All I Want Is Evidence

[Snow]

Snow;4411423:

Oh brother.

You BELIEVE on faith that the RCC is the body of Christ - that doesn’t make it so, it’s just your opinion, but regardless, it is still a church and it still a denomination.

Gabriel of 12
Tell me do you read scripture, and gain a first century understanding and interpetation of What the New Testament teaches? Do you have an apostolic scriptural teaching and understanding of the body of Jesus Christ? This is very important to your undertaking of Christianity, would you like me to show you through scripture how this is True? I would like to help your misconception of the; what and who the body of Jesus Christ is on earth?

No thanks. No offense but I don’t think you know what you are talking about here.

For one thing Snow, the body of Jesus Christ is not a building, and it definitely is not a denomination.

It appears you have a misunderstanding and preconcieved notion of What and who the body of Jesus Christ is?

Could you please prove that the Roman Catholic church is a denomination according to your interpretation? I can prove your Mormonism is a denomination, but I could never prove Roman Catholicism is a denomination.

Where did you guys come from?

Do you have a dictionary?

I have here the Oxford English Dictionary. The single greatest authority on the English language and one of the great scholarly works of all time.

denomination: religious group, faith, community, sect, cult, movement, body, branch, persuasion, order, school, Church.

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “religious group?”

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “faith?”

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “community?”

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “movement?”

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “body?”

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “Church?”

Yes, yes, yes, yes yes and yes. The RCC is a denomination x6.

For your information The Catholic church is the fulfillment of the Law and prophets through the body of Jesus Christ, not a denomination.

Yeh - that’s an opinion. Thank you for sharing.

Yeah - okay. I won’t confuse cult with occult. They are different words so that shouldn’t be too much trouble.

Gabriel of 12
Again, by appearance you have a misunderstanding of what a “cult” is and a “Occult”. Did you know the Old Covenant worship was a “cult”? The Catholic church is also a “cult” but not in the miconceived notion that you appear to have. I give you the floor as to not presume your understanding, only for you to clarify your interpretation between a “cult” and a “occult”.

Dude! What are you talking about? Focus.

You’ve obviously missed the point - which wasn’t about Catholic doctrine, rather to show you that Catholicism is considered a denomination. If you need more help, here’s a dictionary:

Gabriel of 12
Considered

****a denomination by whom? and by what reason of authority does one come to this conclusion?
Can you prove in your own words how the Catholic church is a denomination? Your testimony to your understanding of this is of grave importance for the understanding of one another on these boards. So can you prove it by your own interpretation? Because I think you stand alone in this interpretation of the Catholic church is a denomination? Can you prove from what the Catholic church denominated from? other than Jesus her founder? If you dont respond, I will take it as a resting of the case./****B]

“Demoninated” from?

Do you even know what the word denominated means? It means “to give a specific name to; designate” or “express or designate in some denomination.”

As for whether I “stand alone in this interpretation of the Catholic church is a denomination?”

christianity.about.com/od/romancatholicdenomination/Roman_Catholic_Denomination.htm

stason.org/TULARC/religion/Catholic-Churches/

religioustolerance.org/int_rel9.htm

… if you think I am misinformed about Catholicism, perhaps you can show me where I have posted a factual error about it… but I doubt it.

Gabriel of 12
**How about if I just list the few recent ones I have seen you post.

1. A misunderstanding of the body of Christ by making a claim Catholicism is a denomination without proof
2. A total Apostacy of the Catholic church
3. Misinterpretation of Catholic Saints**

Peace be with you

Factual. I said factual. Post the “fact” an then show how I was in error. Fact, not opinion.

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

Gabriel of 12;4421490:

No thanks. No offense but I don’t think you know what you are talking about here.

Gabriel of 12
Your very welcome, thanks for the blessings, Let the seeds fall where they may Lord.

Where did you guys come from?

Gabriel of 12
From Jesus Christ, that is probably why your having a hard time understanding the spiritual realities placed right in front of your eyes.

Do you have a dictionary?

Gabriel of 12
Yes, many

I have here the Oxford English Dictionary. The single greatest authority on the English language and one of the great scholarly works of all time.

Gabriel of 12
**Good for you, do you know if the Oxford English Dictionary is smart enough as you and can define this passage from God’s word? 1 Cor.2:10
this God has revealed to us through the Spirit.For the Spirit scrutinizes everything, even the depths of God. **
11
Among human beings, who knows what pertains to a person except the spirit of the person that is within? **Similarly, no one knows what pertains to God except the Spirit of God. **
12
**We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit that is from God, so that we may understand the things freely given us by God. **
13
And we speak about them not with words taught by human wisdom, but with words taught by the Spirit, describing spiritual realities in spiritual terms. 7
14
**Now the natural person 8 does not accept what pertains to the Spirit of God, for to him it is foolishness, and he cannot understand it, because it is judged spiritually. **
15
The spiritual person, however, can judge everything but is not subject to judgment 9 by anyone.
16
**For “who has known the mind of the Lord, so as to counsel him?” But we have the mind of Christ. **

Snow cont;
denomination: religious group, faith, community, sect, cult, movement, body, branch, persuasion, order, school, Church.

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “religious group?”

Gabriel
NO, she is the body of Jesus Christ. Define religious group? We do not entertain each other in religious group, your denomination definition will never fit Roman Catholicism.

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “faith?”

**Gabriel
No, she is not, the members of the body of Jesus Christ are many, and are given the gift of faith from God himself through his sacraments. Our Faith in God is excercised, not what we are in the body of Jesus Christ. Define “Faith” The Roman Catholic church are in the body of Jesus Christ, this is done truly by his blood, body, soul and divinity, making us one in Christ Jesus. **

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “community?”

Gabriel;
No she is not, define “community”? what you label community, we call parishes,or parishioners, this is different from what the Roman Catholic church is.

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “movement?”

Gabriel;
No she is not, define movement? The body of Jesus Christ is not a movement, this body lives and breathes.

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “body?”

Gabriel;
No. Define “body”. The Roman Catholic church is not a “body” She is the living body of Jesus on earth breathing and living, giving witness.

Is the Roman Catholic Church a “Church?”

Gabriel;
No. Define Church? The Roman Catholic church is the body of Jesus Christ.

Yes, yes, yes, yes yes and yes. The RCC is a denomination x6.

Gabriel of 12
NO, NO,NO,NO,NO,NO and NO. The Roman Catholic church is the body of Jesus Christ x’s 9, you forgot the Blessed Trinity.

Yeh - that’s an opinion. Thank you for sharing.

Gabriel:
Tell me, do you have this same teaching from Jesus in your Mormonism, as my opinion? in other words in your opinion is Mormonism the fulfillment of the law and the prophets?

Dude! What are you talking about? Focus.

Gabriel;
I understand; some things are hard to comprehend in the natural when speaking about spiritual realities. I am trying to simplify these matters for you as simply as I can. I tell you what? I will pray for you, that the holy spirit reveal these mysteries of the body of Jesus Christ to you ok?

You’ve obviously missed the point - which wasn’t about Catholic doctrine, rather to show you that Catholicism is considered a denomination. If you need more help, here’s a dictionary:

“Demoninated” from?

Do you even know what the word denominated means? It means “to give a specific name to; designate” or “express or designate in some denomination.”

Gabriel:
Yes, and thank you for giving a definition of the word, but denomination does not define what the Catholic church is.

As for whether I “stand alone in this interpretation of the Catholic church is a denomination?”

Gabriel;
I rest my case you stand alone here:

Factual. I said factual. Post the “fact” an then show how I was in error. Fact, not opinion.

**So we agree, then; your failed total apostacy theroy is an opinion.
The Cathoilc Saints you misquoted is just your opinion.
Your misunderstanding of the body of Jesus Christ being the Roman Catholic church on earth is just your opinion. Well Paul was right all along, the natural person cannot understand the things that pertain to the Spirit, because the natural person thinks of the Spiritual realites as foolishness. Thats me, remember the foolish one speaking to you.

Peace**

 

[greylorn]

You’re profile says that you are a member of the church of physical science. Otherword you believe what you can experience with your five senses? Am I correct? Does this make you a scientist first and an athiest later? What do you do when you your senses contradict each other? Or something happens out side of the natural order of things? For instance you didn’t live 2,000 years ago. What would you say if you saw a man brutally crusified and dead. Then you saw him alive again walking and talking with wounds given him during the crusifixion? Just curious.

Before inventing my belief system for me based upon the name of my church, you’ll want to start by getting the name right. It is, The Church of Physical Theology, not physical science. For the rest of this conversation, let’s call it the CPT.

Its beliefs have little or nothing to do with human senses, much to do with the science of physics. The CPT’s theology is based upon the principles of physics and the logic of common sense. It believes in accepting all legitimate data, and if that data conflicts with the Church’s current belief set, it will change its belief set or terminate itself.

I cannot speak for the Church’s other members, but I am not an atheist. Following CPT teachings to the letter, I believe absolutely that our universe is created. Differences between the CPT and Catholocism lie in simple but important areas. The CPT insists upon an explanation of the nature of God in the context of physics, and defines one. It appreciates the inherent interconnectedness between God and physical reality. The Laws of Thermodynamics are essential to an understanding of God.

The principles of the CPT are (in theory) exactly what the beliefs of the Catholic Church would be if, instead of condemning Galileo in the 17th century, It had accepted his invitation to apply the truth of God’s universe to our understanding of God’s nature and purpose.

Why are you so hasty to condemn without knowledge? How do you know that I’ve not lived 2000 or 200 years ago and often in between, dying ugly and so often that the fear of death no longer forestalls the expression of ideas which normally precede short lifetimes?
I

 

[sambos671]

Before inventing my belief system for me based upon the name of my church, you’ll want to start by getting the name right. It is, The Church of Physical Theology, not physical science. For the rest of this conversation, let’s call it the CPT.

Its beliefs have little or nothing to do with human senses, much to do with the science of physics. The CPT’s theology is based upon the principles of physics and the logic of common sense. It believes in accepting all legitimate data, and if that data conflicts with the Church’s current belief set, it will change its belief set or terminate itself.

I cannot speak for the Church’s other members, but I am not an atheist. Following CPT teachings to the letter, I believe absolutely that our universe is created. Differences between the CPT and Catholocism lie in simple but important areas. The CPT insists upon an explanation of the nature of God in the context of physics, and defines one. It appreciates the inherent interconnectedness between God and physical reality. The Laws of Thermodynamics are essential to an understanding of God.

The principles of the CPT are (in theory) exactly what the beliefs of the Catholic Church would be if, instead of condemning Galileo in the 17th century, It had accepted his invitation to apply the truth of God’s universe to our understanding of God’s nature and purpose.

Why are you so hasty to condemn without knowledge? How do you know that I’ve not lived 2000 or 200 years ago and often in between, dying ugly and so often that the fear of death no longer forestalls the expression of ideas which normally precede short lifetimes?
I

I am just asking questions to get a better idea of what you believe. I’ve made assumptions based on how others have presented themselves. Much like common law of England and the United States I am basing my questions off of views that for me have precident. So you believe in God but only to the extent that they can be verifiable through physics? is this correct?

 

[greylorn]

I am just asking questions to get a better idea of what you believe. I’ve made assumptions based on how others have presented themselves. Much like common law of England and the United States I am basing my questions off of views that for me have precident. So you believe in God but only to the extent that they can be verifiable through physics? is this correct?

Sambos,

Thanks for pointing that out. We all base our next set of thoughts on those we’ve had before. Me too, and I’d forgotten that. I will interpret any further questions you might have in this context of your reply. Thinking about it, your style of query is akin to my own.

Re: your question. No. And perhaps my negative reply to your assumptive query is a matter of semantics. I’ll try to elaborate in the form of a few unsupported statements.

1. From our limited knowledge of physics it would appear that the likelihood that the universe could have come into existence with all the essential “numbers” (speed of light, quantum length, charge of an electron, etc.) perfectly balanced, is vanishingly small— unless one assumes that intelligence created the universe.

Conventional physicists blow off the numbers and conclude that the God-concept is absurd (for other reasons). I do not. The numbers tell the truth. This is a created universe.

1. Physics and the numbers resulting therefrom tell me that there is a God, but does not describe His properties or motivations.

People have to make these things up. Normally, God’s properties and motivations are invented by theologians, well-meaning people who know as much about physics as a poodle. The CPT has addressed these issues through physics. So, my God-concept is one which makes perfect sense in the context of physics and other sciences.

1. My belief in a Creator is absolute. Although it is derived from my understanding of physics, it extends outward. I see evidence of God in sunsets, mosquitoes, hurricanes. It crawled up my spine the first time I looked through a telescope in the dead of night and saw a globular cluster. The more I learn, the more I see Creation.
2. But the description of God given by our churches does not match the Creator I see in the universe. Here’s where semantics comes in. The entity you have in mind when you use the word “God” is not the same entity Who I envision in this context.
3. The usual concept of God is of an entity Who is outside of, or separated from our physical universe. My Creator is intimately a part of His universe. The conventional God is a spirit. Mine is not.

I hope this helps. Thank you for your query.