Americans-murdered-illegals-today-national-rememberance-day-1091/

[foolishmortal]

alipac.us/content/americans-murdered-illegals-today-national-rememberance-day-1091/
The day we recognize not all are poor immigrants looking for a better life, but that there are human trafficers, terrorists and, allegedly, Chinese nationals, amongst them, is the day we'll have a more credible voice in this matter. It's unfortunate some on EWTN-esque Catholic media have called it "hateful" to be taking measures to prevent illegal immigrants, which would be more the NCReporter's slant on the story. It's social justice for average folk and the border patrol, who deserve this justice, as well and social justice for those coming here to do it the right way. Helping businesses grow in Mexico all these decades would have been more charitable than condemning our border protection and laws, which are softer than our federal ones and more charitable than Mexico's to to those south of them.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

“Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

Mat 25:31 And when the Son of man shall come in his majesty, and all the angels with him, then shall he sit upon the seat of his majesty.
Mat 25:32 And all nations shall be gathered together before him: and he shall separate them one from another, as the shepherd separateth the sheep from the goats:
Mat 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left.
Mat 25:34 Then shall the king say to them that shall be on his right hand: Come, ye blessed of my Father, possess you the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.
Mat 25:35 For I was hungry, and you gave me to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me to drink: I was a stranger, and you took me in****:
Mat 25:36 Naked, and you covered me: sick, and you visited me: I was in prison, and you came to me.
Mat 25:37 Then shall the just answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry and fed thee: thirsty and gave thee drink?
Mat 25:38 Or when did we see thee a stranger and took thee in? Or naked and covered thee?
Mat 25:39 Or when did we see thee sick or in prison and came to thee?
Mat 25:40 And the king answering shall say to them: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it to one of these my least brethren, you did it to me.
Mat 25:41 Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire, which was prepared for the devil and his angels.
Mat 25:42 For I was hungry and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty and you gave me not to drink.
Mat 25:43 I was a stranger and you took me not in: naked and you covered me not: sick and in prison and you did not visit me.
Mat 25:44 Then they also shall answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison and did not minister to thee?
Mat 25:45 Then he shall answer them, saying: Amen: I say to you, as long as you did it not to one of these least, neither did you do it to me.
Mat 25:46 And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting.

 

[St_Francis]

Wanting to regulate immigration to keep *everyone *safer is not wrong. It’s not as if we’re advocating stopping legal immigration–some people are but I don’t know of anyone here who advocates that.

 

[IrishRush]

“Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

I’m also aware of the quote from the Statue of Liberty, and am very familiar with the scripture you cite. But when you post these with no comment accompanying them, then the implication is that you are in support of lawless immigration.
I believe in helping those less fortunate. However, I also believe in lawful behavior - and that the vast majority of the laws are in place to keep order and for the protection of American citizens. There must be some sort of order to immigration. Our country is not nearly as unpopulated as it was one or two centuries ago. If we just throw the gates wide and let everyone in, it would be a very short time before lawlessness, overcrowding and unemployment are out of control.
Empathy and caring are required of us as Christians, but we must also use common sense and good judgment. :twocents:

 

[DarkLight]

The bigger problem I think is that legal immigration is expensive. I’d have to find it, but I know one woman who found it was several thousand dollars to get her british spouse into the country - a well-educated, english-speaking man in a love-match to an american citizen. It’s simply beyond the reach of most poor, yet there are few to no opportunities in their own countries.

 

[Dale_M]

The bigger problem I think is that legal immigration is expensive.

Another problem is the waiting lists. The US assigns maximum caps on the number of immigrants from different counties. The numbers differ according to the country and according to the immigration category. But in some cases the waiting list to get permission to enter the US may be many years long. This can be a hardship when a family is separated by the border.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

I’m also aware of the quote from the Statue of Liberty, and am very familiar with the scripture you cite. But when you post these with no comment accompanying them, then the implication is that you are in support of lawless immigration.
I believe in helping those less fortunate. However, I also believe in lawful behavior - and that the vast majority of the laws are in place to keep order and for the protection of American citizens. There must be some sort of order to immigration. Our country is not nearly as unpopulated as it was one or two centuries ago. If we just throw the gates wide and let everyone in, it would be a very short time before lawlessness, overcrowding and unemployment are out of control.
Empathy and caring are required of us as Christians, but we must also use common sense and good judgment. :twocents:

Christ sent His out to all nations, not making mention of immigrating legally, or stopping at borders, as a concern. The Holy Family escaped Herod by crossing borders. The current laws are laws of men, not God.

Most people claiming ‘legal’ immigration don’t discuss the costs and what should be done for those that cannot afford the ‘legal’ immigration. What should we do to help those in financial need, the poor, hungry, stranger?

Here’s what a few Bishops say.

US bishops back reversal of Alabama immigration law

Washington D.C., Sep 13, 2011 / 03:08 am (CNA).- The U.S. bishops have backed efforts in Alabama to turn back a state law they say would threaten the Catholic Church’s ministry to undocumented immigrants.

Archbishop José H. Gomez of Los Angeles, chair of the migration committee of the U.S. bishops’ conference, offered his “solidarity and support” to Archbishop Thomas J. Rodi of Mobile, Bishop Robert J. Baker of Birmingham, and other religious leaders in the state who are trying to reverse the law.

Archbishop Rodi and several Protestant denominations are seeking relief from a law they say criminalizes parts of the Church’s mission and interferes with the free exercise of religion.

“The Catholic Church provides pastoral and social services to all persons, regardless of their immigration status,” Archbishop Gomez said Sept. 8. “Our mandate is to provide for the pastoral and social care of all of God’s children. Government should not infringe upon that duty, as America’s founding fathers made clear in the U.S. Constitution.”

Words from His Holiness, Pope Benedict XVI, Regarding Immigration
During His Apostolic Journey to the United States
April 15-20 2008

**

Besides this, short-term measures: It is very important to help the families above
all. In the light of the conversations that I have had with the bishops, the principal
problem is that there be protection for the families, that they not be destroyed. What can
be done should be done. In the same way, naturally, all that is possible must be done to
work against the instability of the situations and against all the violations, and to help so
that they can have a truly dignified life where they find themselves in this moment.
I would like to also say that there are many problems, many sufferings, but there
is also a lot of hospitality! I know that above all the American episcopal conference
collaborates a lot with the Latin American episcopal conferences in the face of needed
help. With all the sorrowful things, let’s not forget also so much true humanity, so many
positive actions that also exist.”

**

The entire article is edifying.

 

[St_Francis]

…The entire article is edifying.

Which implies that you think that we need to be edified, thank you very much, Prodigal Son.

It is a task of government to protect those within its borders. Right now, we have a lot of problems due to illegal immigration which are *not *caused by those who lead otherwise law-abiding lives. They themselves are preyed upon by criminals, who also prey upon us. They are screened by the illegal immigrants. And there are those who come in who are sick with antibiotic-resitant diseases: contagious, untreatable, and often deadly.

Just because someone wants to do something about illegal immigration does not mean that what they want to do is wrong. Laws forbidding charitable aid to people are wrong; the bishops rightly fought those laws. But otoh should we allow violent criminals free run across our borders? No. Should we allow people who are ill with contagious and untreatable diseases to wander loose in our country? Also no.

There is a balance in this issue, and we must fight to maintain it.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

Which implies that you think that we need to be edified, thank you very much, Prodigal Son.

Please, I did not say that, nor mean it that way. I found it edifying for myself as well. I apologize if I did not word it more sensitively.

It is a task of government to protect those within its borders. Right now, we have a lot of problems due to illegal immigration which are *not *caused by those who lead otherwise law-abiding lives. They themselves are preyed upon by criminals, who also prey upon us. They are screened by the illegal immigrants. And there are those who come in who are sick with antibiotic-resitant diseases: contagious, untreatable, and often deadly.

Just because someone wants to do something about illegal immigration does not mean that what they want to do is wrong. Laws forbidding charitable aid to people are wrong; the bishops rightly fought those laws. But otoh should we allow violent criminals free run across our borders? No. Should we allow people who are ill with contagious and untreatable diseases to wander loose in our country? Also no.

There is a balance in this issue, and we must fight to maintain it.

I agree there is a balance in the issue, but that balance should not be based solely on money, so that we turn away only the poor.

If you read the words of the Pope you can see he does not forget the instability of the situations and against all the violations; however, he addressed the ability of immigrants having a dignified life where they find themselves at this moment. There seems to be some who want to deport everyone already here.

In the same way, naturally, all that is possible must be done to work against the instability of the situations and against all the violations, and to help so that they can have a truly dignified life where they find themselves in this moment.

I’d have to see some sources on sick, antibiotic resistant, contagious, and untreatable diseases to consider that issue. Many have crossed the borders, for years, and I haven’t seen that argument, or issue, in the media, and I don’t see the ‘MSM’ keeping quiet on such a situation.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

And there are those who come in who are sick with antibiotic-resitant diseases: contagious, untreatable, and often deadly.

I wanted to add: I work as an EMT on an ambulance and just finished the year long paramedic’s course. We covered bio terrorism, nuclear, and other mass casualty incidents and possible scenarios. We never touched on what you’re describing.

 

[St_Francis]

…I’d have to see some sources on sick, antibiotic resistant, contagious, and untreatable diseases to consider that issue. Many have crossed the borders, for years, and I haven’t seen that argument, or issue, in the media, and I don’t see the ‘MSM’ keeping quiet on such a situation.

I wanted to add: I work as an EMT on an ambulance and just finished the year long paramedic’s course. We covered bio terrorism, nuclear, and other mass casualty incidents and possible scenarios. We never touched on what you’re describing.

I am surprised you didn’t hear about it as it was a big issue several years ago. I personally knew someone who died after a few years of a very difficult illness as the result of an infection acquired working in the ER.

Link This link describes the problem in Mexico and other parts of the world.

Link This link explains some of the actions taken to reduce the spread of the problem.

This is one type of problem that good immigration laws would address.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

I am surprised you didn’t hear about it as it was a big issue several years ago. I personally knew someone who died after a few years of a very difficult illness as the result of an infection acquired working in the ER.

Link This link describes the problem in Mexico and other parts of the world.

Link This link explains some of the actions taken to reduce the spread of the problem.

This is one type of problem that good immigration laws would address.

Thanks for the links, admittedly I had taken for granted some of the immunizations and tests we receive on an annual basis, or as needed. We do have a PPD test annually (for TB). It takes 48 to 72 hours to read the results. I wouldn’t see this being a problem to test anyone gaining entrance into the country. With that said, I think something should be worked out so that the poor have an opportunity to enter this country, especially from a contiguous border. Instead of spending money that would make people illegal immigrants, I don’t see why we couldn’t spend money to make them legal immigrants, especially in cases where they have family in this country. Like I’ve tried to convey, we need a fair solution not measured by a person’s ability to pay.

 

[St_Francis]

Please, I did not say that, nor mean it that way. I found it edifying for myself as well. I apologize if I did not word it more sensitively.

I’m sorry, I have discussed this with many people who have “an attitude” about it… I’m probably over-sensitive!

I agree there is a balance in the issue, but that balance should not be based solely on money, so that we turn away only the poor.

And I personally would not advocate that. I would like to see an approach which takes into account the needs of our nation as well as the needs of other nations. Many companies here hire temporary immigrants to do certain types of seasonal work. Poor people in the US who are on some sort of government aid are unable to take that work because it would mess up their aid (which I see as part of a totally different problem), and yet these companies need the workers for just a few months each year. It would be great if we had a more comprehensive system for addressing this; now many people are able to travel to the US to do this work, but some of the workers end up stuck–they have paid for their transportation but the job falls through because of over-hiring; others are not covered by worker’s comp, and some are needed but still have to enter illegally to get the work and they have no protection at all.

Since the 1960’s, when immigration laws were changed, lots of poor people have immigrated to the US. Poor people are motivated by the opportunities in the US and add a lot of energy to our economic system.

However, one problem that occurs is that poor Americans are often crowded out of the job market by poor immigrants.

So, like so much in life, it’s a balancing act.

If you read the words of the Pope you can see he does not forget the instability of the situations and against all the violations; however, he addressed the ability of immigrants having a dignified life where they find themselves at this moment. There seems to be some who want to deport everyone already here.

There are those who want to deport everyone here. I was a person who believed that a carrot-and-stick approach to encouraging *illegal *immigrants to return was a good idea --I had good arguments for this but when my arguments were addressed in a logical and Catholic way, I saw that this was bad idea. As to those who want to eliminate immigration to the US altogether, well, I disagree with them on many aspects of the issue! (I’m thinking about Pat Buchanan here… )

So I do believe that forging a path for those who are already here is important, and I also believe that we should tailor our laws to allow immigration in a more orderly way which balances the needs of our nation with the needs of others, but I still believe that it is very important that we guard our borders and deal with *illegal *immigration, because of the many problems associated with *illegal *immigration, like violent criminality and other problems.

I’d have to see some sources on sick, antibiotic resistant, contagious, and untreatable diseases to consider that issue. Many have crossed the borders, for years, and I haven’t seen that argument, or issue, in the media, and I don’t see the ‘MSM’ keeping quiet on such a situation.

Sorry, the MSM is not a reliable source of true news. They have an agenda and they protect it.

BTW, congratulations on completing your paramedic training. EMT is a difficult and sometimes dangerous line of work, and I admire and pray for those who go into it

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

IBTW, congratulations on completing your paramedic training. EMT is a difficult and sometimes dangerous line of work, and I admire and pray for those who go into it

Thanks. I had an ‘epiphany’ in my early 50s and changed careers. I am in my latter 50s now and it was no easy task getting through the course. I was older than all in the class, including the instructors.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

However, one problem that occurs is that poor Americans are often crowded out of the job market by poor immigrants.

When Alabama passed it’s immigration laws, crops were not all harvested.

I live in a ‘seafood’ town and a company that employed a majority of the local immigrants was ‘raided’, which was actually a request for documentation, but caused the majority of employees to leave that employment. There have been ads for employment ever since that happened, about a year ago. The company cannot get enough to fulfill the orders it once had.

Even stopping willing migrant workers can have an adverse impact on the economy. There’s a balancing act, I agree. To balance, we have to find middle ground that works in the interest of all involved, and recognizing the hard work that some of the immigrants are willing to do, that Americans don’t.

 

[St_Francis]

Thanks. I had an ‘epiphany’ in my early 50s and changed careers. I am in my latter 50s now and it was no easy task getting through the course. I was older than all in the class, including the instructors.

Oh, wow, that must have been quite an experience! But it’s good for all to see that even older people are maturing and growing, and that they can make it through the transition.

 

[St_Francis]

When Alabama passed it’s immigration laws, crops were not all harvested.

I live in a ‘seafood’ town and a company that employed a majority of the local immigrants was ‘raided’, which was actually a request for documentation, but caused the majority of employees to leave that employment. There have been ads for employment ever since that happened, about a year ago. The company cannot get enough to fulfill the orders it once had.

Even stopping willing migrant workers can have an adverse impact on the economy. There’s a balancing act, I agree. To balance, we have to find middle ground that works in the interest of all involved, and recognizing the hard work that some of the immigrants are willing to do, that Americans don’t.

I worked in a fishing town in the 1970s. The people who came to work there were high schoolers, people who wanted a bit of extra income, and poor people from as far as 30 miles away. All Americans. I have returned there from time to time, and now most of the people who work there are immigrants. The poor Americans who once would have worked there are now on government assistance which, as I said, would be messed up by their working.

It is not that Americans won’t take some of these jobs–it is that those who are very poor have the government-assistance problem, and those others who are not on government assistance will not work for the low wages involved–immigrants are willing to have a lower standard of living which sometimes leaks over into the illegal (in matters of how many people are living in one place, for example, or not having auto insurance [another problem: new drivers’ insurance costs have risen *drastically, so they need a regular job to cover that]). Americans also tend to be more knowledgeable and assertive about their rights as employees.

And I am not sure whether temporary foreign workers require payment into Social Security and Unemployment–these are shared by the worker and the employer and could pose a considerable savings for the employer.

So there are a lot of other issues involved. Is it right for an employer to pay what is considered in that society less than a living wage simply because some people are willing to live at less than that level? Etc.

ETA: Another problem I noticed when I visited that area again: at the local fast food place, all the people who worked there were speaking their non-English native language. The place would only hire people who also spoke that language, which meant that Americans stopped applying there…

 

[foolishmortal]

Teachers also have to slow down the education of native kids to catch up illegals’ kids. What we should do have done is build up a Mexican middle class in Mexico, but now they have gangs all over the place. Is it possible Mexico’s leaders, maybe with globalists’ influence, have been trying to male a reconquista of land they lost? Why do Africans speak English to eachj other at our nursing home, but Latinos speak only Spanish to each other? Both nations of theirs have had English speaking business (this doc. with Kenyan Bushmen experiencing New York spoke English well–Bushmen!), but Africans speak like natives; whereas so many Latin Americans from South of the border don’t.

Why do they feel themselves to be so special?  We know why America is special, but should never think we should have special treatment, which is what's killing this nation.  Do they claim the SW for Mexico and it's a mere matter of time with our politicians falling to the shame game of Mexican leaders, when Mexico treats their southermn neighbors with disdain (what is their standard)?  Now, if they were staunch conservative Catholics, I would say come on in, as we need more, but it's a hotbed of gang crime and many who gave up Our Lady for fiortune cookie theologies).

Our immigration laws for those seeking citizenship should be easier, but it doesn’t change the fact Mexicans aren’t suffering from government persecution, which is why the Holy Family ran into Egypt, though Scripture has nothing to say they didn’t have to make their presence known, and Mexico City isn’t bad off, so it’s unfair to the legals.

There are people sneaking in from Canada, and they are probably terrorists, like those coming in from the South, against whose fancy guns our border guards, I hear, can only use rubber bullets.

 

[Sarcelle]

Immigrants is not equal to illegal immigrants. There are legal immigrants. Take the point of view of a legal immigrant. He/she takes the time to enter the country legally which takes a lot of time and funds. They see the amnesty being offered to illegal immigrants and see that breaking the law is rewarded.

This is one thing I don’t understand. Why is one rewarded for breaking the law? Even more confounding why do people insist that these lawbreakers get rewarded?

A lot of people say that without these illegals, ultra-low paying jobs will not be filled. Why don’t these same people speak against these same illegals being exploited? The downside maybe that people would have to pay higher prices for produce.