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Jean_Anthony
Guest
Let’s remember to keep the discussion civil, everyone. We can disagree without being disagreeable, yes? Thank you all.
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Jenny_Z
Guest
Ok, then just re-word what I said. Keep in touch with him, tell him you can date because you don’t have an annulment. Whatever. You get the point.
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anjoh66
Guest
Yes i get the point.
What i mean is that it is very likely that there wont be any annulment so there is no use to build false hopes.
Get the point?
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Jenny_Z
Guest
Considering the circumstances of their marriage (already have a kid, one on the way), it sounds like there’s probably good grounds for an annulment (being pressured into marriage because of kids). But that’s purely speculation on my part.
Yes i get the point.
What i mean is that it is very likely that there wont be any annulment so there is no use to build false hopes.
Get the point?
You can still stay friends with a guy if you’re not dating him. Or at least keep in touch, as long as you don’t put yourself in a situation that could lead to sin.
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PastGrandKnight
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MARYBEKAH
Guest
I’m sorry, but why exactly would you think that it is very like that an annulment would not be granted? I’m just wondering, because I haven’t really explained my situation or myself or my ex-husband in depth.
Yes i get the point.
What i mean is that it is very likely that there wont be any annulment so there is no use to build false hopes.
Get the point?
And furthermore, I really feel that all the other questions that arose from my simple question of “am I allowed to date” are irrelevant, such as the questions about my conversion and the communion I’ve received since, etc.
I’ve gathered the general consensus that the teachings of the Church are to not date until and IF my marriage is declared invalid. And so I have discussed this with the guy - he was very understanding and we agreed to remain friends. Thank you for the helpful comments.
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anjoh66
Guest
I think i made myself clear when i said the questions is not about you in person, its in general.
Concerning the annulment i am not a person to give verdicts, and as you said i dont know your situation, what i meant when i said it is likely it will not be granted is:
In a case of a conversion the marriage status of that person is investigated because someone can not convert and recieve communion if their marriage status is not ok with the church.
Now later things happened and an annulment is requested because now it suits the purposes, but seems like it did not at the time of the conversion.
Therefore i see it possible, but of course not certain, that the tribunal will find that it was a valid marriage.
If it was not a valid marriage, then the truth has not been told in the time of the conversion, why didnt those problems come up into light at that time?
Why wait till now?
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MARYBEKAH
Guest
I converted first, then was married on Easter Vigil. I really all happened at the same time. My ex husband was married twice before we got married. His 2nd wife, he divorced, then she passed away. He never had his first marriage annuled, but it was only a civil marriage, so we didn’t think he had to. Now I’m reading and hearing that his first marriage may have to have been annuled…besides, there are several other issues that existed at the time we were married. I’ve been told by the Monsignor at my church that I’m in good standing with the church (i.e. ok to receive the Eucharist), and that my marriage was probably not valid from the beginning.
I am fully aware of the possibility that my marrige will be found to be valid and I’m not getting my hopes up. I’m very prepared for having to spend the rest of my life alone if the annulment is not granted.
Could you clarify what you’re speculating? Are you saying that my conversion may be invalid? and if not, why? Please clarify.
Thank you.
I am fully aware of the possibility that my marrige will be found to be valid and I’m not getting my hopes up. I’m very prepared for having to spend the rest of my life alone if the annulment is not granted.
Could you clarify what you’re speculating? Are you saying that my conversion may be invalid? and if not, why? Please clarify.
Thank you.
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MARYBEKAH
Guest
The problems existed at the time of our wedding - they were just ignored. I was 22, we had a child together, and another on the way. We got married for ALL the wrong reasons. We weren’t getting along, he was emotionally and verbally abusive, he cheated, and later the abuse became physical. Hope that sheds some light on things. Getting married, at the time, SEEMED like the right (moral) thing to do. We had been living in sin together for well over a year, and I had started taking RCIA classes. I was told by my Godfather/RCIA instructor that if we continued living together after my sacraments were received, I would not be able to receive communion. So, the pressure was on, and we thought that since we were already living together with kids, we might as well get married. Yeah, I know it was an ill-advised, poor decision, one that I regret all the time, but it’s done.
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GodIsGracious
Guest
MaryBekah,
I just wanted to say that there are women out there who are divorced and still hold to their marriage vows, ending up single mothers. It’s not the ideal situation, and it’s not easy, but there are women who do it. My mother was one of them.
As a kid I never understood why she didn’t just remarry. Well, I understand why now. As I got older, I did ask her to seek a declaration of nullity. She never did. So, I commend you for doing what you can to rely on the church.
God bless.
I just wanted to say that there are women out there who are divorced and still hold to their marriage vows, ending up single mothers. It’s not the ideal situation, and it’s not easy, but there are women who do it. My mother was one of them.
As a kid I never understood why she didn’t just remarry. Well, I understand why now. As I got older, I did ask her to seek a declaration of nullity. She never did. So, I commend you for doing what you can to rely on the church.
God bless.
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anjoh66
Guest
No i dont think your conversion was invalid, a conversion is a matter of intention, not marriage even if you get the annulment it will not affect your conversion.I converted first, then was married on Easter Vigil. I really all happened at the same time. My ex husband was married twice before we got married. His 2nd wife, he divorced, then she passed away. He never had his first marriage annuled, but it was only a civil marriage, so we didn’t think he had to. Now I’m reading and hearing that his first marriage may have to have been annuled…besides, there are several other issues that existed at the time we were married. I’ve been told by the Monsignor at my church that I’m in good standing with the church (i.e. ok to receive the Eucharist), and that my marriage was probably not valid from the beginning.
I am fully aware of the possibility that my marrige will be found to be valid and I’m not getting my hopes up. I’m very prepared for having to spend the rest of my life alone if the annulment is not granted.
Could you clarify what you’re speculating? Are you saying that my conversion may be invalid? and if not, why? Please clarify.
Thank you.
You converted with sincerity and you plan to stick on that path, thats obvious, so God will not abandon you, but to get an annulment is not an easy thing, i dont know any statistics about the number of inquierers and how many is acctually granted an annullment.
We must remember that it is not the authority of the church to apply an annulment instead of a divorce thats what i am saying.
It just is a pity all this that happened to you, it seems like you rushed into a marriage without thinking of its consequenses, also feeling somehow forced, maybe you also was eager to convert and therefore married him in the church.
Everything is easy when you know the answers, but seems like the best thing would have been to never marry him and delay the conversion, how much easier it would have been.
Anyhow you are doing well to keep on follow the teachings of the church even in this difficult time, and for that you will be rewarded by God in a way not foreseen by men.
Concerning your husbands civil marriage i am quite shure that it will not be counted as a marriage in the eyes of the church, a catholic or even any baptised christian is required to marry only in the church all else will not be counted as a marriage.
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MARYBEKAH
Guest
I would like to eventually meet and share my life with someone, yes. I definitely don’t want to end up in the same kind of situation like my 1st marriage, though. However, the main reason I seek an annulment is because I feel that I’m still tied to my ex husband for no reason conducive to maintaining a healthy, happy family. I don’t want to be tied to him anymore. There’s no real reason to, in my eyes.
But, at this point, I must put it in God’s hands and wait to see what comes of it, and trust in whatever results from my annulment petition, whether I like it or not. Such is what I vowed when I received my sacraments.
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MARYBEKAH
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GodIsGracious
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anjoh66
Guest
Well, all you can do is to wait for the answer from the tribunal and whatever it will be God will not abandon you.
I keep you in my prayers.
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MARYBEKAH
Guest
Thank you all for your prayers.
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Sillara
Guest
Actually, it is only Catholics who are required to marry in the Church. Protestants can quite validly marry with Justice of the Peace. And, assuming those Protestants were validly baptized, that marriage would sacramental, too.
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anjoh66
Guest
I mean that a baptised christian must marry according to their church, a civil marriage is not valid for them.
This is what a priest told me when we was discussing the problems of marriage.
He said that if a baptised christian should marry civil and later divorce and mary another person, if that christian wanna be catholic there will be no problem with the marital status as the first marriage would not be valid in the eyes of the church.
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manwithblackhat
Guest
Some respondents have said that the questioner should act as if she is still married. Inasmuch as a Christian marriage involves a promise made between two people, and if only in terms of day-to-day living, this would be impractical. Then again, it also involves a promise made to, and in the sight of, God. So without the presence of the other spouse, the presence of God remains with the bond.
Marybekah, you need to speak to a good priest – NOW! You will get more from that experience than from anything said here. I would petition for a declaration of nullity sooner rather than later. It is easier to gather evidence. (We call it an annulment, not to mislead, but because the term is easier to say, okay everybody?) As to dating in the interim, one is bound by the obligations to the bond, regardless of the other party. This is worth pointing out in cases where the other party has abandoned you, especially to marry someone else, as happened to me.
Find things to do to distract you. Some women are too busy raising their children alone to worry about dating. Service work in the parish or the community, a night out with the girls (which doesn’t always involve getting picked up, for those of you who don’t get out much), development of hobbies – all are worthy distractions, and remedies for melancholy.
People “date” for all manner of reasons. The most common is courtship. But it’s hard to go to a dance, for example, without a partner. (I’m thinking swing or ballroom here.) In time, someone who respects your situation might be a regular companion. It doesn’t necessarily involve behavior that would compromise you. But it would be important to wait until a certain emotional vulnerability passes, in order to minimize the near occasion of sin.
Finally, my advice to most people in your situation, is to form your conscience correctly, but otherwise remain discreet about your private life, so as not give others the luxury of being in your business. People love to tell a divorced Catholic how they should run their lives, perhaps out of the belief that married people don’t need to be told. But you know what you need to do, and you don’t need a bunch of nosy Nellies to tell you. There are already people in this forum trying to second-guess the validity of a bond, with the barest amount of information. And this is the best you can do?
None of this changes what the Church teaches us. It just makes it easier.
Marybekah, you need to speak to a good priest – NOW! You will get more from that experience than from anything said here. I would petition for a declaration of nullity sooner rather than later. It is easier to gather evidence. (We call it an annulment, not to mislead, but because the term is easier to say, okay everybody?) As to dating in the interim, one is bound by the obligations to the bond, regardless of the other party. This is worth pointing out in cases where the other party has abandoned you, especially to marry someone else, as happened to me.
Find things to do to distract you. Some women are too busy raising their children alone to worry about dating. Service work in the parish or the community, a night out with the girls (which doesn’t always involve getting picked up, for those of you who don’t get out much), development of hobbies – all are worthy distractions, and remedies for melancholy.
People “date” for all manner of reasons. The most common is courtship. But it’s hard to go to a dance, for example, without a partner. (I’m thinking swing or ballroom here.) In time, someone who respects your situation might be a regular companion. It doesn’t necessarily involve behavior that would compromise you. But it would be important to wait until a certain emotional vulnerability passes, in order to minimize the near occasion of sin.
Finally, my advice to most people in your situation, is to form your conscience correctly, but otherwise remain discreet about your private life, so as not give others the luxury of being in your business. People love to tell a divorced Catholic how they should run their lives, perhaps out of the belief that married people don’t need to be told. But you know what you need to do, and you don’t need a bunch of nosy Nellies to tell you. There are already people in this forum trying to second-guess the validity of a bond, with the barest amount of information. And this is the best you can do?
None of this changes what the Church teaches us. It just makes it easier.
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wanabsaint
Guest
I don’t usually comment on questions in the forum, however, I feel a strong necessity to do so now. Some background first, I am 63 have been married for 45+years and have 5 adult children and 12 grandchildren. Five years ago I went through a civil divorce and have not as yet taken steps for a nullification. When I became ‘single’ I knew that there would be no male/female relationships because the Church teaches against it. It is my under-standing that UNTIL nullification has been granted one is still ‘married’. I applaud the decision to break off the relationship until after a nullification is granted, if it is not granted then it is marriage until death do part. A celebate life is difficult when one has been used to companionship for so long but it is the only life that is pleasing to God. One wrong does not make another right, therefore, it is always best not to assume anything and to live the law of the Lord. One of my teen-age grandaughters says that I have a boy-friend and that HIS name is Jesus…she is so right!
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