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I was recently reading an article and it sort of made me ‘flinch’. Now the strange part is I read it and I see a problem, but my wife who has been Catholic her entire life reads it and sees it as a non issue.

In the article in question, the following is said:
“We pray that Our Lady of Guadalupe, the Patroness of America, will guide our countries always down the path of democracy, truth, justice and peace,” Cardinal Damasceno, head of the Brazilian bishops’ conference, told CNA on Dec. 12.
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My wife and most of my Catholic friends see that statement as an intercessory prayer request. My mind sees it as asking the Virgin Mary to do something of her own power, ‘guide’. Now if I take church teaching into effect, and allow the position that I know the church is supposed to have on the Virgin Mary I would interpret the statement to mean that we are asking for prayer that would eventually make the guidance come from Christ.

So I guess my question is, are we supposed to interpret all statements from the clergy in light of Tradition? Or is this sort of statement verging on a problem?
 
No, it is not a “statement verging on a problem.”

I frankly don’t “see” anything.
 
I think it’s my protestant background that makes me see something that is likely not even there.
 
I’m still in the process of converting. The Marian dogma has been very difficult for me as I grew up in a church that really put the Catholic church in a bad light. I see the reasons Mary is so important to our faith, and why we venerate her but I still have trouble getting it from just knowing to ‘knowing.’
 
I think it would be appropriate to trust in both intercession and guidance.

I am very devoted to St. Teresa of Avila, due to being a Carmelite. In her Autobiography, she tells of guidance she received from St. Peter of Alcantara who predeceased her, but was a friend of hers during his lifetime. Afterwards, he appeared to her and gave her a lot of practical help in establishing her convents.

Mary is no different. When she interceded with her Son on behalf of the guests at Cana’s wedding, her “guidance” back to the servants was “Do whatever He tells you.”

Many persons and saints have written about guidance they received from the Mother of Christ after imploring her intercession. It is not that she performs a miracle, but that she does give guidance by way of inspiration, sometimes even supernaturally.
 
I understand your concerns. I reverted to Catholicism a month ago. I love and see the biblical basis for the communion of the saints, including intercessory prayer, but I’m always careful in my prayers to say “intercede for me” or “pray for me,” though I’ve noticed most Catholics aren’t so careful.

I suspect we’re just being Protestants. All the intercession of the saints comes from Christ who merited their perfection and delegated their intercessory authority, right?
 
When she interceded with her Son on behalf of the guests at Cana’s wedding, her “guidance” back to the servants was “Do whatever He tells you.”
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You have no idea how much that very thought helped me. As the person above stated, I still in my prayers to Saints am very careful to add “intercede” or “pray for me”. It’s still new territory to me to be cautious when praying to anyone but God to always affirm that any response/blessing is from God’s grace… but as the above indicates, God’s grace is still applied even though Mary gave instruction(guidance) to the servants.
 
I think if it meant guide in the sense of advise, that could come from the Virgin Mary. Of course anything that Mary does “of her own power” is done by the power of God, because Mary is a human like us, and all that she is comes from God.

OTOH, the Blessed Virgin isn’t exactly like us, or certainly not exactly like me. 🙂 She lived with Christ on earth for 30 years, and is now in Heaven with Him, so she is a lot wiser and more knowledgeable (not to mention more holy!) than any of our current world leaders.

Guiding countries is done by humans all the time. Just because the Virgin Mary is not divine, it doesn’t mean that she has no power at all–she has at least as much power as an ordinary human. She is just not sinful like us, so she could make a better job of it. 🙂

–Jen
 
I’m so glad you found help in that. You will some day discover that our saints, guardian angels and Mary are wonderful helpers and intercessors on our behalf, and find great joy in coming to know their help personally. We call it the “communion of saints.” I look forward in spirit with you to the wonderful treasure you’ll find in this doctrine of intercessory prayer and guidance. 🙂
 
bmullins said:
My wife and most of my Catholic friends see that statement as an intercessory prayer request. My mind sees it as asking the Virgin Mary to do something of her own power, ‘guide’.
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Mary talks to people and appears to them and guides them and has for centuries. This ability comes from God. She always has, afaik., as far back as 40A.D. when she would still be on Earth, according to the tradition of the Lady of the Pillar.

I count on the help of my Saints all the time, to guide me to lost things, inspire me to follow Christ more closely, warn me of dangers, all sort of things. They are real people, after all. Mary, Our Lady of Guadaloupe, is the Patroness of the Americas. She was sent as guide and I hope she keeps on guiding.
 
bmullins said:
I was recently reading an article and it sort of made me ‘flinch’. Now the strange part is I read it and I see a problem, but my wife who has been Catholic her entire life reads it and sees it as a non issue.

In the article in question, the following is said:

My wife and most of my Catholic friends see that statement as an intercessory prayer request. My mind sees it as asking the Virgin Mary to do something of her own power, ‘guide’. Now if I take church teaching into effect, and allow the position that I know the church is supposed to have on the Virgin Mary I would interpret the statement to mean that we are asking for prayer that would eventually make the guidance come from Christ.

So I guess my question is, are we supposed to interpret all statements from the clergy in light of Tradition? Or is this sort of statement verging on a problem?
Click to expand...
When you see statements like this, these are meant as intercessory prayers. Catholics, without further explanation, would know or realize this already. I understand that as a protestant, you would be aghast with such statement. We know that she is close to Christ, and Christ is behind her, and whatever is granted through her intercession, it is a per God’s will, not hers.

I would recommend this book…Hail Holy Queen by Scott Hahn, that explains the Marian dogmas plainly.

I was told this once, by an Eastern Catholic. You should take note that the in the Eastern Churches is where Mary lived, and have a lot more knowledge about Mary that is not known. And this is one such thing…at the foot of the cross, as Jesus hang dying, and blood dripping down and covered the BVM, she asked that she die with Him that day. Jesus refused, and this is the only time that He is known to have refused her mother.
 
bmullins said:
You have no idea how much that very thought helped me. As the person above stated, I still in my prayers to Saints am very careful to add “intercede” or “pray for me”. It’s still new territory to me to be cautious when praying to anyone but God to always affirm that any response/blessing is from God’s grace… but as the above indicates, God’s grace is still applied even though Mary gave instruction(guidance) to the servants.
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My suggestion, also what I do, after your prayers of intercession, add, “according to thy will.”

It conveys your humility and you are surrendering to the will of God, in answering your prayer, whether you like the answer or not. For it is ultimately, God who answers the prayers we send through the saints.
 
I understand your difficulty when prayers seem to be asking the Blessed Virgin or another Saint to do something for us by their own power. I try to keep in mind an (imperfect) analogy that helps me through the difficulty.

If you are walking at night, you might say that you “see by the light of the moon.” Does this mean you deny that the sun is the ultimate source of the light? You know (intellectually) that the moon generates no light of its own, but merely reflects that of the sun. So then, everytime you say the word “moonlight,” are you denying the sun its due? I suspect that given the choice between saying “moonlight” and hoping people understand what you mean vs. saying “the light of the sun which has been reflected off of the moon,” you would choose the former, if only for brevity.
 
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