Altar boys (o sorry i mean) "servers"

[sancte_joseph]

I read a quote in these forums that said something like

“Boys don’t want to do what little girl are doing”

and because of that boys are not attracted to the possibility of being a priest since more and more girls are replacing them at the altar.

Do you believe this is true?

 

[Angel_Bradford]

No, I don’t believe that is true.

 

[T700]

Girls drink milk, so do boys. Girls watch cartoons, so do boys. Girls ride bikes, so do boys. Girls receive communion, so do boys.

No, I think it is incorrect to assume that just because a female does something that a male will not. I now will sit back and wait for the CAF-storm to form for several pages.

Paul

 

[JuanCarlos]

“Pope Gelasius in his ninth letter (chap. 26) to the bishops of Lucania condemned the evil practice which had been introduced of women serving the priest at the celebration of Mass. Since this abuse had spread to the Greeks, Innocent IV strictly forbade it in his letter to the bishop of Tusculum: “Women should not dare to serve at the altar; they should be altogether refused this ministry.” We too have forbidden this practice in the same words in Our oft-repeated constitution Etsi Pastoralis, sect. 6, no. 21.”

-Allatae Sunt, Benedict XIV

 

[palmas85]

I read a quote in these forums that said something like

“Boys don’t want to do what little girl are doing”

and because of that boys are not attracted to the possibility of being a priest since more and more girls are replacing them at the altar.

Do you believe this is true?

Good question. I know that when I was in my pre teen years I didn’t particularly want to be around girls that much. I was very shy as are most boys that age. So I think there may be some validity in that statement.

But I think that female altar servers are bring pushed as a way to get the Church to change it’s position on the possibility of female priests. What other reason could there be. I also know that many parishes are making a dedicated effort to have equal representation of males and females serving at the altar.

 

[Dauphin]

I would refuse to serve the Mass if an “altar girl” were present. Gladly, I only serve the EF, so I never have to worry about it.

It makes me sick whenever I see it.

 

[Tsuwano]

In my parish girls and boys serve God and the community side by side as servers. We have never had problems in this area and our diocese continues to have vocations. Many of these problems concerning girls as servers at the altar appear imaginary to me.

 

[brotherhrolf]

Good question. I know that when I was in my pre teen years I didn’t particularly want to be around girls that much. I was very shy as are most boys that age. So I think there may be some validity in that statement.

But I think that female altar servers are bring pushed as a way to get the Church to change it’s position on the possibility of female priests. What other reason could there be. I also know that many parishes are making a dedicated effort to have equal representation of males and females serving at the altar.

I couldn’t agree with you more. We took our duties seriously way back when and our duties were far more than “servers” today. We have young ladies as female altar servers in my cathedral parish. The traditional “acolyte” duties are handled by our male “acolytes” who are in their 40s and 50s.

We’ve only had them for the last five or so years. They are pretty much limited to “just being there” on the altar. To be fair, however, even our male servers have greatly reduced roles than they would have had when you and I were boys.

On the other, other hand…it would never have occurred to my sister or any of my female classmates to want to be an altar server in the late 50s/early 60s. Everyone would have looked at them as if they were demented. Much of this is a product of the feminist movement of the 70s…It is societal rather than ecclesial.

 

[Cruikshank_s]

From experience, when I started serving, my brother refused to serve the “girl mass”. That was where we were needed to serve though… I went in a suffered the indignity, he was allowed to sit on the sidelines until the morning “boy mass” had positions open. Unfair to say the least. I was NEVER approached about a possible vocation when I served with the girls. It was only while serving with other altar boys that the subject was brought up. A connection? Possibly, but what I know to be true is this: Altar serving has one overall goal and function: To allow the young men serving to imagine themselves as priests and consider it a possibility for their lives. Is it right to foster such thoughts in young women? No.

 

[malphono]

Girls drink milk, so do boys. Girls watch cartoons, so do boys. Girls ride bikes, so do boys. Girls receive communion, so do boys.

All true.
But … for example:
boys don’t (usually and in general) play with Betsy Wetsy (or whatever it’s called these days – I hear there’s a new one that does more than just wet)
boys (usually and in general) don’t have Barbies
boys (usually and in general) don’t use the girl’s room
boys (usually and in general) don’t excel at home-ec
and
girls (usually and in general) don’t play with trains
girls (usually and in general) don’t ask Santa for a Hess (or Tonka, or whatever) truck for Christmas
girls (usually and in general) don’t use the boy’s room
girls (usually and in general) don’t excel at shop

Yes, I know, there are exceptions. There always were.

T700:

No, I think it is incorrect to assume that just because a female does something that a male will not. I now will sit back and wait for the CAF-storm to form for several pages.

No storm here, maybe just a gust of wind (or hot air ), but there’s no denying that there were and are things that boys will normally shun because it’s considered a “girl” thing.

palmas85:

… I know that when I was in my pre teen years I didn’t particularly want to be around girls that much. I was very shy as are most boys that age. So I think there may be some validity in that statement.

FWIW, I agree. Back in the days when tyrannosaurs, pterodactyls, and mastedons roamed the earth, (aka in the the days when what is now called the EF was the “OF” (i.e. ONLY FORM) of the Roman Rite) there were only altar boys. There didn’t seem to be any jealousy or discontent among the girls.

 

[muffinmojo]

I dunno about that. However, I do know that the servers at my parish for ‘high’ Masses(I mean OF Masses on Holy Days, which have more servers, incense, etc), which are all boys, have a sort of camraderie and humor that would be lost with girls serving with them.

Our parish has a few altar girls, but they are used very rarely, on regular sundays. The two are never mixed, either. It’s either all girls or all boys. Girls usually have to stop around middle school age, but boys can stay on and become ‘senior severs’, for Holy Days, and to serve as the principle server, who functions as crucifer, book-holder, and assists in setting the altar. I find this works quite well, especially as girls are encouraged to join the choir or some other means of participation.

 

[DaveBj]

I read a quote in these forums that said something like

“Boys don’t want to do what little girl are doing”

and because of that boys are not attracted to the possibility of being a priest since more and more girls are replacing them at the altar.

Do you believe this is true?

It is not universally true, with regard to all boys, and with regard to all activities (like drinking milk and brushing teeth).

It is true with regard to some boys and with regard to some activities, and there is anecdotal evidence on these forums about boys not wanting to serve because they would have to serve with girls. I’m not saying it’s right or wrong, only that it is what it is.

Funny side-story–as some of you know, I sometimes serve as altar geezer for the 0630 weekday masses, when Deacon Michael is gone, and our semi-disabled {knees and feet] pastor is presiding. During the approach to Christmas, there was a call in the bulletin for altar servers to call the offie and let them know of their availability, and Miss Bonnie said that I should call. I demurred, pointing out that serving a weekday morning Mass is very different from serving a Sunday Mass.

There is a family that sit across the aisle from us on Sunday mornings, and their 9-ish daughter frequently serves. I told Miss Bonnie, wouldn’t it be funny if I were to serve one of the Christmas Masses, and the little girl were to be my boss, because otherwise I might not know what I was doing

DaveBj

 

[pamnbam]

My diocese either still doesn’t allow or makes it the decision of the pastor to allow female altar servers. I have not yet seen female servers in my diocese.

One priest mentioned that it was because a large number of males in our diocese (DC area) choose to enter the priesthood, and most of these males have been altar servers. When girls enter the equation, it “makes light of” (for lack of better words) the server position (of assisting the priest), and boys want to avoid that, so they would quit if they knew they had to serve with girls.

I am totally fine with all-male altar servers; it just doesn’t seem “right” to have a girl serving, even though I’m sure she’d do a good job.

I hope my son chooses to become an altar server when he’s old enough.

 

[Lujack]

I would refuse to serve the Mass if an “altar girl” were present. Gladly, I only serve the EF, so I never have to worry about it.

It makes me sick whenever I see it.

This would strike me as wrong. While it may not be ideal, it has been indulted, so the Mass is not illicit or invalid.

 

[Dauphin]

This would strike me as wrong. While it may not be ideal, it has been indulted, so the Mass is not illicit or invalid.

I feel I would be participating in a tacit endorsement of female “ordination”. With a long-term view, this is precisely what certain elements in the Church are trying to achieve with female altar servers. Although there’s nothing intrinsically evil about it, that’s what makes it so devious; it uses morally licit means to achieve an immoral end.

Anyway, the issue is moot. The priest I serve would never permit it.

 

[dove51]

I have to attend an OF Mass every now and then. It is always girl altar servers, and mostly women as Eucharistic ministers or lectors. I think that if boys grow up in that kind of Mass setting, they probably wouldn’t associate the priesthood or a life in the Church with masculinity.

 

[mikew262]

I would refuse to serve the Mass if an “altar girl” were present. Gladly, I only serve the EF, so I never have to worry about it.

It makes me sick whenever I see it.

Oh brother! Why would serving God make anybody sick?

 

[Lujack]

I feel I would be participating in a tacit endorsement of female “ordination”. With a long-term view, this is precisely what certain elements in the Church are trying to achieve with female altar servers. Although there’s nothing intrinsically evil about it, that’s what makes it so devious; it uses morally licit means to achieve an immoral end.

If merely serving the mass is tacitly endorsing female ordination, then the Church itself is tacitly endorsing female ordination, because they indulted it.

Besides, for most parishes I’ve been to, there is no long-term goal. Both parishes I’ve seen altar girls at grew very quickly very fast and merely wanted to fill out the schedule.

 

[JuanCarlos]

If merely serving the mass is tacitly endorsing female ordination, then the Church itself is tacitly endorsing female ordination, because they indulted it.

Besides, for most parishes I’ve been to, there is no long-term goal. Both parishes I’ve seen altar girls at grew very quickly very fast and merely wanted to fill out the schedule.

Indulted it only because Vatican calls to end the practice were almost universally ignored.

The Church is not infallible in every little thing; She can (and does) make imprudent decisions. In this altar boy’s opinion, allowing girl altar-boys was very imprudent.

 

[LRThunder]

Indulted it only because Vatican calls to end the practice were almost universally ignored.

The Church is not infallible in every little thing; She can (and does) make imprudent decisions. In this altar boy’s opinion, allowing girl altar-boys was very imprudent.

Female altar servers are only allowed in dioceses if the local bishop permits it. If the bishop allows them, then it’s up to the pastor of the parish, and then whoever is celebrating Mass.

No priest can be compelled to use female altar servers at Mass. They may serve, but only with the bishop’s permission for the entire diocese.