Anglican head Williams says anti-gays misread Bible

[Publisher]

Gen 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

"This is Adam speaking…not God…no indication it was a “once and for all declaration”…absence of a reference to same sex relationships does not equal prohibition of them…this is an “interpretation”…it is not Truth…but a statement of what you believe truth to be.

This is an obvious reference to God’s intended purpose for the sexual act. One man, one woman, within the bounds of marriage, and homosexuality isn’t even hinted at as being a part of God’s design.

"As Adam understood it…the Adam that would fall…the Adam that God brought the animals before to choose a help meet…he found none in the animals…seems like God thought of woman as a second thought…He wanted Adam to choose from what he had already created…we get into all kinds of deep water when we try to make ancient myth fit with our modern times."
As for your reference to dietary restrictions:

15:10 Then he called the crowd to him and said, “Listen and understand.
15:11 What defiles a person is not what goes into the mouth; it is what comes out of the mouth that defiles a person.”

"Ahhhh, so what did Jesus say about same sex relationships?"

10:9 About noon the next day, while they were on their way and approaching the city, Peter went up on the roof to pray.
10:10 He became hungry and wanted to eat, but while they were preparing the meal, a trance came over him.
10:11 He saw heaven opened and an object something like a large sheet descending, being let down to earth by its four corners.
10:12 In it were all kinds of four-footed animals and reptiles of the earth and wild birds.
10:13 Then a voice said to him, “Get up, Peter; slaughter and eat!”
10:14 But Peter said, “Certainly not, Lord, for I have never eaten anything defiled and ritually unclean!”
10:15 The voice spoke to him again, a second time, “What God has made clean, you must not consider ritually unclean!”
10:16 This happened three times, and immediately the object was taken up into heaven.

"What did Peter or Luke write about same sex relationships?"

 

[KarenNC]

If the homosexual lobby wins on the issue the next step is going to be constant pressure by homosexual groups on the government to attack the tax status of any church that won’t preform homosexual marriage.

Why? That hasn’t happened with interracial marriage, it hasn’t happened with divorcees, and those are both larger groups who have been facing the issue for decades. It hasn’t happened in the case of those churches who refuse to marry heterosexuals for any vast number of reasons including different religions, cohabitation, premarital sex, pregnancy, etc. Such a statement is fearmongering, not based in reasonable reality.

 

[catsrus]

originally posted by Gnosis
I think the essential problem here is that, as we examine the bible, we can see that it doesn’t really understand homosexuality. It sees homosexual acts, more or less, as the deviancy of “heterosexual” persons who are engaging in same-sex relations solely for excessive pleasure.

There’s no idea of homosexuality as a sexuality in the bible. It more or less paints a picture of married men, or men who will get married, having sexual relations with men on the side. This is obvious in in the story of Sodom and Gomhorra where Lot offers his daughters in the stead of the two guests. Why would he do that if they are homosexuals? This is a city where people just have rampant, lust driven sex with anyone. These are married men who want to take advantage of people.

And there’s the answer to the whole “homosexual/bisexual” arguement that some want to have.
Also puts the kibosh on “born that way” arguement.
Of course the Bible does not “understand” homosexuality. Because man was not created to BE homosexual. The act IS depicted as being committed by deviant heterosexuals because man is heterosexual.

 

[Publisher]

Or the Bible as an ancient book who’s writers were totally ignorant of the way things are just got it wrong…just like they did about a flat earth that wasn’t the center of the solar system , 6 literal days of creation or of a sun that cannot stand still in the sky or a moon that does not give off it’s own light or any number of scientific things we know in the 21st century but the Bible got completely wrong…because it’s not a science book or a psychology book or a sociology book…but a book of religious beliefs.

 

[Gnosis]

I honsetly think some people just have a problem thinking for themsevlves, God forbid- wait, God does forbid it! At least that’s what I seem to be hearing.

Suggest that the Bible does not have an answer for the issue of homosexuality and people’s entire world goes into chaos because they don’t have an encyclopedia with tiny snippits that tells them exactly how to live their lives and how the world works.

The Bible is a guide, its not an encyclopedia, its filled with experiences, not facts. Althought a fact can be contained in an experience. We need to excercise levels of discernment here.

 

[LapsedAtheist]

Leviticus is basically two books. One part is concerned with Priestly duties and rites, the other with morality and holiness. The admonitions you cite such as the ban on eating of shellfish was part of the Mosaic dietary law and part of the priestly code. This particular law (in addition to laws concerning ritual cleanliness, sacrifices, blood, etc) was set aside by God when Jesus Christ instituted a new covenant through His shed blood. The Mosaic laws which were upheld by the priests were no longer practiced once Christ, the first and true Priest, fulfilled them with His sacrifice. The moral code, however, was upheld and continues to this day through the Christian Church.

So then the requirement for all men to keep their forelocks untrimmed (as an outward sign of inward faith) was meant for the priests alone? As was the requirement to leave the edges of your field unreaped (for the sake of charity: to allow the destitute a source of food)?

(2. Tim. 4:3 - 4) For there will be a time when people will not tolerate sound teaching. Instead, following their own desires, they will accumulate teachers for themselves, because they have an insatiable curiosity to hear new things. And they will turn away from hearing the truth, but on the other hand they will turn aside to myths.

1 Tim 4: 1-5:

*The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. **They forbid people to marry **and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth. For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer. *

Using Scripture to justify sin is an abomination.

Is hate a sin?

 

[Harpazo]

Could this mean that the Anglicans are conceding to the Episcopalians? I thought the Anglicans were about to break off the Episcopalians. How things change…

In Pax Christi
Andrew

 

[Digger71]

In addition, if we accept that the Bible is the inspired Word of God, could we be so arrogant to assume He would not have forseen our current culture’s attempts to legitimize this immoral behavior?

If we accept this, then ever coma matters, as does the original wording.

Leviticus: “thou shalt not lie with mankind as with woman kind”, it’s not a blanket prohibition. That would be “Thou shalt not lie with men” (yes, the bible is sexist).

Instead it tells one to differentiate. One could uphold the law simply by using a different position when sleeping with different genders, or never ejaculating with one, but always with the other.

The very fact that such verses are open to the interpretation above would suggest that the answer to your qustion is “yes”, he did forsee it, and made clear that it’s OK as long as you make itt different.

 

[Digger71]

Or the Bible as an ancient book who’s writers were totally ignorant of the way things are just got it wrong…just like they did about a flat earth that wasn’t the center of the solar system , 6 literal days of creation or of a sun that cannot stand still in the sky or a moon that does not give off it’s own light or any number of scientific things we know in the 21st century but the Bible got completely wrong…because it’s not a science book or a psychology book or a sociology book…but a book of religious beliefs.

But even one wrong material fact forces a stunning change on the scope and authrity of the work. And though many people would hope to otherwise, all derived lgic.

 

[Chris_LaRock]

"What did Peter or Luke write about same sex relationships?"

God’s word is clear that same sex relations goes against God’s intended pourpose for sex, and that settles it for me. It;s obvious to me that you have your own motives for calling the scriptures into question. Satan also tried to cast doubt on what God said:

“…Yea, hath God said…?”

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.

 

[blessedtoo]

Why? That hasn’t happened with interracial marriage, it hasn’t happened with divorcees, and those are both larger groups who have been facing the issue for decades. It hasn’t happened in the case of those churches who refuse to marry heterosexuals for any vast number of reasons including different religions, cohabitation, premarital sex, pregnancy, etc. Such a statement is fearmongering, not based in reasonable reality.

Interracial marriages, divorced folks and the others you mentioned are not seeking special anti-discrimination status like the homosexual lobby is. If same-sex marriage were permitted, this group would be protected and the Church would have a struggle on her hands. Just look at what has happened to the Catholic Charities adoption agencies who had to close their doors to keep from being sued.

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.

 

[blessedtoo]

Please cite the verse in Leviticus which distinguishes the two…I don’t think I’ve ever read…“Next verse is part of the moral law”…and then a few verses later read “we’re back to the priestly ceremonial law now…but the next verse we’re going back to moral law.”

The book of Leviticus deals chiefly with the priesthood and the sanctuary services. It does not contain all the instruction God gave Israel on these subjects (see Num 3:1 to 9:23; 15:141; 18:1 to 19:22; 28:1 to 30:16), but does constitute the fundamental body of revelation and regulation pertaining to them. God ordained the sanctuary services to be an object lesson of the great plan of salvation and of Christ’s ministry on behalf of sinners.
The first 7 chapters of Leviticus set forth in detail the basic regulations concerning the different types of sacrifices. Chapters 8 and 9 relate to the consecration of the tabernacle and of the priesthood. The brief historical interlude of ch 10 recounts how 2 of Aaron’s sons disregarded God’s instruction regarding making a difference between the sacred and the common, and suffered death as a result. All types of personal uncleanness are discussed at length in chs 11 through 15, with a prescribed ritual for release from uncleanness. Chapter 16 deals with the cleansing of the sanctuary, and ch 17 with certain related regulations. Moral and civil regulations occupy chs 18 through 20, and chs 21 through 27 are devoted to a variety of additional regulations pertaining to the priests, the Sabbath, special festivals, and other laws relating to the sanctuary and worship, together with certain laws protecting person and property.
nisbett.com/summary/sum-o-03.htm

As Christians, we not only have the admonition against homosexual acts in Leviticus, but the NT passages that others have quoted as well. Taken as a body of consistent instruction on this issue, to read it any other way is to twist the Scripture to fit your own personal interpretation.