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Syele
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Today I am visiting an Anglican Church.
Can anyone tell me the difference between Anglican and Episcopal?
Can anyone tell me the difference between Anglican and Episcopal?
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Leopard
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As I understand it, the Anglican Communion encompasses a number of mostly national churches in communion with the Church of England. Those churches in the US within this communion are commonly referred to as the Episcopal Church(es)
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GKC
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Depends on what sense the terms are used. Most generally, episcopal only refers to a church polity; it’s governed by bishops (episcopi) but I will assume that you are not thinking of that.
More likely, you’re looking at a church that has split from the Episcopal Church in America, over doctrinal differences. Historically, Anglican used to refer to the Church of England alone. As other national Anglican jurisdictions developed and became self governing, most retained the term “Anglican” in their names (Anglican Church of Canada, of South Africa, of Australia, etc). But a couple of such Churches did not. The Anglican church in Scotland, associated with the Worldwide Anglican Communion (those Churches which arose from the CoE, are now self-governing, and are in communion with the Archbishop of Canterbury, 38 such ) is the Episcopal Church of Scotland, and in America, the equivalent Church is the Episcopal Church.
In this country, as groups of Episcopalians broke from the Episcopal Church, over doctrinal issues, they often took the word Anglican as part of their names (though not always). Thus, the Anglican Church in America, or the Anglican Catholic Church. And even those which did not, often will refer to themselves as Anglican, to be sure the differentitation from the Episcopal Church is made. My jurisdiction and parish do that.
So, my bet, if you are in America, you’re going to attend a church that is Anglican in hertitage, but not part of the Episcopal Church.
GKC
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Syele
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So there are no Doctrinal differences?
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GKC
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Yes, if what I’m referring to is what you are looking at. It’s doctrinal differences that caused the split from the Episcopal Church.
And not all such splits result in churches calling themselves Anglican. But many, beginning in the early 70s, did.
GKC
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ralphinal
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Wouldn’t it matter if you were high Episcopal vs. Low? And if you were looking at a high Anglican vs. low?
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GKC
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GKC
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Yes. And that is true of Anglicanism, historically, in various ways.
When the split-off from the Episcopal Church began, in late 70s, and new Anglican jurisdictions formed, the first exodus was mainly from the Anglo-Catholic flavored of the Episcopalians, since the doctrinal issues (liturgy, females in collars) were mainly the sort things that would affect principled Anglo-Catholics. This isn’t an absolute; reformed Episcopalians were also out the door then, but it was mostly from over on the Anglo-Catholic side. Hence, the overall flavor of the Continuing Anglican movement is markedly Anglo-Catholic.
Later, as the divisive issues began to coalesce more around sexual politics, even more of the reformed flavored Episcopalians started edging toward the door. These types were more likely to attach themselves to orthodox Anglican prelates in the 3rd world, and remain as part of the Anglican Communion, than to separate completely and self-consciously label themselves “Anglican,” though.
One point that I might also make is that there is a small distinction that can be made between those who are Anglo-Catholic, and those merely High Church. Anglo-Catholic is more oriented to doctrine, high church to ritual. One is sort of the offspring of the Oxford movement, the other more of the slightly later Ritualist movement. But these are not hard and fast distinctions. The overlap between them is large. ACs are ritualists, high church are mostly AC.
Remaining within the Episcopal Church is also this bifurcation, as always; some more reformed, some more AC. But the factor of mere Christian orthodoxy also must be measured, there.
In case I missed it, and this was the question, most churches using “Anglican”, in this country, are likely to be separated from the Episcopal Church, and also likely to be more Anglo-Catholic, than reformed in tone. Mainly.
And if, eventually, the OP can name the visited church, I might can identify it.
GKC
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Syele
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I have just gotten home from visiting the Church. I’m still trying to follow just who they are affiliated with. The Priest mentioned he used to be at an Episcopal Church, and their website links to this article acicanada.ca/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=177:anglican-leaders-begin-forming-new-church-in-north-america&catid=3:newsflash
Its called St. Patrick’s Anglican Church and seems very new (They are still building the building and are at a temporary location.)
Its called St. Patrick’s Anglican Church and seems very new (They are still building the building and are at a temporary location.)
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Hesychios
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I cannot really add to anything GKC has already stated. He is of course spot on.
The various multiple more fundamentally Anglican spin offs from the Episcopal church (TEC) and the Anglican Church of Canada are coalescing into what will be a new Anglican province in North America. The parish you visited is part of that general movement. I don’t know if there is one website to represent them all yet, the various groups are all heading toward each other pretty aggressively now and eventually their individual distinctions will be less significant. This may be the website for the movement as a whole, I am not sure.
One of the most interesting and laudable aspects of this movement is that it seems to have drawn in the Reformed Episcopal church, a body that has been separated from the Anglican Communion (and Canterbury) for a very long time, well over one hundred years.
A good place to observe this ongoing process is Dr David Virtue’s website Virtueonline. Interestingly, Dr Virtue at this time seems to still be a member of an Episcopal parish.
Michael
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GKC
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Ok. That makes thing a little clearer. The groups on the page you gave the link for are the major groups beginning to coalesce around the 4 bishops who recently left the Episcopal Church, with their dioceses, corporately. This means that they are mainly the ones who are most recently leaving but not separating from the Anglican Communion, as the Continuing groups did, years before.
What is going to come from this is not clear, though some of the Continuing groups (those who I mentioned as starting to leave the Episcopal Church around 40 years ago), are also becoming involved, in some fashion. I don’t expect a complete union of all in AMIA, Common Cause, GAFCON; there are doctrinal differences even amongst these orthodox Anglicans (using “Anglican” generically), as well as the usual range of Anglo-Catholic to evangelical. My own Continuing Anglican jurisdiction is, in some sense, a part of the movement. It’s all murky. But it seems to suggest a sort of getting together of the traditionalist Anglicans, of all stripes. Or something.
Can you supply the church page URL?
GKC
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GKC
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I endorse this post, with the exception of the dubious things said about that GKC character, who is not to be trusted.I cannot really add to anything GKC has already stated. He is of course spot on.
The various multiple more fundamentally Anglican spin offs from the Episcopal church (TEC) and the Anglican Church of Canada are coalescing into what will be a new Anglican province in North America. The parish you visited is part of that general movement. I don’t know if there is one website to represent them all yet, the various groups are all heading toward each other pretty aggressively now and eventually their individual distinctions will be less significant. This may be the website for the movement as a whole, I am not sure.
One of the most interesting and laudable aspects of this movement is that it seems to have drawn in the Reformed Episcopal church, a body that has been separated from the Anglican Communion (and Canterbury) for a very long time, well over one hundred years.
A good place to observe this ongoing process is Dr David Virtue’s website Virtueonline. Interestingly, Dr Virtue at this time seems to still be a member of an Episcopal parish.
Michael
The REC is a good example of the more reformed side to Anglicanism (though they have been moderating that recently) that I mentioned, and has a history of around 150 years as a separated jurisdiction. David Virtue, I think, is still a part of official Anglicanism,and lives on the reformed side, too. I read his site regularly.
How this all will mesh, I know not. In fact, it worries me, a little.
GKC
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emeraldcoast
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Syele
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Thanks for the loads of info! looks like I have some studying to do. Especially thanks for the links so I have some good starting places.
saintpatricksamia.org is their church website.
emeraldcoast, I found nothing bad from my visit, though visiting once gives only a very limited view of things. Choosing what Church to attend is not an easy process.
saintpatricksamia.org is their church website.
emeraldcoast, I found nothing bad from my visit, though visiting once gives only a very limited view of things. Choosing what Church to attend is not an easy process.
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emeraldcoast
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I just read on the website that St. Patrick’s uses the Book of Common Prayer from 1928. My Episcopal Church that I attend uses the BCP 1978.Thanks for the loads of info! looks like I have some studying to do. Especially thanks for the links so I have some good starting places.
saintpatricksamia.org is their church website.
emeraldcoast, I found nothing bad from my visit, though visiting once gives only a very limited view of things. Choosing what Church to attend is not an easy process.
God Bless!
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GKC
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Syele
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emeraldcoast
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