"All spirit is matter" - Joseph Smith

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ParkerD said:
1Voice,

Jesus didn’t have a “weak human nature”. Jesus said He was like His Father.

As far as “God is spirit and those who worship him worship in spirit and in truth” then the question should well be asked,

why can’t God be worshiped in spirit (meaning our spirit is involved in the worship, and our body also–our mind, our feelings and emotions, our desire and commitment, our whole soul) and in truth (meaning that if we are doing true worship we will not be doing any sort of “faking” and will not be holding back from disclosing our innermost thoughts, feelings, emotions, “heart”–and also that the worshiper needs to have in mind a true relationship with God, where He is listening intimately and with full involvement and concentration, and yet have a physical body while being the Recipient of our worship?

God is all-loving power, energy, Light, Truth, Goodness, upholding all things by the word of His power and by the energy that emanates from His Person and extends throughout the universe. He can do that because He is Spirit with power, knowledge, and Truth emanating from His Person. This can happen from a Being with a physical body, as Jesus showed when He lived on the earth and when He was resurrected with an eternally perfect physical body which He will always have for all eternity.

Jesus was and is Spirit and Truth also. To have a body is not to have a limitation about being Spirit and Truth.
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Believe in a “god” of flesh and bones if you wish. And that there are jillions of gods. And that you yourself will become a god and rule over your own kingdom. Just don’t call your religion Christian!

Jim Dandy
 
ParkerD said:
1Voice,

Jesus didn’t have a “weak human nature”. Jesus said He was like His Father.

As far as “God is spirit and those who worship him worship in spirit and in truth” then the question should well be asked,

why can’t God be worshiped in spirit (meaning our spirit is involved in the worship, and our body also–our mind, our feelings and emotions, our desire and commitment, our whole soul) and in truth (meaning that if we are doing true worship we will not be doing any sort of “faking” and will not be holding back from disclosing our innermost thoughts, feelings, emotions, “heart”–and also that the worshiper needs to have in mind a true relationship with God, where He is listening intimately and with full involvement and concentration, and yet have a physical body while being the Recipient of our worship?

God is all-loving power, energy, Light, Truth, Goodness, upholding all things by the word of His power and by the energy that emanates from His Person and extends throughout the universe. He can do that because He is Spirit with power, knowledge, and Truth emanating from His Person. This can happen from a Being with a physical body, as Jesus showed when He lived on the earth and when He was resurrected with an eternally perfect physical body which He will always have for all eternity.

Jesus was and is Spirit and Truth also. To have a body is not to have a limitation about being Spirit and Truth.
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You are missing my point. It is my understanding that Mormons believe that God the Father was a man at one time. My question… Where does it say that in the Bible?
 
1voice said:
You are missing my point. It is my understanding that Mormons believe that God the Father was a man at one time. My question… Where does it say that in the Bible?
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1Voice,

Rather, I think you missed my point, which is that nothing in the Bible says God the Father does not have a resurrected body just like Jesus has, since Jesus said He is like His Father and Jesus had a body when He said that.

But I also think that this is a very important kind of knowledge that can really only come by a person finding it out for themselves through their personal relationship with God, and through sincere prayer. You know the verse: “For this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.” To know Them, we certainly need to know about Them. What better way than from God, directly?
 
ParkerD said:
1Voice,

Rather, I think you missed my point, which is that nothing in the Bible says God the Father does not have a resurrected body just like Jesus has, since Jesus said He is like His Father and Jesus had a body when He said that.

But I also think that this is a very important kind of knowledge that can really only come by a person finding it out for themselves through their personal relationship with God, and through sincere prayer. You know the verse: “For this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.” To know Them, we certainly need to know about Them. What better way than from God, directly?
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Except, when you get on your knees to pray, feel that peaceful feeling and hear the whisperings of the still small voice, you have no objective way of distinguishing whether that’s God talking to you, Overlord Zenu, Vishnu, or the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

Korihor
 
“Certain groups, notably the Mormons, have committed the error of saying that God the Father has a body, and have thus become anthropomorphites, people who say that God has a human form. …More”
catholic.com/library/God_Has_No_Body.asp

“Woman, believe Me, an hour is coming when neither in this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, shall you worship the Father. You worship that which you do not know; we worship that which we know, for salvation is from the Jews. But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers” . John 4:21-23
 
How can you say that?Do you know what spirit is made up of?Have to analyzed a spirit?Why should I accept Smith’s pt.of view?Anyone can say what they want to say.Prove it.Give me some bible verse which says spirit is matter.Did Smith go into the heavens?did his revelations tell him spirit is matter?
 
ParkerD said:
1Voice,

Rather, I think you missed my point, which is that nothing in the Bible says God the Father does not have a resurrected body just like Jesus has, since Jesus said He is like His Father and Jesus had a body when He said that.
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It specifically states that man is a created being … in the image and likeness of God (man had a body when the author said that). That scripture has never been interpreted to mean that because man has a flesh and blood earth suit … that God the father had one too.
 
1voice said:
It specifically states that man is a created being … in the image and likeness of God (man had a body when the author said that). That scripture has never been interpreted to mean that because man has a flesh and blood “earth suit” … that God the Father had one too.
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Hi, 1Voice,

Some of the blessings of gospel knowledge are encountered through knowing with both the mind and the heart, that Jesus Christ indeed rose from the grave with a perfect, resurrected body and that thus He showed that He has power over death, as He said.

It is a great blessing indeed to know that not only our loved ones will be resurrected, but each of us will also, with a perfect resurrected body, not an “earth suit” but a “heavenly body” of flesh and bones (not blood, but a more perfect sustaining fluid, no doubt).

It is also a great blessing to know that the apostles knew of this glorious blessing of the resurrection, and didn’t regard our bodies as a thing to be regarded lightly, taken for granted, or scorned because we have physical discomforts and pains. There will be no physical discomforts and pains, nor any imperfections in the body or its functions, in our resurrection.

So, the blessing of the resurrection will be each of ours whether we want it, or not. All shall rise from the grave, with a resurrected body, and it is the free gift from Christ which is indeed a gift and a supernal blessing.

God the Father was giving us that gift and blessing through His Beloved Son, through offering Him because He knew that His Son would be crucified, and through offering Him because He knew He would have power over death and be resurrected and provide the free gift of resurrection to all humankind. I think it is a good idea to regard all this as a blessing to treasure and be grateful for it all the days of our life.
 
ParkerD said:
Hi, 1Voice,

Some of the blessings of gospel knowledge are encountered through knowing with both the mind and the heart, that Jesus Christ indeed rose from the grave with a perfect, resurrected body and that thus He showed that He has power over death, as He said.

It is a great blessing indeed to know that not only our loved ones will be resurrected, but each of us will also, with a perfect resurrected body, not an “earth suit” but a “heavenly body” of flesh and bones (not blood, but a more perfect sustaining fluid, no doubt).

It is also a great blessing to know that the apostles knew of this glorious blessing of the resurrection, and didn’t regard our bodies as a thing to be regarded lightly, taken for granted, or scorned because we have physical discomforts and pains. There will be no physical discomforts and pains, nor any imperfections in the body or its functions, in our resurrection.

So, the blessing of the resurrection will be each of ours whether we want it, or not. All shall rise from the grave, with a resurrected body, and it is the free gift from Christ which is indeed a gift and a supernal blessing.

God the Father was giving us that gift and blessing through His Beloved Son, through offering Him because He knew that His Son would be crucified, and through offering Him because He knew He would have power over death and be resurrected and provide the free gift of resurrection to all humankind. I think it is a good idea to regard all this as a blessing to treasure and be grateful for it all the days of our life.
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Why is it important that God the Father (according to LDS belief) has a human body?
 
1voice said:
Why is it important that God the Father (according to LDS belief) has a human body?
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1Voice,

I think it is misnomer to use the words “human” body. “Glorious, glorified, radiant exalted body” would be the belief.

You asked a very good question. The view that our body is good, wonderful, and will be able to be glorified is consistent with the Bible. Having a glorified resurrected body should not, according to the Bible, be viewed as “lesser than” the glory Jesus has because those who are glorified will be “joint heirs” through Jesus Christ, based on simple statements in the Bible. Jesus’ resurrection should be viewed as glorious and wonderful, and our own resurrection should be also if we are headed toward what He wants for us.

So to hold a view that God the Father is only Spirit creates a disconnect as to really being a “joint heir” with Jesus Christ and receiving “all things” if being “only Spirit” is viewed as being “greater” or “more omnipotent” or “more omniscient” than having a glorified, perfected resurrected body just as Jesus has.
 
ParkerD said:
Stephen,

Because the Savior revealed that all those preparatory laws and the law of sacrifice had been fulfilled, and because Jeremiah prophesied about the “New Covenant” which would imply “new laws”.

I liked RebeccaJ’s explanation about the Ten Commandments and the Two Great Commandments, and I don’t see a great deal of difference other than when someone takes Paul’s writing in Romans 7 and says the analogy means “eternal marriage” was being taught against, as I had explained earlier.
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It is clear there is no ‘eternal marriage’ because that is the bases for Saint Paul’s analogy. As a woman is free to marry because of the death of her husband, we are free from the law through the dead of Christ. The woman is not an adulteress and we are not sinners in the old law. Therefore marriage ends at death.
Analogies are based on something true and familiar. “he is running around like a chicken with its head cut off.” Two things are true: The man is moving in an unorganized fashion and chickens run around after their heads are cut off. Analogies are used to compare something familiar (marriage covenant or slaughtering chickens) with something new (our covenant in Christ or the behavior of a man).
The old covenant is finished through Christ just like a marriage is finished at death. Like you said the only reason we have some of the old laws in the new covenant is because of Christ.
There is no inconsistency in Christian teaching because it is St. Paul and the Apostles teaching.
 
Gods Spirit is love, Love is Gods Spirit.
God holds matter into existence as He is existence itself.

If one does not believe that the Father, Son and Holy Spirit our one in being, (love) how can one come to understand that love is not measured in heaven where all will be loved as one? The Holy Family equally loved. Catholics are not taking anything away from the family. I am ok that my wife loves Jesus more than I. She is ok with me loving Jesus more than her. We are ok with the bigger picture that is true Love. We do not feel that after death we will be loosing any of the love we have as a family here on earth. We trust that God has great things in store for those who love Him in Christ.
 
Originally Posted by 1voice
It is my understanding that Mormons believe that God the Father was a man at one time. My question… Where does it say that in the Bible?
ParkerD said:
1Voice,

… nothing in the Bible says God the Father does not have a resurrected body just like Jesus has, since Jesus said He is like His Father and Jesus had a body when He said that.
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In the book of Genesis … It states… Man is a created being … whose body is formed from the dust of the earth … by God …and that man is created in the image and likeness of God. Does that mean that God had a body made of dust when he created Adam?
 
1voice said:
Originally Posted by 1voice
It is my understanding that Mormons believe that God the Father was a man at one time. My question… Where does it say that in the Bible?

In the book of Genesis … It states… Man is a created being … whose body is formed from the dust of the earth … by God …and that man is created in the image and likeness of God. Does that mean that God had a body made of dust when he created Adam?
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1Voice,

If you want to call “cells”, “dust”, then I suppose you can. I think it is a figurative, symbolic word that is not literal as to what we call “dust”.
 
Originally Posted by 1voice

It is my understanding that Mormons believe that God the Father was a man at one time. My question… Where does it say that in the Bible?

In the book of Genesis … It states… Man is a created being … whose body is formed from the dust of the earth … by God …and that man is created in the image and likeness of God. Does that mean that God had a body made of dust when he created Adam?
ParkerD said:
1Voice,

If you want to call “cells”, “dust”, then I suppose you can. I think it is a figurative, symbolic word that is not literal as to what we call “dust”.
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Ok …
the focus of my question … At creation, was God’s body made of the same physical/Earhly material … described in Genesis … that God used to form Adam’s body?
 
1voice said:
Originally Posted by 1voice

It is my understanding that Mormons believe that God the Father was a man at one time. My question… Where does it say that in the Bible?

In the book of Genesis … It states… Man is a created being … whose body is formed from the dust of the earth … by God …and that man is created in the image and likeness of God. Does that mean that God had a body made of dust when he created Adam?

Ok …
the focus of my question … At creation, was God’s body made of the same physical/Earhly material … described in Genesis … that God used to form Adam’s body?
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1Voice,

No. When Jesus was resurrected, He was not resurrected with “earthly material”–He was resurrected with “a heavenly body of flesh and bones” that will live forever in a perfectly perfect physical, magnificently radiant state. The same is true of the “heavenly body of flesh and bones” of Heavenly Father. We don’t know the chemical composition, other than knowing there is visible “flesh” and bone structure, but there must be a difference given how our bodies age and so forth. We know that Jesus could and did eat, so that is something that a “heavenly body” can do.
 
ParkerD said:
1Voice,

No. When Jesus was resurrected, He was not resurrected with “earthly material”–He was resurrected with “a heavenly body of flesh and bones” that will live forever in a perfectly perfect physical, magnificently radiant state. The same is true of the “heavenly body of flesh and bones” of Heavenly Father. We don’t know the chemical composition, other than knowing there is visible “flesh” and bone structure, but there must be a difference given how our bodies age and so forth. We know that Jesus could and did eat, so that is something that a “heavenly body” can do.
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If God and man’s bodies are different as you describe …
What did God mean in Genesis where it states that Adam was formed in the image and likeness of God?
 
1voice said:
If God and man’s bodies are different as you describe …
What did God mean in Genesis where it states that Adam was formed in the image and likeness of God?
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Man was created by God with Intellect, Will, and Spirit (Soul).

God is a Spirit with Intellect and Will.

God is a spirit and those that worship him must worship in spirit and in truth (John 4:24). Spirits have no parts. They do not occupy space.

Jim Dandy
 
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