All christians are saints

[mab23]

So as usual I am having a friendly discussion with my protestant brother and he is coming at me about the usual misconceptions, I am showing him the truth of Catholic teaching and he throws this all Christians are saints thing which I am not familiar with handling

if anyone can give me a source or a link or give me some ammo it would truly be appreciated

justforcatholics.org/a50.htm <— this site always makes me lol

Question: I believe that only the Church, through the Pope, has the authority to declare saints after considering the works and life of each individual whose name has been brought forward for canonization. The Church does not consider just anyone, no matter how “saintly” a life s/he appears to have led, without proper study and without at least one miracle (attributed to that individual) that could be authenticated beyond current scientific and medical explanation.

Answer: You point out that the Pope claims the authority to declare certain individuals as saints after their death on the basis of certain criteria established by the Catholic Church. From among the millions of Catholics, only a tiny minority would ever be recognized as saints by the Vatican.

What a contrast with the picture we see in the New Testament! In the early church, the title “saint” is not restricted to a select group of dead and super Christians. Without exception, all Christians are saints. Every believer in Christ is a saint during his lifetime despite the many imperfections. And they were called so not by the authority of a Pope. It was commonplace for Christians to call each other “saints”.

Did you ever notice that the letters of the apostle Paul are addressed to the saints? Surely he did not write to the saints in heaven. Please read the quotations listed below, which prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that the Bible calls “saints” all living believers in Christ.

Christians need not wait many years after death to receive this title. Nor do they need an intensive campaign to persuade a college of Cardinals about their sanctity. In the Bible, God calls them “saints” despite their sins and failures. Miracles they cannot do, yet they recognize each other as saints because of such unimpressive things as sincere faith in Christ and their love for the brethren.

Canonization is based on Rome’s erroneous doctrine that a person is justified on account of personal righteousness. According to the Catechism, canonization is the solemn proclamation “that they practiced heroic virtue and lived in fidelity to God’s grace.” It is no surprise that Catholics do not dare claim this title since they believe that sainthood is achieved by personal effort.

In the New Testament (and in Evangelical churches today), ordinary Christians are called saints for a very different reason. You will not find us boasting of our heroic virtues and fidelity. Rather, we keep confessing our sins to God daily. Still, all believers are saints here and now. We are saints because of Another. All believers are “sanctified - i.e. made saints - through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all” (Hebrews 10:10). All Christians are saints because of what Christ did for us. Praise His name!

 

[Bookcat]

Yes --Christians who are living “in Christ” are saints.

There is nothing new to this and is what we as Catholics hold.

We believe what Paul and other New Testament writers mean when they use the term.

 

[Bookcat]

Now over the centuries yes another use of the term saints developed. Saints has been yes used for those who have lived as saints in a heroic way (by the grace of God of course).

And yes later a process of canonization developed to recognize them, honor them and propose them as special models for the Christian faithful in following Christ.

Thus one can say there are saints and also Saints in the canonized sense or at least the recognized sense (they were recognized long before the process of canonization developed…especially Our Lady, the Apostles and Martyrs).

 

[Bookcat]

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church 823 :

"The Church, then, is “the holy People of God,” and her members are called “saints.”

And from Pope Benedict XVI:

“In his First Letter to the Corinthians, St Paul addresses “those sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints together with all those who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ” (I Cor 1: 2). Indeed, Christians are already saints because Baptism unites them to Jesus and to his Paschal Mystery…”

(and then discussing becoming --more holy --more conformed to Christ he continues…)

“…but at the same time they must* become* so by conforming themselves every more closely to him.”

“Sometimes, people think that holiness is a privileged condition reserved for the few elect. Actually, becoming holy is every Christian’s task… The Apostle writes that God has always blessed us and has chosen us in Christ “that we should be holy and blameless before him… in love” (Eph 1: 3-5). … The “Way” is Christ, the Son, the Holy One of God: “no one comes to the Father but by me [Jesus]” (cf. Jn 14: 6).”

1 November 2007

 

[Verbum]

Hi Mab,

Your Protestant friend is right. In the New Testament, there are 58 instances of the word saint being applied to ordinary, living Christians :

Ex ; Acts 9, 13 : *all the evil that [Saul] has done to your **saints **in Jerusalem. *

In the same chapter see also verses 32 and 41.

Find a concordance and you can study all the instances yourself.

Through baptism we have become persons consecrated to Christ and temples of the Holy Spirit. This is the source of our sanctity.

When the Church solemnly proclaims some dead person a saint, she recognizes that he/she has practiced the Christian virtues in a heroic fashion and is a model for all Christians. This is just another use of the word saint.

What do you think?

Verbum

 

[Aelred_Minor]

This is just a case of how the same word can be correctly used in a number of different ways. A way of simplifying it for the simple-minded might be to make a distinction between canonized saints and other saints.

 

[mab23]

Hi Mab,

Your Protestant friend is right. In the New Testament, there are 58 instances of the word saint being applied to ordinary, living Christians :

Ex ; Acts 9, 13 : *all the evil that [Saul] has done to your **saints ***in Jerusalem.

In the same chapter see also verses 32 and 41.

Find a concordance and you can study all the instances yourself.

Through baptism we have become persons consecrated to Christ and temples of the Holy Spirit. This is the source of our sanctity.

When the Church solemnly proclaims some dead person a saint, she recognizes that he/she has practiced the Christian virtues in a heroic fashion and is a model for all Christians. This is just another use of the word saint.

What do you think?

Verbum

This is just a case of how the same word can be correctly used in a number of different ways. A way of simplifying it for the simple-minded might be to make a distinction between canonized saints and other saints.

Now over the centuries yes another use of the term saints developed. Saints has been yes used for those who have lived as saints in a heroic way (by the grace of God of course).

And yes later a process of canonization developed to recognize them, honor them and propose them as special models for the Christian faithful in following Christ.

Thus one can say there are saints and also Saints in the canonized sense or at least the recognized sense (they were recognized long before the process of canonization developed…especially Our Lady, the Apostles and Martyrs).

You have all been extremely helpful - Thank you :thankyou: :tiphat:

 

[Bookcat]

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church 823 :

"The Church, then, is “the holy People of God,” and her members are called “saints.”

And from Pope Benedict XVI:

“In his First Letter to the Corinthians, St Paul addresses “those sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints together with all those who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ” (I Cor 1: 2). Indeed, Christians are already saints because Baptism unites them to Jesus and to his Paschal Mystery…”

(and then discussing becoming --more holy --more conformed to Christ he continues…)

“…but at the same time they must* become* so by conforming themselves every more closely to him.”

“Sometimes, people think that holiness is a privileged condition reserved for the few elect. Actually, becoming holy is every Christian’s task… The Apostle writes that God has always blessed us and has chosen us in Christ “that we should be holy and blameless before him… in love” (Eph 1: 3-5). … The “Way” is Christ, the Son, the Holy One of God: “no one comes to the Father but by me [Jesus]” (cf. Jn 14: 6).”

1 November 2007

Making sure you saw this one from the CCC and the Pope…