Allah's promise to Jews the Land of Israel

[Nicolas]

I posted this on the other thread but it was ignored for no reasons!!

Where does God tell the Muslims that every jew must leave Israel or that Israel must be taken by Muslims.

If this is what muslims believe then I have to conclude that they believe they are morally obligated to destroy my people no matter what. And so then Israel has no choice but to destroy its muslims neighbors. Or am I missing something in your logic?

“To Moses We [Allah] gave nine clear signs. Ask the Israelites how he [Moses] first appeared amongst them. Pharoah said to him: ‘Moses, I can see that you are bewitched.’ ‘You know full well,’ he [Moses] replied, ‘that none but the Lord of the heavens and the earth has revealed these visible signs. Pharoah, you are doomed.’”

"Pharoah sought to scare them [the Israelites] out of the land [of Israel]: but We [Allah] drowned him [Pharoah] together with all who were with him. **Then We [Allah] said to the Israelites: 'Dwell in this land [the Land of Israel]. When the promise of the hereafter [End of Days] comes to be fulfilled, We [Allah] shall assemble you [the Israelites] all together [in the Land of Israel]."**

"We [Allah] have revealed the Qur'an with the truth, and with the truth it has come down. We have sent you [Muhammed] forth only to proclaim good news and to give warning."

[Qur'an, chapter 17:100-104]

templemount.org/quranland.html

your comments

 

[BlestOne]

OK so let me get this straight… the Muslims believe that The Exodus actually took place in Israel? And that the Muslims are supposed to get rid of the Jews (aka part of the original Israelites?)

 

[Lev23]

OK so let me get this straight… the Muslims believe that The Exodus actually took place in Israel? And that the Muslims are supposed to get rid of the Jews (aka part of the original Israelites?)

I know, what a mess. Islam as of now calls the place Palestine.

 

[meedo]

I posted this on the other thread but it was ignored for no reasons!!

“To Moses We [Allah] gave nine clear signs. Ask the Israelites how he [Moses] first appeared amongst them. Pharoah said to him: ‘Moses, I can see that you are bewitched.’ ‘You know full well,’ he [Moses] replied, ‘that none but the Lord of the heavens and the earth has revealed these visible signs. Pharoah, you are doomed.’”

"Pharoah sought to scare them [the Israelites] out of the land [of Israel]: but We [Allah] drowned him [Pharoah] together with all who were with him. **Then We [Allah] said to the Israelites: 'Dwell in this land [the Land of Israel]. When the promise of the hereafter [End of Days] comes to be fulfilled, We [Allah] shall assemble you [the Israelites] all together [in the Land of Israel]."**

"We [Allah] have revealed the Qur'an with the truth, and with the truth it has come down. We have sent you [Muhammed] forth only to proclaim good news and to give warning."

[Qur'an, chapter 17:100-104]

templemount.org/quranland.html

your comments

Hello,

Let me clarify one thing about Islam that is not clear. And this is from a religious point of view and not politics .

God grants believers preveliges. These preveliges are withdrawn if those believers fail at some point to adher that what was demanded of hem.

God demanded of the peopel of Israel to immigrate to palestine . For him , this is Holy land that he would like the nearly sole believing nation on the path of abraham of the time to reside in it and claim it their home.

This believing nation has sinned. They were punished for their sins by God himself who led other nations to invade them . The people of israel had many prophets sent to them . God sent a last prophet to the people of Israel with great miracles and and easiness into previous punishmens that were burdened on them due to heir previous sins. Basicly , turning a new leaf and for the last time This last prophet was Jesus the Messiah . The majority refused him , and a minoriy believed that he was a prophet .

The rejection of Jesus by the majority of the Israelites was the end of the last chance for this nation. The minority that believed in him had its faith turn into the modern day trinity. Which is according to Islam is not a proper way to know or to believe in God.

As such for their sins ( not all of them ofcourse , but when the majority fails and the minoriy couldnt correct any more) The Responsibility of carrying the message of Abraham was aithdrawn from the Line of Isac to the other line of Abraham , which is the line of Ishmael.

Now the line of Ishmael has the same preveliges and authority as had the Israelites at the time of Moses . The two other abrahamic lineage faith , one believes in Trinity God ( however you explain it ) and the other has no belief Jesus and his message .

It was time for correction once and for all. God gives the holy land to the current people of the correct belief in abraham .

Yes God ‘‘gave’’ ( past tense) the holy land to the people of israel. Due to their straying from what god wanted them to be , he gave it to people of more correct belief and obedience to him.

No contradiction in Islam and no mess.

 

[Nicolas]

.

Then We [Allah] said to the Israelites: 'Dwell in this land [the Land of Israel]. When the ***promise ***of the hereafter [End of Days] comes to be fulfilled, We [Allah] shall assemble you [the Israelites] all together [in the Land of Israel]."

Medo ,

Are you saying that God does not keep his promise ??
And where does it say in the Quran that the land belongs to muslims ??

 

[meedo]

Then We [Allah] said to the Israelites: 'Dwell in this land [the Land of Israel]. When the ***promise ***of the hereafter [End of Days] comes to be fulfilled, We [Allah] shall assemble you [the Israelites] all together [in the Land of Israel]."

Medo ,

Are you saying that God does not keep his promise ??
And where does it say in the Quran that the land belongs to muslims ??

can you please write the Chapter and verse number ?

 

[Lev23]

Hello,

Let me clarify one thing about Islam that is not clear. And this is from a religious point of view and not politics .

God grants believers preveliges. These preveliges are withdrawn if those believers fail at some point to adher that what was demanded of hem.

God demanded of the peopel of Israel to immigrate to palestine . For him , this is Holy land that he would like the nearly sole believing nation on the path of abraham of the time to reside in it and claim it their home.

This believing nation has sinned. They were punished for their sins by God himself who led other nations to invade them . The people of israel had many prophets sent to them . God sent a last prophet to the people of Israel with great miracles and and easiness into previous punishmens that were burdened on them due to heir previous sins. Basicly , turning a new leaf and for the last time This last prophet was Jesus the Messiah . The majority refused him , and a minoriy believed that he was a prophet .

The rejection of Jesus by the majority of the Israelites was the end of the last chance for this nation. The minority that believed in him had its faith turn into the modern day trinity. Which is according to Islam is not a proper way to know or to believe in God.

As such for their sins ( not all of them ofcourse , but when the majority fails and the minoriy couldnt correct any more) The Responsibility of carrying the message of Abraham was aithdrawn from the Line of Isac to the other line of Abraham , which is the line of Ishmael.

Now the line of Ishmael has the same preveliges and authority as had the Israelites at the time of Moses . The two other abrahamic lineage faith , one believes in Trinity God ( however you explain it ) and the other has no belief Jesus and his message .

It was time for correction once and for all. God gives the holy land to the current people of the correct belief in abraham .

Yes God ‘‘gave’’ ( past tense) the holy land to the people of israel. Due to their straying from what god wanted them to be , he gave it to people of more correct belief and obedience to him.

No contradiction in Islam and no mess.

Your whole post is a contradiction! Jeremiah 31 silences any lies about how God is done with Israel because they sinned. Jeremiah 31 announces the New Covenant is coming, and it will not be like the old Mosiac Covenant, because the people broke it. But yet God makes such an effort in Jeremiah 31 to make a point that Israel will never stop being a nation before him.

As far as Israel sinning and the New Covenant, Jeremiah 31:34 states–
“For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more.”

The New Covanent is still open for the broken branches of Israel.

As a matter of fact, St.Paul said the Gospel is for everyone, to the Jew first, then the Gentile.

Spend some time with Jeremiah 31 and Romans 11, its an eye opener.

 

[ralphinal]

Meedo,
Does Islam understand the difference between a covenant and a contract?

 

[meedo]

Meedo,
Does Islam understand the difference between a covenant and a contract?

Islam understands what God says. and what God did. As i posted above in reply to the poster, there is no contradiction in Islam. In Fact in the Quran God says clearly o Abraham that he doesn’t give covennants or legacies to transgressors.

قالى تعالى في سورة البقرة الاية 124

وَإِذِ ابْتَلَى إِبْرَاهِيمَ رَبُّهُ بِكَلِمَاتٍ فَأَتَمَّهُنَّ قَالَ إِنِّي جَاعِلُكَ لِلنَّاسِ إِمَامًا قَالَ وَمِنْ ذُرِّيَّتِي قَالَ لَا يَنَالُ عَهْدِي الظَّالِمِينَ

002.124
YUSUFALI: And remember that Abraham was tried by his Lord with certain commands, which he fulfilled: He said: “I will make thee an Imam to the Nations.” He pleaded: “And also (Imams) from my offspring!” He answered: “But My Promise is not within the reach of evil-doers.”

PICKTHAL: And (remember) when his Lord tried Abraham with (His) commands, and he fulfilled them, He said: Lo! I have appointed thee a leader for mankind. (Abraham) said: And of my offspring (will there be leaders)? He said: My covenant includeth not wrong-doers.

SHAKIR: And when his Lord tried Ibrahim with certain words, he fulfilled them. He said: Surely I will make you an Imam of men. Ibrahim said: And of my offspring? My covenant does not include the unjust, said He.

 

[Sister_Amy]

I posted this on the other thread but it was ignored for no reasons!!

“To Moses We [Allah] gave nine clear signs. Ask the Israelites how he [Moses] first appeared amongst them. Pharoah said to him: ‘Moses, I can see that you are bewitched.’ ‘You know full well,’ he [Moses] replied, ‘that none but the Lord of the heavens and the earth has revealed these visible signs. Pharoah, you are doomed.’”

"Pharoah sought to scare them [the Israelites] out of the land [of Israel]: but We [Allah] drowned him [Pharoah] together with all who were with him. **Then We [Allah] said to the Israelites: 'Dwell in this land [the Land of Israel]. When the promise of the hereafter [End of Days] comes to be fulfilled, We [Allah] shall assemble you [the Israelites] all together [in the Land of Israel]."**

"We [Allah] have revealed the Qur'an with the truth, and with the truth it has come down. We have sent you [Muhammed] forth only to proclaim good news and to give warning."

[Qur'an, chapter 17:100-104]

templemount.org/quranland.html

your comments

That’s not what the Qur’an says. Shameful.

 

[BlestOne]

Meedo… that was interesting… I don’t believe it to be correct, but interesting… if you would like to hear the Christian perspective of Salvation history, I would recommend that you listen to the 13 part series of lectures called Our Father’s Plan with Jeff Cavins and Scott Hahn… it can be downloaded here: bringyou.to/OurFathersPlan/

 

[R_not]

Well, there is indeed contradictions in islam. the koran is full of them!

And islam itself is a contradiction to the Bible - and no muslim has proven that the Bible was corrupted, except by their own koran that is based on an illiterate pagan who did not even know the Bible and his self-proclaimed prophethood is not even authentic.

Contradictions in the koran, part 1
Contradictions in the koran, part 2
Contradictions in the koran, part 3

The above isn’t even completed yet when I read them. There is at least one more PART that is under development by the author to show us the contradictions in the koran.

Was mohammed a prophet?

10 Reasons why islam is not From God (this goes into the contradictions also)

So, basically what we have is the admittance that Israel was given to the Jews by God and then the muslim ‘logic’ that they have sinned and now the Jews don’t deserve Israel anymore. And of course, the muslims have set themselves up as the judge, jury and executioners of the Jews. (And of all non-muslims - because it isn’t only about the Jews and israel - they are killing Hindus and Christians too as this mess in Israel is going on.)

 

[meedo]

Meedo… that was interesting… I don’t believe it to be correct, but interesting… if you would like to hear the Christian perspective of Salvation history, I would recommend that you listen to the 13 part series of lectures called Our Father’s Plan with Jeff Cavins and Scott Hahn… it can be downloaded here: bringyou.to/OurFathersPlan/

Thank you for your polite comment,

The Quran as a whole is interesting because one of the reasons its came is to clear up the confusion of the past . And set things straight. Thus as people see the answers , it is a bit eye opener.

Ofcourse i understand and respect that you as a Christian will disagree . And i am happy to listen for the link you gave me . I am listening to a part now.

My post was in reply to the OP . I also asked for the verse number because i don’t believe it was written correct.

best regards,

 

[jakasaki]

Thank you for your polite comment,

The Quran as a whole is interesting because one of the reasons its came is to clear up the confusion of the past . And set things straight. Thus as people see the answers , it is a bit eye opener.

Ofcourse i understand and respect that you as a Christian will disagree . And i am happy to listen for the link you gave me . I am listening to a part now.

My post was in reply to the OP . I also asked for the verse number because i don’t believe it was written correct.

best regards,

Hi Meedo

The original poster stated: [Qur’an, chapter 17:100-104]

 

[R_not]

That’s not what the Qur’an says. Shameful.

It is in Pickthall’s translation and one other translation (yusuf ali) that I have that are the accepted sunni translations. there are three other translations that I am not going to bother to look for.

Basically, there are 5 accepted translations for the sunni - and Pickthall, yusuf ali, ahilali kahn (I might not have spelled that name correctly) and two others that I forget off the top of my head). I think one other is shakir - but like I said I am not sure of the other two - I cannot remember and didn’t write it down. So, I don’t take muslim’s translations when they do it online - I only take the accepted translations. the muslims who try to translate online are just trying to confuse the issue and they know that they are not the accepted translators.

What translation are you using - and how come you don’t post it?

 

[meedo]

That’s not what the Qur’an says. Shameful.

i suspected that . That si why i asked for the evrse and chapter. I don’t believe it is Nicolas mistake. He just copied and pasted from a site that is not all that honest.

 

[meedo]

Hi Meedo

The original poster stated: [Qur’an, chapter 17:100-104]

وَقُلْنَا مِن بَعْدِهِ لِبَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ اسْكُنُوا الْأَرْضَ فَإِذَا جَاءَ وَعْدُ الْآخِرَةِ جِئْنَا بِكُمْ لَفِيفًا

Thank you for your help.

Now i find it in arabic.

‘’ And we told to the people of israel , inhabit the land, for when judgement day comes we summon you among others ( all nations summon to account)’’

There si a big difference between granting the land ( what happens at the time of moses ) and that all nations will gather in the land for account.

 

[BlestOne]

Thank you for your polite comment,

The Quran as a whole is interesting because one of the reasons its came is to clear up the confusion of the past . And set things straight. Thus as people see the answers , it is a bit eye opener.

Ofcourse i understand and respect that you as a Christian will disagree . And i am happy to listen for the link you gave me . I am listening to a part now.

My post was in reply to the OP . I also asked for the verse number because i don’t believe it was written correct.

best regards,

Meedo… I hope you like that lecture series… I think it will show you the Christian perspective of the covenantal relationship of God to his people. I believe the verse from the OT that you were requesting starts in Genesis Chapter 21 and goes on through Genesis chapter 24… but I could be wrong.

One thing I will explain… although God’s first covenants were to the Jews… after Jesus, salvation was opened to all through Jesus’s new covenant as he fulfilled the old covenant. That basically means that all of us have access to salvation even though we were not of the blood lines of the 12 tribes of Israel.

 

[BlestOne]

Oh… I see I errored… you were looking for Chapter and verse of the Koran… sorry… I misunderstood.

 

[ralphinal]

Meedo,
Thank you for that answer. However, you did not really answer the question.

In the Bible, God creates a covenant with Noah first, then Abraham, then the Children of Isreal, and then with David.

Does Islam explain what a covenant is and how it is different than a contract?