the control room during the Gemini and Apollo days (1965-1972) were primarily under 35 years old. That’s a lot of responsibility.
I’ve seen it said that back in the early days of space exploration, the average of the NASA mission control people was 26.

On the other hand, it was a new field, so you’d expect the people in it to be young, plus there are a lot of early bloomers and wunderkinds in math and physics.
 
(…) However, since maturity is such an abstract notion, this advice also leaves me with several questions.

#1. How do you evaluate your own level of maturity?

#2. How do you evaluate someone else’s level of maturity?

#3. How do you accurately compare your own maturity-level to someone else’s?

(…)
You can’t, nor can you point out specific signs. It’s always in the eye of the beholder, and it always involves subjective value judgements, which are always bound to be controversial.

It is also easy to be tempted to start using maturity as a label to stick on people whose opinions you disagree with or of whose actions you don’t approve.

Still, one thing to say in response to your specific questions: people are more mature in some aspects, less in some others. For example you can be very mature intellectually but at the same time a little immature emotionally; the opposite isn’t impossible, either.
 
You can’t, nor can you point out specific signs. It’s always in the eye of the beholder, and it always involves subjective value judgements, which are always bound to be controversial.

It is also easy to be tempted to start using maturity as a label to stick on people whose opinions you disagree with or of whose actions you don’t approve.

Still, one thing to say in response to your specific questions: people are more mature in some aspects, less in some others. For example you can be very mature intellectually but at the same time a little immature emotionally; the opposite isn’t impossible, either.
People do mature unevenly, but you can point out specific signs that will warn you of the kind of immaturity that can doom a marriage from Day 1. It is spiritual maturity we are talking about, and some people never get there.

Many of the things correctly being cited here as a sign of immaturity are also signs of antisocial personality disorders. People grow out of immaturity (although sometimes too late to allow validity in their prematurely-attempted marriages), but people with personality disorders essentially never do. The greater problem is that they are masters at luring in and manipulating generous people, and can even guilt-trip generous people as being “judgmental” or rot like that for not accepting their manipulative tactics.

Yes, I mean that there is no prize a sociopath would like to snare more than a hard-working, sacrificing, big-hearted religious person who can be manipulated with guilt and false calls for virtue. There is nothing they want more than to be on the receiving side of one-sided giving and undeserved pity.

Watch out for:
Someone who uses flattery, charm, glibness, who is a master of drama and “making a picture”–not just frightful scenes, but also charming scenes and heart-tugging scenes
Someone who is concerned about image rather than being worthy of the image he or she cultivates
Someone who presumes that everyone “bends the truth”
Obviously, steer clear of someone who lies to you, but also notice whether the person lies to others. Do not flatter yourself. A liar chooses when to lie out of self-interest, not affection. If someone lies to others, he or she will eventually lie to you. Bank on that.
Someone who makes ploys for pity, especially someone who wrongs you and then winds up trying to make you feel sorry for her
Someone who does others good primarily as grand gestures, meant to be seen (including when they feel forced into making amends in order to not lose you)
Someone who makes big beautiful promises, but fails to keep them
Someone who has no qualms about taking advantage of the generosity of others
Someone who puts herself in competition with your other friendships or affections, especially if the person somehow manages to isolate you from your friends and relatives
Someone who blames someone else or become angry when caught in a lie, rather than coming clean and treating the person lied to as the only victim
Someone who moves fast and pressures you to commit quickly
Someone whose thoughts are suspiciously similar to yours–take your time, check and ask yourself whether they “think like” a lot of other people who haven’t turned their backs yet. A chameleon who is talented at conformity is not your soul mate.
Someone who does not delay gratification: does not do things for others without expecting thanks, does not do work today whose fruits will not be enjoyed for years, does not save money or make investments that will pay off down the line with interest
Given to jealousy, paranoia and getting back rather than being forgiving of the faults of others

You can see how all these faults are things that might plague a childish person. Well, they are also the bread and butter of a sociopath or psychopath’s life strategy.

You don’t have to decide if the person you are dealing with is psychologically dangerous or merely immature. All you have to know is that these are the marks of a person who is not ready for the trust of a serious relationship, let alone a marriage. There is nothing that should induce you to even consider marriage with someone who shows signs of these faults.

As for putting labels on other people or not approving of them–choosing a spouse is the one time when your opinion is the coin of the realm. If you don’t like someone enough to consider them as a spouse, that’s your choice. You owe no one any explanation or apology. It’s your heart, and you get to decide the one you will entrust it to. No one is entitled to impinge on that right, and no one worthy of consideration for marriage will want to do so.
 
People do mature unevenly, but you can point out specific signs that will warn you of the kind of immaturity that can doom a marriage from Day 1. It is spiritual maturity we are talking about, and some people never get there.
Not an expert on that.
Many of the things correctly being cited here as a sign of immaturity are also signs of antisocial personality disorders. People grow out of immaturity (although sometimes too late to allow validity in their prematurely-attempted marriages), but people with personality disorders essentially never do. The greater problem is that they are masters at luring in and manipulating generous people, and can even guilt-trip generous people as being “judgmental” or rot like that for not accepting their manipulative tactics.
Antisocial disorders are generally a more extreme version of more pronounced personality types. It’s very easy to see disorders in normal people, and actually it’s not altogether rare to actually be right because normalcy is a statistical average, as far as those go.
Watch out for:
Someone who uses flattery, charm, glibness, who is a master of drama and “making a picture”–not just frightful scenes, but also charming scenes and heart-tugging scenes
Someone who is concerned about image rather than being worthy of the image he or she cultivates
Someone who presumes that everyone “bends the truth”
Obviously, steer clear of someone who lies to you, but also notice whether the person lies to others. Do not flatter yourself. A liar chooses when to lie out of self-interest, not affection. If someone lies to others, he or she will eventually lie to you. Bank on that.
Someone who makes ploys for pity, especially someone who wrongs you and then winds up trying to make you feel sorry for her
Someone who does others good primarily as grand gestures, meant to be seen (including when they feel forced into making amends in order to not lose you)
Someone who makes big beautiful promises, but fails to keep them
Someone who has no qualms about taking advantage of the generosity of others
Someone who puts herself in competition with your other friendships or affections, especially if the person somehow manages to isolate you from your friends and relatives
Someone who blames someone else or become angry when caught in a lie, rather than coming clean and treating the person lied to as the only victim
Someone who moves fast and pressures you to commit quickly
Someone whose thoughts are suspiciously similar to yours–take your time, check and ask yourself whether they “think like” a lot of other people who haven’t turned their backs yet. A chameleon who is talented at conformity is not your soul mate.
Someone who does not delay gratification: does not do things for others without expecting thanks, does not do work today whose fruits will not be enjoyed for years, does not save money or make investments that will pay off down the line with interest
Given to jealousy, paranoia and getting back rather than being forgiving of the faults of others
Okay okay, removing mirror from bathroom.
You can see how all these faults are things that might plague a childish person. Well, they are also the bread and butter of a sociopath or psychopath’s life strategy.
Of course. But let’s see a sociopath behind every corner. 🙂
You don’t have to decide if the person you are dealing with is psychologically dangerous or merely immature. All you have to know is that these are the marks of a person who is not ready for the trust of a serious relationship, let alone a marriage.
Most people are damaged goods in some way or other, emotionally.
There is nothing that should induce you to even consider marriage with someone who shows signs of these faults.
As the difference is quantitative rather than qualitative, if you just simply watch out for any signs of such a tendency, you might actually run out of people to consider marriage with. 🙂
You owe no one any explanation or apology.
In theory, yes. But in practice nobody asks for marriage outright. Rather, we’re talking about one of the parties starting to make unilateral decisions that are simply not in line with the other’s expectations, more or less assertive etc., basically a falling-out often due to unwillingness to adapt.
It’s your heart, and you get to decide the one you will entrust it to.
Since when is marriage about one’s heart? 😃
No one is entitled to impinge on that right, and no one worthy of consideration for marriage will want to do so.
Again, in theory. In practice, when you are the one trying to make a silly decision, the other person may act in a couple of different ways, depending in individual character and personality. Some will ‘give you the space you need’, ‘respect your boundaries’ etc., whereas others will actively try to prevent you from making yourself (and them) unhappy, wasting that relationship etc.
 
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