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taylormcbee
Guest
I know it is not supposed to be sung durring lent but today was the feast of st Joseph I watched the mass on EWTN and they sang alleluia instead of the lenten gospel acclamation
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Ack!!! The “A” word!!!I know it is not supposed to be sung durring lent but today was the feast of st Joseph I watched the mass on EWTN and they sang alleluia instead of the lenten gospel acclamation
Oh… Today is a solemnity… Never mind.
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Brendan
Guest
IIRC, Solemnties such as the Feast of St. Joseph and the Annunciation, because of their celebratory nature, are considered outside of the season of Lent.I know it is not supposed to be sung durring lent but today was the feast of st Joseph I watched the mass on EWTN and they sang alleluia instead of the lenten gospel acclamation
It seems to vary between diocese on if GIRM 62 therefore applies.
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MarkThompson
Guest
No, they’re definitely considered to be liturgically within Lent. Incidentally, in the EF a Tract is prescribed for St. Joseph’s feast, with an Alleluia substituted only if it should happen to fall in Paschal Time. I’m confident the same is true in the Ordo Cantus Missae governing the OF prescribes the same. It’s not online to check, but the Gregorian Missal, which is derived from it, likewise gives a Tract for this solemnity.
The trick here is that the priests who celebrate the EWTN daily Mass are Franciscans, who use their own missal which differs on certain points from the Roman Missal. Perhaps this is one distinction; I would definitely consider it an error in the standard Roman rite.
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Lapey
Guest
Although Canon 1251 does state specifically “Friday”, I do believe Brendan is correct that the feast day, “solemnity” which is the highest of feasts, does supersede the lenten season. But I shall do some homework on this, I never thought of this situation, only the affects of the Friday Lenten abstaining.
What do teh rubrics show in the Roman Missal? I do not have mine with me, but I will go get it.
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Lapey
Guest
According to the Roman Missal 3rd edition, the Gloria is said on this solemnity. So why wouldn’t the alleluia?
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Richard320
Guest
We sang the Alleluia at Mass today as well. The Monsignor even made a point of announcing that we would because it was the Solemnity of St. Joseph.
But then this thread made me wonder, so I scoured the GIRM and found nothing specific about that part; it did say that there would be three readings, not the usual weekday two.
I think it’s just covered by the general rule of thumb: Feast Beats Fast.
I do know that on those years that this Solemnity falls on a Friday, we are excused from abstinence, even though it’s Lent.
But then this thread made me wonder, so I scoured the GIRM and found nothing specific about that part; it did say that there would be three readings, not the usual weekday two.
I think it’s just covered by the general rule of thumb: Feast Beats Fast.
I do know that on those years that this Solemnity falls on a Friday, we are excused from abstinence, even though it’s Lent.
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MarkThompson
Guest
Sure, the solemnity takes liturgical precedence over the Lenten ferial day, but it is still a solemnity in the season of Lent. And there is no general rule that says “solemnities get the Alleluia,” as there is a rule that solemnities get the Gloria (GIRM 53), which would then come into play to trump the Lenten acclamation. So unless an Alleluia were specifically prescribed for this solemnity in the liturgical books – which it is not, and indeed a Tract is deliberately specified in its place – then the rules of the season apply (a fact which is of much greater general consequence in the Office).
Nothing.
Incidentally, the OP is apparently not the only person to wonder about this point (that link is from EWTN, incidentally, expressly agreeing with me on this point (as do Father Z and liturgical directives from the Diocese of Fort Wayne - South Bend, the Diocese of Brownsville, and the Diocese of Cubao)).
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MarkThompson
Guest
Sorry for the awful prose; please strike one or the other occurrence of “incidentally.”
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Phemie
Guest
From Paschale Solemnitatis, Circular Letter Concerning the Preparation and Celebration of the Easter Feasts
The footnote refers us to General Norms for the Liturgical Year and the Calendar
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japhy
Guest
I was at the EWTN Mass on Monday morning, and I thought it odd too. I don’t recall using “Alleluia” on the Solemnity of the Annunciation (coming up on the 25th), so I don’t know why it would be used for the Solemnity of St. Joseph. In addition, the paper worship guide that was handed out before Mass did have an acclamation printed on it instead of the Alleluia… so perhaps the organist forgot, and played the wrong music, and the cantor went along with it. (I did notice the cantor glancing over to the priests a couple of times during the singing of the Alleluia.)
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CatholicZ09
Guest
I did think the general norm was for the alleluia to remain absent from the start of Lent until the Easter Vigil regardless if the day is a solemnity or feast. I guess Paschale Solemnitatis clears this up.
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ald04
Guest
Hello! Today at daily Mass (Annunciation of Our Lord) our priest had us pray the Gloria, even though it was Lent. I was the lector for today, and the Gospel Acclamation had “Alleluia” in it. Seeing the priest in white, and having prayed the Gloria, I thought it would be appropriate to say “Alleluia” for today’s feast. While saying the word, the priest made a face, and I quickly changed to “Praise to You Lord Jesus Christ, King of Endless Glory”. I’m wondering if anyone knows if today’s feast called for an Alleluia, as that was what the lectionary had. Thanks!
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marytk
Guest
Was the Alleluia written like this (Alleluia).? Today is the Solemnity of the Annunciation (moved since yesterday was a Sunday of Lent). The Gloria and the Creed. We still don’t use the Alleluia. I saw in CHRISTIAN PRAYER they had (Alleluia) My guess is that this is for when the feast is moved to after Easter (they do this if it lands in Easter Week (and Maybe Holy Week too) )So if this was moved to after Easter we would sing the Alleluia.
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curlycool89
Guest
Yes to the Gloria, yes to the white vestments, no to the Alleluia.
Since it’s a Solemnity in Lent, we do do the Gloria, but the Alleluia is still not said.
If the Annunciation was moved to after Easter (which can happen, this year it was moved to the 26th because the 25th was a Sunday), then it would be correct to use the Alleluia, which is probably why it’s in the Lectionary.
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MarkThompson
Guest
As said above, the correct answer is yes to the Gloria, no to the Alleluia. This topic was recently discussed in this thread, and you can see post #10 for the definitive answer.
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marytk
Guest
I looked in the Lectionary today and for this feast the Alleluia is inside of brackets.{ alleluia. alleluia} I take that to mean that you might use them or not
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drforjc
Guest
The brackets mean to include it if it is celebrated during the Easter season.
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marytk
Guest
Yeap that is what I meant. Sometimes (if it is moved to after Easter week) we sing it. Most of the time we don’t
Does St Joseph ever get moved to after Easter if it is a real early Easter? I remember it being moved to the Saturday before Holy Week, when it would have fallen during Holy Week. I guess it can never be before Easter since 19 comes before 21. In the Christian Prayer there are Alleluias in brackets and I wondered when it would ever be needed. Then Ithought maybe it is when we use those prayers for the Feast of Joseph the Worker in May
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griego_catolico
Guest
It happened again during the televised morning Mass for the Feast of the Chair of Saint Peter this past Feb. 22, 2013.I know it is not supposed to be sung durring lent but today was the feast of st Joseph I watched the mass on EWTN and they sang alleluia instead of the lenten gospel acclamation
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