All This So-called NEW music

[mpeacock]

I’ve been singing in church choirs since I was 10 and have been known to be a snob of sorts when it comes to music.
I was away from the Church for a very long time and then a miracle happened and I came back even more devout than before.
I joined the choir because I’m a singer and I felt called to this ministry. Imagine my dismay when we got a new choir director and he was a Southern Presbyterian by way of 4-square.
The man never met a Dan Schutte or any of the St. Louis Jesuits that he didn’t love.
Most of the new music in the church sounds like the lowest common denominator on the radio. The whole point of V.II"s music thing was to get the congregation to sing and most of this stuff is not singable for an untrained group.
I find this to be frustrating and a failure—what about you?

 

[mpav]

We use the English Catholic Hymnal in my parish. Much of the music I know from my childhood, some of it is delightfully new to me. We never sing the new stuff.

 

[mpeacock]

So are you on the west coast, the east? Is your parish conservative or not? I’m looking for some kind of theme here in regards to musical styles in various places…I’m in California and wonder if what I hear is just a local thing.

 

[DVina]

mpeacock:

I find this to be frustrating and a failure—what about you?

I am sick and tired of it!

We have new, very good organist with a Phd in organ. He plays beautifully. BUT keep the guy off the piano! I feel like I am in a Las Vegas lounge!

I am tired of fighting for decent music in our parish. I joined the “hippy dippy” choir to try to provide influence from the inside. I lasted three years, also cantoring. Bad music performed well still does not honor almighty God. Told the pastor that, but all he can see in my letter to him is that I have family issues. And I’ve known him over 20 years.

How I long to sing a HYMN! Or CHANT something!

If I could only get my DH to cahnge parishes, sigh

 

[totustuusmaria]

If you want good modern music (though I recommend a healthy dosage of Gregorian Chant, Traditional Hymns, and Classical Mass Parts to fix your musical woes) you should check out Songs in His Presence. Excellent music!

songsinhispresence.com/

Unfortunately, one of the best CD’s of excellent modern music I ever heard, a CD which came from the same parish as Songs in His Presence called Behold His Light, is no longer available. But get ahold of the three CDs published by Song in His Presence! They are well worthwhile, and because they’re more modern music you will have a much better chance of getting your choir director to use the songs from them. Especially get the CD entitled “Psalms” and the music book with accompanies it. Music books are available for all three CDs, though.

 

[totustuusmaria]

BY the way, unless you chant the Graduals at your Church, the Psalm Responses require new music anyway since they weren’t part of the liturgy before 1970 and certainly not with the correct translation.

That’s why I especially recommended the CD Psalms because they are beautiful renditions of the Psalm Responses which conform to the liturgical texts.

If you can get your Church to chant the graduals, that’s even better; but the only Church I know of that chants the graduals is John Cantius.

 

[Jaypeeto3]

I think if I have to experience “Gather Us In” one more time I’m going to lose my lunch.



Jaypeeto3

 

[mpeacock]

One of our parish members refered to “Anthem” as “that song by Queen”
Have we sunk so low to try and grab their attention?

 

[MrS]

The music from Songs in His Presence is quite good… but I have to agree that it is NOT what I would prefer for Mass. The parish was founded by/for the Charismatic Movement, and perhaps the songs are heard there often… Catholic, sure… inspiring, yes… for the Holy Mass… :nope:

 

[Dubervilles]

I have heard many types of music growing up (and I’m only 23!)–growing up it was traditional Gift of Finest Wheat, On this day O Beautiful Mother–than as I became older and joined the choir as I love singing we had a very strict (and rather strange…but that’s another story) preist who insisted on all latin all the time–which I came to love…
Then I moved to University and joined the church on campus–and WOW! drum kit, electric guitars, violin, saxophone, piano and flute!?! What! At first I hated it–it was so “un-catholic”–but now I’ve grown to love it–how many catholic churches have the congregation clapping to the beat and everyone singing so loud you can’t hear yourself–umm…none I’ve been too…I believe one of the books we use is “United as One” and the other the trad. “Gather” hymnal…

 

[Elzee]

Dubervilles:

…thankfully… I’ve been to only one.
I just can’t bring myself to believe that clapping is appropriate when I’m at the foot of Calvary. This type of worship is more appropriate at a prayer service or 'praise and worship service/concert '- but not at the Mass. Not at the re-presentation of our Lord’s sacrifice.
But…that’s just my humble opinion…

 

[MrS]

Elzee:

…thankfully… I’ve been to only one.
I just can’t bring myself to believe that clapping is appropriate when I’m at the foot of Calvary. This type of worship is more appropriate at a prayer service or 'praise and worship service/concert '- but not at the Mass. Not at the re-presentation of our Lord’s sacrifice.
But…that’s just my humble opinion…

your humble opinion is widely shared.

 

[JButky]

mpeacock:

I find this to be frustrating and a failure—what about you?

Well I’ve recently quit my job as a music director (at yet another parish).

It is just my experience that the Church (at least most of the churches here in America) doesn’t want good liturgical music. And I’m tired of doing battle in my small corner of it. It’s patethic and deplorable.

Weddings are the worst. Funerals with music requests and eulogies follow a close second…

Joe B

 

[MarthaMartha]

JButky:

Well I’ve recently quit my job as a music director (at yet another parish).

It is just my experience that the Church (at least most of the churches here in America) doesn’t want good liturgical music. And I’m tired of doing battle in my small corner of it. It’s patethic and deplorable.

Weddings are the worst. Funerals with music requests and eulogies follow a close second…

Joe B

Well, this past week I just sang in the choir of a funeral of one of our oldest and dearest church musicians. He battled cancer for a long time before he passed away, and so had time to plan his own funeral music. Among his requests were “The Old Rugged Cross,” “Just As I Am,” “Be Still My Soul,” “How Great Thou Art,” “Softly and Tenderly Jesus is Calling,” “Not Now but In the Coming Years,” “The Battle Hymn of the Republic” and the first verse of “The Star Spangled Banner” (he had been a veteran).

And I’m in Connecticut! There is hope!

 

[Dubervilles]

Generally the whole clapping thing is occasional and generall during the last song…the one that pops to mind is I believe called “We are Called” The lyrics being something like…“we are called to act with justice, we are called to love tenderly, we are called to help one another, to walk humbly with God”…I love that song…anyways it has been very inspring to me to see a packed large church (I would say at least 500 people) at 9PM mass on a Sunday (most college students–some dressed nicely, some in sweats or jeans)–but participating! How many churches have I been to where we sing more traditional music with an organ and I feel like I am the loudest out of the entire congregation because most aren’t singing or participating!

So I guess I myself have had a ‘conversion’ of sorts to the more contemporary music…and I believe others are seeing it this way as well (as well as the general openness of the church community). Apparently 30% of the people who attend are not Catholic, and a very high percentage of those people convent to Catholicism…

 

[tfmoseley]

I’m not sure that I share the other views I see posted here so I guess that will probably put me in the minority (at least among those discussing this topic). I am a musician/vocalist in a newly formed parish. So new in-fact that we are meeting at a local middle school for Masses and other functions. Needless to say an organ is not quite in the budget (or vision) for the obvious reasons.

We play a variety of hymns that are both in the traditional vein and some that i guess would be considered newer - although from some of the posts I am seeing here, anything post 1965 is too new. There is a balance that can be struck here I believe. The people that have come to our new parish from other existing parishes by and large seem to enjoy the ‘lighter’ feel of the music we are performing and the number of complaints about our format can be counted on one hand.

I find it odd to see a number of comments from seasoned choir members who seem to love the big thumpy organ sound and in the same breath talk about newer music that is too difficult to sing.

So anyway I guess my point is that this chorus against newer music (pun intended) may be a little overblown. I see that some of the comments are from Churches in the northeast and midwest. Maybe its a demographic thing, but please tell me in which direction your parish attendance is moving? We are here in the heart of the Bible-belt and that may be driving some of our music into the realm of the more contemporary since that is what other (protestant) Churches are using to get people in seats. At the end of the day isn’t that kind of what we are supposed to be doing? Music that praises God and all his blessings upon us is twice-praying regardless of the form it takes.

 

[DaveBj]

tfmoseley:

I’m not sure that I share the other views I see posted here so I guess that will probably put me in the minority (at least among those discussing this topic). I am a musician/vocalist in a newly formed parish. So new in-fact that we are meeting at a local middle school for Masses and other functions. Needless to say an organ is not quite in the budget (or vision) for the obvious reasons.

remainder snipped

It is not necessary to have a pipe organ in order to have the sound of a pipe organ. My keyboard/synth (an Ensoniq KS-32) is 15-year-old technology, but it has 10 very believable pipe organ sounds. I’m sure modern keyboards are even better.

DaveBj

 

[Andreas_Hofer]

tfmoseley:

We are here in the heart of the Bible-belt and that may be driving some of our music into the realm of the more contemporary since that is what other (protestant) Churches are using to get people in seats. At the end of the day isn’t that kind of what we are supposed to be doing? Music that praises God and all his blessings upon us is twice-praying regardless of the form it takes.

I work with youth and it always saddens me to see them excited about the singing at Mass when I can tell that the excitement stems from “singing fun songs” and not “getting to worship at Mass.” Lots of strategies for getting people in the pews capitalize on this, but the problem I see with this strategy is that it can lead to a lack of foundation. If people come for the music/atmosphere/community, then there’s no guarantee they won’t leave when it changes a bit or they find a music etc. elsewhere - unless there is a concerted effort to keep them in the pews because of the truth of Catholic faith and the true encounter with Christ it provides. For one, I’ve never seen this follow-up done very well, and secondly it creates a situation in which one has to “re-convert” in a sense because there is no guarantee they will be convinced of Catholic truth just because they liked the guitar solo at Mass.

 

[rwoehmke]

I guess that at 70 years old I am a fossilized dissenter when it comes to music. It seems to me that the series of hymn books called “Glory and Praise” and the hymns of the St. Louis Jesuits were the ones best sung by our parish. Them and some of the older items like Holy God We We Praise thy Name, what I call the standard chanted english version of the Gloria and Our Father, many of the older Marian Hymns, and some of the protestant favorites like A Mighty Fortress.

What really troubles me is that my parish uses this Hymn Book from Oregon and about 2/3 of the hymns are totally unsingable especially when we have an organist or pianist who insists on “slow and solemn” timing. It doesn’t have to be a rapid beat but at least fast enough to let the untrained breath.

I also disgree that we Catholics at Mass should be slow and solemn as that is seen as reverent. Good gosh we are saved and graced by the Sacrifice of Jesus, why should we not express our joy at his love for us. Yes, we are once again at the foot of the cross and it is Friday, but as a Baptist minister once told me “Sunday is A Coming!”

 

[ComradeAndrei]

Music at Mass is not there just for entertainment, thus it doesn’t matter if people “like” the music or not, it is for the worship of God.

From Sacrosanctum Concilium (Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy)-

1. The Church acknowledges Gregorian chant as specially suited to the Roman liturgy: therefore, other things being equal, it should be given pride of place in liturgical services.

But other kinds of sacred music, especially polyphony, are by no means excluded from liturgical celebrations, so long as they accord with the spirit of the liturgical action, as laid down in Art. 30.

The traditional forms of sacred music are to be given “pride of place in liturgical services”, thus Gregorian chant and polyphony is what we should be striving for, we shouldn’t just settle for something “simple” or “light”.

I find it odd to see a number of comments from seasoned choir members who seem to love the big thumpy organ sound and in the same breath talk about newer music that is too difficult to sing.

IMO, new music isn’t necessarily “difficult” to sing, rather it is unfamiliar and just doesn’t have that staying power that the traditional hymns have. Sometimes though I’ve seen hymns that are just not harmonious and don’t “flow” that are hard to sing.

However, since we should be performing the sacred music that the Church wants performed (i.e. Gregorian chant) that is what we should be focusing on. I’ve seen too many “choirs” or bands if you will in churches that just do not perform music with the sacred reverence required of it. We don’t need plinky pianos and strumming guitars.