Aliens & Christ - I Have to Stop Watching the History Channel

[Conor7]

I was watching a documentary on the History Channel some weeks back - not Ancient Aliens. During this program, one talking head made the point that the Vatican has made concessions for extraterrestrial life. No problem, so far so good…

Another commentator stated that, of all world religious including the three Abrahamic religions, Christianity would be the only religion to have core doctrinal problems should extraterrestrials be proven to exist. He expounded on his point further by saying that it would create problems only for Christianity because we believe that Christ died for human sin and there is no other way to heaven, but through him.

So this gets me thinking: for this to be logical, wouldn’t extraterrestrials had to have fallen from grace as well - meaning they too are sinful? Because if they are not sinful, they therefore would not need to be redeemed.

Help me wrap my mind around this.

 

[JustaServant]

Help me wrap my mind around this.

Remember supermarket tabloids? Ya know, the latest celeb gossip and lotsa stuff on aliens and psycics? The reason you don’t see them anymore is because they have graduated to Cable TV. Who wants to learn about the Peloponnesian Wars? Aliens and Bigfoot gather in the viewers.

 

[Verbum_Caro]

Conor,

Yes, your intuition is correct: in order for there to be the claimed problem (as stated by the commentator) the aliens would have to be fallen from grace. (Since his problem seems to be that Christ is the only way to salvation, which wouldn’t be a problem if they didn’t need salvation in the first place).

But note, his difficulty also presuppose two other things: that the aliens have not been preached the Gospel somehow (Angels? Space-faring disciples? Other?) AND/OR the aliens are not human beings.

VC

 

[bearer]

What God does with other worlds and alien creatures is His prerogative, and we really have no way of understanding the implications of alien life and its potential sinfulness. Sacred Tradition, Scripture, and the Church only address earth and humans. Everything else is rightly left in the hands of God. If aliens needed salvation, who knows how God would provide it, and through whom?

I really can’t stand those kinds of History Channel shows. It seems like anytime they feature some religious expert, he/she is out in left field theologically. I remember some Old Catholic priest talking about the existence of hell. Old Catholic priest?! Could you find a smaller sect of heretics out there? The Protestants, Jews, and Muslims they consult with also seem to be outside the bounds of orthodoxy, and they’re often professional academics, not clerics.

 

[KathleenGee]

I watched one of their programs where they visited the Vatican Library, and were projecting all sorts of things on the simple, smiling clerics who ran it.

Even the New Yorker wrote a better piece on the Vatican Library, going back to January 3?, 2011.

The History channel thrives on gnosticism and the insinuation that the Catholic hierarchy is deceiving people in truth about Christ and its followers.

EWTN has historical programs that focus on the actual intent of those who lived out their faith in the past, along with some reflection on their own humanity as well.

 

[PattiDay]

God created everything in the universe (and any parallel universes should there be any), so I’ll leave it in His hands. God is the Just Judge. And yes, you do have to stop watching the so-called history channel.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Why should we worry about aliens, we don’t even know if they do exist? If they do, God will take care of them because they are His creation as well.

 

[Conor7]

The History channel thrives on gnosticism and the insinuation that the Catholic hierarchy is deceiving people in truth about Christ and its followers.

Of course they are, they’re no stupid - of course they would want to cash in on current sentiments.

But still, I don’t think that this program was specifically trying to do that. It was an interesting point, however that I hadn’t thought of.

 

[PattiDay]

Of course they are, they’re no stupid - of course they would want to cash in on current sentiments.

But still, I don’t think that this program was specifically trying to do that. It was an interesting point, however that I hadn’t thought of.

That’s what the so-called history channel does. They cash in. They are not trying to present Truth, just create sensationalism. They usually have some really crazy programs around Easter.

 

[Aelred_Minor]

Would there be doctrinal problems if intelligent extraterrestrial life were discovered? Not that I’m aware of. Would there be theological difficulties? You bet, but that’s a very different level of consideration.

 

[Khalid]

Another commentator stated that, of all world religious including the three Abrahamic religions, Christianity would be the only religion to have core doctrinal problems should extraterrestrials be proven to exist. He expounded on his point further by saying that it would create problems only for Christianity because we believe that Christ died for human sin and there is no other way to heaven, but through him.

CS Lewis tackled this in one of his books, Mere Christianity or Miracles, seventy years ago. There’s no reason why 1) if other races were created, they would have necessarily fallen, 2) if they fell, there’s no reason the redemption on earth couldn’t be universal, and 3) there’s no reason that all races couldn’t have been redeemed by Jesus.

I think Islam pretty much demands aliens, with the idea of Jesus, who flew up to heaven (like Muhammad, who was teleported through seven heavens 600 years later) is going to fly back down and land in a yellow robe in the middle of Syria, and start breaking crosses, killing pigs, and forcibly converting everyone else, and killing those who don’t convert.

 

[Trishie]

So this gets me thinking: for this to be logical, wouldn’t extraterrestrials had to have fallen from grace as well - meaning they too are sinful? Because if they are not sinful, they therefore would not need to be redeemed.

Help me wrap my mind around this.

Some of the Angels did sin. At a stretch you could consider them extraterrestrials. And because of their glorious and elevated nature they didn’t have a Redeemer. God concedes for us because of our physical nature which blurs our spiritual purity.

Conor, as God is God, God of all creation and of the Universe, way beyond our comprehension…even the dimensions of space are beyond our ability to really absorb even if we deal with the facts we have learned, too vast. As God has revealed nothing of any possible creature outside earth other than the Angels who need no physical planet, we have to understand that God has things in hand in a way that won’t conflict. Jesus is God son of God, and His influence extends throughout the universe however that translate in God.

As you know, St Paul said that we see through a glass darkly and understand in a limited way, but what is still to be revealed, when we die, is beyond our capacity to know. History Channel will continue to try to explain in human terms but we need to maintain faith in God’s immense, as yet unknown truth.

That’s my thought, anyway.

“How rich are the depths of God—how deep His wisdom and knowledge–and how impossible to penetrate His motives or understand His methods! All that exists comes from Him; all is by Him and for Him. To Him is glory forever! Amen.” [Romans. 11:33-36]

Actually, just now, trawling through my journal I found one of my several attempt to view such things. Obviously I posted this for someone else, but this is just in the way of emphasizing the mystery rather than directly answering your question:

"*I hear what you are saying, however,
Whatever way God expresses love to us, including in the ways mentioned, we are dealing with a Person and a Power way beyond any possibility of our capacity and understanding, so God is going to have to speak to us through signs and symbols, some language or other, visual, aural, whatever, whichever way God ‘speaks’ to us.

As St Paul said, we now see through a glass darkly until after we are born into eternal life.
Perhaps trying to understand God as God is, is like an unborn child trying to envison and understand the life that follows birth, the explosion of experiences beyond his/her wildest imagination! Within the unborn’s world there are muffled sounds and awareness of some movement in the fluid warmth and security, with sometimes hints of second-hand anxiety and sense of unease…but everything is vague, hidden, nothing has unfolded, nothing makes sense but the child’s present, very limited experience. The unborn child has no conception of the wonders and sights and sounds and experiences that will follow birth and unfold during life on earth.

We are enwombed in this second existence, and within it, we understand according to our circumscribed present and possible experience…but we await birth into a third life, a life which also we cannot conceive of, vast, and wonderful beyond the understanding of our small human brain and clouded human soul.

If we fail to know God, to know who we really are in God, as we struggle in this womb of life on earth, is this so surprising, that we are mystified and even at times disappointed in this God whom we think we know but cannot but faintly know now? We can only continue to have faith in the God who became one of us to save us along with the teachings, gifts and guideposts He gives life to, and the witness of those who interpret His love into their lives."*

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

Some of the Angels did sin. At a stretch you could consider them extraterrestrials. And because of their glorious and elevated nature they didn’t have a Redeemer. God concedes for us because of our physical nature which blurs our spiritual purity.

Conor, as God is God, God of all creation and of the Universe, way beyond our comprehension…even the dimensions of space are beyond our ability to really absorb even if we deal with the facts we have learned, too vast. As God has revealed nothing of any possible creature outside earth other than the Angels who need no physical planet, we have to understand that God has things in hand in a way that won’t conflict. Jesus is God son of God, and His influence extends throughout the universe however that translate in God.

As you know, St Paul said that we see through a glass darkly and understand in a limited way, but what is still to be revealed, when we die, is beyond our capacity to know. History Channel will continue to try to explain in human terms but we need to maintain faith in God’s immense, as yet unknown truth.

That’s my thought, anyway.

“How rich are the depths of God—how deep His wisdom and knowledge–and how impossible to penetrate His motives or understand His methods! All that exists comes from Him; all is by Him and for Him. To Him is glory forever! Amen.” [Romans. 11:33-36]

Actually, just now, trawling through my journal I found one of my several attempt to view such things. Obviously I posted this for someone else, but this is just in the way of emphasizing the mystery rather than directly answering your question:

"*I hear what you are saying, however,
Whatever way God expresses love to us, including in the ways mentioned, we are dealing with a Person and a Power way beyond any possibility of our capacity and understanding, so God is going to have to speak to us through signs and symbols, some language or other, visual, aural, whatever, whichever way God ‘speaks’ to us.

As St Paul said, we now see through a glass darkly until after we are born into eternal life.
Perhaps trying to understand God as God is, is like an unborn child trying to envison and understand the life that follows birth, the explosion of experiences beyond his/her wildest imagination! Within the unborn’s world there are muffled sounds and awareness of some movement in the fluid warmth and security, with sometimes hints of second-hand anxiety and sense of unease…but everything is vague, hidden, nothing has unfolded, nothing makes sense but the child’s present, very limited experience. The unborn child has no conception of the wonders and sights and sounds and experiences that will follow birth and unfold during life on earth.

We are enwombed in this second existence, and within it, we understand according to our circumscribed present and possible experience…but we await birth into a third life, a life which also we cannot conceive of, vast, and wonderful beyond the understanding of our small human brain and clouded human soul.

If we fail to know God, to know who we really are in God, as we struggle in this womb of life on earth, is this so surprising, that we are mystified and even at times disappointed in this God whom we think we know but cannot but faintly know now? We can only continue to have faith in the God who became one of us to save us along with the teachings, gifts and guideposts He gives life to, and the witness of those who interpret His love into their lives."*

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

That’s what the so-called history channel does. They cash in. They are not trying to present Truth, just create sensationalism. They usually have some really crazy programs around Easter.

I think that they are simply trying to “make money” (like the rest of us do)------AND also trying to not-so-subtly trying to advance secular, anti-Catholic ideas with overtones of New Ageism and Gnosticism.

 

[Bob_Crowley]

I was watching a documentary on the History Channel some weeks back - not Ancient Aliens. During this program, one talking head made the point that the Vatican has made concessions for extraterrestrial life. No problem, so far so good…

Another commentator stated that, of all world religious including the three Abrahamic religions, Christianity would be the only religion to have core doctrinal problems should extraterrestrials be proven to exist. He expounded on his point further by saying that it would create problems only for Christianity because we believe that Christ died for human sin and there is no other way to heaven, but through him.

So this gets me thinking: for this to be logical, wouldn’t extraterrestrials had to have fallen from grace as well - meaning they too are sinful? Because if they are not sinful, they therefore would not need to be redeemed.

Help me wrap my mind around this.

I’ll worry about it when we get to it. First of all we don’t know if alien life exists or not.

Secondly we don’t know if it is fallen or not.

Thirdly we don’t know if there’s been a redemption story in their own history if they have fallen.

As for “alien” life, there already exist spiritual “aliens” ie. angels and demons, but you won’t find the talking heads talking about them, yet they definitely exist, and are around us at all times.

In other words, the talking heads ignore the reaiity of what is definitely known to exist, and pontificate instead on hypothetical aliens with a hypothetical pure or fallen state and a hypothetical point of contact. I’ll worry about it when we get to it.

 

[Hesychios]

I don’t watch it regularly (except I sometimes borrrow DVD’s from the library), but I think the History Channel does not normally produce it’s own stuff, it does this on a contract basis with independents who would be responsible for the content. Next time, check the credits carefully.

There is always a distinction between fact and opinion, one we have to look for even in forum threads here. I am of the opinion most producers of those programs would’nt be able to hold their own in a thread here. I am not claiming that they are incapable of producing a good and accurate program, and clearly one can learn and see some things available hardly anywhere else.

The revenue stream is very important, truth and interpretation is not so important. The episode has to sell.

It is an entertainment medium, not a university.

 

[Leegal]

I was watching a documentary on the History Channel some weeks back - not Ancient Aliens. During this program, one talking head made the point that the Vatican has made concessions for extraterrestrial life. No problem, so far so good…

Another commentator stated that, of all world religious including the three Abrahamic religions, Christianity would be the only religion to have core doctrinal problems should extraterrestrials be proven to exist. He expounded on his point further by saying that it would create problems only for Christianity because we believe that Christ died for human sin and there is no other way to heaven, but through him.

So this gets me thinking: for this to be logical, wouldn’t extraterrestrials had to have fallen from grace as well - meaning they too are sinful? Because if they are not sinful, they therefore would not need to be redeemed.

Help me wrap my mind around this.

I did hear one thing. Assuming that God has created life on other planets, and the environment has to be made exacting to support life, there’s no reason to think they will look much, if any, different, than us. If that’s true, and why would it not be, then why would there not be original sin, a redemption, the Birth, the Crucifixion, the Resurrection.

God is outside of time. Time is a temporal notion. There might not have to be the necessity for two of everything, assuming there were two creations. I know I confused you. So am I.

 

[Khalid]

I think that they are simply trying to “make money” (like the rest of us do)------AND also trying to not-so-subtly trying to advance secular, anti-Catholic ideas with overtones of New Ageism and Gnosticism.

The “history” channel is more about “current events”, “conspiracy theories”, and “alternate histories”. There’s no doubt that it has a Gnostic/New Age agenda, but I think that’s as much a vicious circle to do with the people who watch it in the first place - conspiracy theorists and alternative historians and fringe elements tend to be more in to syncretism, especially in its modern form, Gnosticism (as represented by Ascended Masterism, Theosophy, and Scientology), and the kind of “gnosticism” that is ancient indeed, that of Zoroaster and certain of the Hindus. (Islam is even more conspiracy-oriented, but television is a minor or great sin in Islam, depending on the sect, and impious by all measures: nonetheless, that’s likely why - in accord with the other reasons that other networks give it a similar treatment - that if Islam is mentioned on the History Channel, it’s in an absolutely glowing light, and those conspiracy theories that Muslims love - 9/11 for example - are given time, and the mainstream views are not. However, Muslims are a tiny market for television, but are very vocal and violent when they feel offended in the slightest.)

The History Channel is showing more and more utterly paranoid, pseudo-history conspiracy theory tripe with every passing year, like the “Gestalt” or “Zeitgeist” films (I forget the name, but know it was one of those concepts), which are produced by people who are nearly as off-the-wall and off their rockers (and medications) as David Icke, as near as I can tell: independent nutters, not actual journalists. (There’s some evidence in this when if the History Channel has a show on religion, it counts Karen Armstrong as an “expert” opinion - Dan Brown and Elaine Pagels are more “experts” on religion - and far more honest and truthful - than is Karen Armstrong. Hell, I would wager 10 to 1 that the Dalai Lama is a more fair and balanced neutral and honest observer of intellect when it comes to Christianity than Armstrong, Brown, or Pagels are.)

Anti-Catholic? Certainly, but I think, again, that it has as much to do with pandering to the audience as it does with manufacturing opinion. Catholics (and Christians in general) are the last group of people in the West that can be legally and legitimately discriminated against and excluded from the public sphere with no recourse, and no threat of reprisal or embargo (as happens when even the slightest truth about Islam trickles out of the underground and in to the mainstream).

 

[Telstar]

I was watching a documentary on the History Channel some weeks back - not Ancient Aliens. During this program, one talking head made the point that the Vatican has made concessions for extraterrestrial life. No problem, so far so good…

Another commentator stated that, of all world religious including the three Abrahamic religions, Christianity would be the only religion to have core doctrinal problems should extraterrestrials be proven to exist. He expounded on his point further by saying that it would create problems only for Christianity because we believe that Christ died for human sin and there is no other way to heaven, but through him.

I think I saw that program, too. It annoys me when some supposed ‘experts’ in UFOs, or alien ‘activity’, or some other pseudoscience make such idiotic statements. But, it makes me even more livid when people, that claim to be so well educated, make statements about what the Catholic Church would say or do in their hypothetical situations, when they clearly have no idea what they’re talking about.

But, one of my many weaknesses, is that I love to watch “Ancient Aliens” (and all of the other foolish programs that the History Channel produces), just to see how far “out there” they go in each episode. My sons laugh at me for watching them because I tend to sit there and make fun of almost everything they say. Sometimes, they really tick me off and I end up yelling at the TV, as if they could actually hear me telling them they should just substitute the word ‘alien’ with the words God, angel or demon, and they might actually begin to understand what they’re talking about a little better. But, they always do the opposite. They try to pass off anything that refers to God, angels or demons as the work of ‘aliens’ or ‘ancient astronauts’.

Whenever we watch it, we tend to just mock their silly theories more than anything else. I especially get a kick out of the way some of them always mispronounce things like “ancient asenauts” and “exa terresrials” (it’s a running joke that we all share when referring to the show). As well as the way they try to sound so esoteric and highly educated, while explaining their grandiose claims and theories. I guess if you really try to sound more educated, it makes your theories seem more believable (except when you can’t even pronounce your favorite terms). I’m pretty sure I’ll be spending some extra time in Purgatory on account of it.

So this gets me thinking: for this to be logical, wouldn’t extraterrestrials had to have fallen from grace as well - meaning they too are sinful? Because if they are not sinful, they therefore would not need to be redeemed.

Somehow, I really don’t think we need to worry about any of that. I doubt there’s any other life, anywhere “out there”.

Help me wrap my mind around this.

I have my own silly theory about ‘aliens’ and UFOs. I seriously believe they’re a satanic deception, meant to confuse people and draw their attention away from God (cue Twilight Zone theme and picture Rod Serling standing there in a black suit, smoking a cigarette). Yeah… I know what you’re thinking. :hypno: :bigyikes:

 

[sallybutler]

I love science fiction. Important word in that sentence – FICTION !!!