Am I able to get divorced?

[Cory_G]

I have been researching the marriage sacrament and I cannot come to a conclusion involving my own situation. If anyone has some insight to offer me I would appreciate it.

I am trying to return to the Catholic Church. I was baptized, first communion, but not confirmed (as a child).

When I was 19 I joined the military, had a child, and was married. I married in Reno at a standard Las Vegas style wedding chapel. As stated, I am a baptized Catholic and she was baptized at a protestant church camp of some sort. (At least I think she was, the church was never apart of our lives.)

We divorced in 2005 in court. I am considering getting remarried, but before I do I am trying to get right with the Church.

What I am trying to figure out is if I am able to be divorced or am I stuck being single for the rest of my life?

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I have been researching the marriage sacrament and I cannot come to a conclusion involving my own situation. If anyone has some insight to offer me I would appreciate it.

I am trying to return to the Catholic Church. I was baptized, first communion, but not confirmed (as a child).

When I was 19 I joined the military, had a child, and was married. I married in Reno at a standard Las Vegas style wedding chapel. As stated, I am a baptized Catholic and she was baptized at a protestant church camp of some sort. (At least I think she was, the church was never apart of our lives.)

We divorced in 2005 in court. I am considering getting remarried, but before I do I am trying to get right with the Church.

What I am trying to figure out is if I am able to be divorced or am I stuck being single for the rest of my life?

You are 'Divorced" generally speaking divorce is a matter of civil law. The Church views Divorce as a permanent or semi-permanent separation if validly Married. You however need to speak with your pastor and explain your situation, he may have you supply him with documentation on your Baptism, and other Sacraments, as well as the Marriage papers and divorce papers. What you are seeking is a Declaration of Nullity (probably because of Defect of Form), that you did not Marry according to the laws of the Catholic Church.

 

[Cory_G]

I did have a meeting with my pastor. I am suppose to go back next week because I am waiting on a copy of my baptismal certificate in the mail. I am just anxious to get any kind of insight into my situation.

Thank you for the defect of form reference. I read this: ewtn.com/vexperts/showmessage.asp?number=481674&Pg=&Pgnu=&recnu=

So this link states, and what I think you stated, was that my previous marriage was invalid regardless that we were both baptized Christians because we didn’t have the ceremony in the CC?

 

[FrDavid96]

I did have a meeting with my pastor. I am suppose to go back next week because I am waiting on a copy of my baptismal certificate in the mail. I am just anxious to get any kind of insight into my situation.

Thank you for the defect of form reference. I read this: ewtn.com/vexperts/showmessage.asp?number=481674&Pg=&Pgnu=&recnu=

So this link states, and what I think you stated, was that my previous marriage was invalid regardless that we were both baptized Christians because we didn’t have the ceremony in the CC?

Cory,

The fact that one (or both) of the spouses in the wedding was Catholic means that the wedding had to be celebrated in a Catholic church or with permission of the bishop. Since that was lacking, it makes proving the marriage invalid a very simple thing.
So yes, your understanding is correct.

 

[Cory_G]

Thank you both so much. I was searching for the validity of our baptisms, the fact I wasn’t confirmed, that we were married in Reno.

I guess it was an easy question I just made super complicated. Thank you again.

 

[FrDavid96]

Thank you both so much. I was searching for the validity of our baptisms, the fact I wasn’t confirmed, that we were married in Reno.

I guess it was an easy question I just made super complicated. Thank you again.

Well, you will probably need a recent copy of your baptismal certificate when you submit the paperwork requesting a declaration of nullity anyway. You can check that one off the list early!

 

[Corki]

Thank you both so much. I was searching for the validity of our baptisms, the fact I wasn’t confirmed, that we were married in Reno.

I guess it was an easy question I just made super complicated. Thank you again.

Confirmation doesn’t enter into the scenarion in this case. Why would you doubt the validity of your baptism?

 

[FrDavid96]

Confirmation doesn’t enter into the scenarion in this case. Why would you doubt the validity of your baptism?

On the one hand, your request for an annulment is based on the claim that you were baptised a Catholic, so you need the certificate to prove the fact.

On the other hand, the back of your baptismal certificate will list your confirmation (or lack of it) and any marriages. The absence of any recorded marriages lends support to your claim that you did not receive the permission of the bishop before you got married.

It only helps you.

 

[jmcrae]

I did have a meeting with my pastor. I am suppose to go back next week because I am waiting on a copy of my baptismal certificate in the mail. I am just anxious to get any kind of insight into my situation.

Thank you for the defect of form reference. I read this: ewtn.com/vexperts/showmessage.asp?number=481674&Pg=&Pgnu=&recnu=

So this link states, and what I think you stated, was that my previous marriage was invalid regardless that we were both baptized Christians because we didn’t have the ceremony in the CC?

This is for the Tribunal to discern, but a surface view (which is all we have out here on the Internet) seems to indicate that that might be your situation, UNLESS something happened later (renewal of vows, for example) that could have caused the marriage to become valid at a later time.

The Tribunal will do a thorough investigation of your situation and let you know what your actual status is.

Presuming there are no complicating factors, they will most likely rule on your side, and fairly quickly.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I did have a meeting with my pastor. I am suppose to go back next week because I am waiting on a copy of my baptismal certificate in the mail. I am just anxious to get any kind of insight into my situation.

Thank you for the defect of form reference. I read this: ewtn.com/vexperts/showmessage.asp?number=481674&Pg=&Pgnu=&recnu=

So this link states, and what I think you stated, was that my previous marriage was invalid regardless that we were both baptized Christians because we didn’t have the ceremony in the CC?

I cannot specifically make any judgments on your specific situation over the internet, because I do not have all the necessary details or authority, But generally speaking you only need to prove you were Baptized Catholic. The Marriage took place outside the Catholic Form.

 

[Cory_G]

Confirmation doesn’t enter into the scenarion in this case. Why would you doubt the validity of your baptism?

I don’t doubt that I was baptized. I called the Church from my hometown and they are mailing me my baptism certificate.

I was wondering about my ex-wife’s baptism and how it related to marriage, since I read that the Church recognizes other church’s baptisms as valid. But I have also read the opposite, that the Church doesn’t recognize other churches baptisms.

Very confusing, to me at least.

 

[Corki]

I don’t doubt that I was baptized. I called the Church from my hometown and they are mailing me my baptism certificate.

I was wondering about my ex-wife’s baptism and how it related to marriage, since I read that the Church recognizes other church’s baptisms as valid. But I have also read the opposite, that the Church doesn’t recognize other churches baptisms.

Very confusing, to me at least.

Thanks for clarifying. The Church generally recognizes baptisms received in non-Catholic Christian churches as long as they are done with water and the trinitarian form. But her Baptism isn’t an issue in a defect of form process. You were (are) Catholic, you (not her) were supposed to follow Church law when getting married, you did not follow them. Taking into account the other factors in jmcrae’s post, defect of form basically looks at whether you, the Catholic, followed Catholic canon law. It wouldn’t matter if your wife was a non-Catholic Christian, a Catholic, or a non-Christian.

 

[FrDavid96]

I don’t doubt that I was baptized. I called the Church from my hometown and they are mailing me my baptism certificate.

I was wondering about my ex-wife’s baptism and how it related to marriage, since I read that the Church recognizes other church’s baptisms as valid. But I have also read the opposite, that the Church doesn’t recognize other churches baptisms.

Very confusing, to me at least.

Yes, it can be very confusing indeed. Until relatively recently, it was easy to determine if a baptism performed in a non-Catholic ecclesial community was a valid baptism (it was a simple yes or no). Nowadays, however we can no longer take that for granted because some ecclesial communities allow “baptism” by mentioning other names, not the Blessed Trinity. Those are not baptisms. But that only affects recent cases.

It is not likely that the baptismal status of your ex-wife will come into play here. Take that with extreme caution. I say it’s not likely, but your diocese makes that determination, not someone on the internet like me (laughs, but serious laughs). Edit: please do not think that I’m saying they won’t ask you; they may very well do so.

Your baptism however is very relevant, so it is a good thing that your own baptismal certificate is on its way.

[By the way, it seems I thought “Cory” and “Corki” were the same person (my eyes aint what they usta be). Sorry if that caused confusion.]

 

[quiet52]

I’m glad to hear you’re wanting to “get right with the Church.” That means you want to be in communion with Christ our Lord and His one Body.

In addition to seeking a petition of nullity, I recommend that you prepare for your Confirmation. Joining your parish’s RCIA group would be a good idea. At minimum, talk with your pastor about preparing yourself for the sacrament of Reconciliation. Make sure you understand it (including mortal vs. venial sins, firm purpose of amendment, etc.) before going to confession.

Are you doing right by your child? Are you talking to him/her about the faith? Ask your pastor for his advice in this area.

You mentioned you’re considering remarriage. Are you already engaged? You shouldn’t be, because until the Tribunal has declared your marriage to be null, you’re married in the eyes of the Church.

If you’re sexually active, cut it out – something else to talk with your pastor (and learn in RCIA or Confirmation classes) about.

May you enjoy your journey back to the Lord and His holy Church.

 

[Cory_G]

I hope that my ex-wife’s baptism does not come into play. She has remarried, I don’t know him so he may or may not be Catholic.

In regards to the remarriage, well that really wasn’t my idea. Even though I was officially divorced in 2005, my wife and I split in 2003, we just took our times getting the paperwork done. I have a girlfriend who I have been with I since 2004, so we are nearing 5 years. Since we live together my pastor told me I either marry her or leave her, this is another big dilemma in my life right now.

So it’s not that I am engaged or even have a want to get married, I am stuck between a rock and a hard place. I guess this passage sums my life up right now:

(Mat 19:21-22, NIV) Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.” When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Not that I am wealthy, but in order to be right by God I need to basically turn my life upside down.

 

[FrDavid96]

I hope that my ex-wife’s baptism does not come into play. She has remarried, I don’t know him so he may or may not be Catholic.

In regards to the remarriage, well that really wasn’t my idea. Even though I was officially divorced in 2005, my wife and I split in 2003, we just took our times getting the paperwork done. I have a girlfriend who I have been with I since 2004, so we are nearing 5 years. Since we live together my pastor told me I either marry her or leave her, this is another big dilemma in my life right now.

So it’s not that I am engaged or even have a want to get married, I am stuck between a rock and a hard place. I guess this passage sums my life up right now:

(Mat 19:21-22, NIV) Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.” When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

Not that I am wealthy, but in order to be right by God I need to basically turn my life upside down.

Cory,
It’s one thing for good people here to give you some answers on questions about canon law, how the annulment process works, and how it might apply in your situation.

But I’m concerned now that as the issue gets more personal, it becomes less and less likely that strangers on the internet (well meaning though we might be) are just not in a position to give you proper guidance, especially considering the fact that we only have short snippets of your situation. We become more and more likely to make all kinds of assumptions, and offer bad counsel based on those.

We all want you to do the right thing. We all want you to come back to the Church. The Church is praying for you. God and His Church stand ready to welcome you back with open arms. Never forget that.

I simply feel that at this point, you will be much better speaking with your local priest about your personal situation. He’ll ask the right questions, and give you the right guidance.

You have already begun that journey back to the Church. You’ve already done the most difficult part (even though it might not seem that way at the moment). Please continue going back to that priest and let him be your spiritual guide.

The best way that we (on the internet) can help you at this point is to pray for you. Be assured that we are, and if you feel comfortable doing so, please keep us posted on your progress.

And as for a Gospel verse that sums up your life right now, try this one: “But while he was yet at a distance, his father saw him and had compassion, and ran and embraced him and kissed him” (Lk 15:20)

 

[Cory_G]

Prodigal son, I will think on that one.

Thank you for your help, I understand that it is best to work with my local priest, I am simply a anxious person in everything that I do. I am working with them and I will continue to work with them. Tomorrow will be my first Mass in a very long time, in our Parish I am to sit with the RCIA class and then afterwords have a reflection class. I am looking forward to it.

Thank you all for your advice, kind words, and support.

 

[jmcrae]

I hope that my ex-wife’s baptism does not come into play. She has remarried, I don’t know him so he may or may not be Catholic.

In regards to the remarriage, well that really wasn’t my idea. Even though I was officially divorced in 2005, my wife and I split in 2003, we just took our times getting the paperwork done. I have a girlfriend who I have been with I since 2004, so we are nearing 5 years. Since we live together my pastor told me I either marry her or leave her, this is another big dilemma in my life right now.

Well, he is not saying that you can’t be her boyfriend any more - just that one of you needs to take a separate apartment, and obviously if you have been having sex, that has to stop, also. But you can certainly continue to take her out and be her friend.

The Church would tell you that if you don’t want to get married, then you should not get married. Marriage is a very serious, life long commitment to each other to become the foundation of a new family - a new and redeemed Adam and Eve.

One also does not need to be married to be a good Catholic.

I second Father David’s advice to keep consulting with your priest, and keep him as your first “go to” for advice and counsel. We out here on the Internet can speak only in generalities - we don’t know your personal situation - and for a very good reason, too: it’s none of our business.