C
ComplineSanFran
Guest
‘Mortal sin’ is not a term that Anglicans use. For the most part, members of Anglican churches don’t have a check list of what is sinful in the same way that RCs do.
Anglicans could receive Roman Catholic communion, Archbishop suggests
- Status
P
Padres1969
Guest
Yes absolutely. No definitely not. Well maybe…
G
GKC
Guest
Since Canon 844 includes the sacrament of Reconciliation as available, under para 4, I would assume that would be a part of receiving the sacrament of the Eucharist.
G
GKC
Guest
And, also, ontological impossibility. Among others.Yes absolutely. No definitely not. Well maybe…
G
GEddie
Guest
The problem is not that female ordination is a “mortal sin,” but rather, that it is invalid.
ICXC NIKA
ICXC NIKA
G
GKC
Guest
Yep.
G
GEddie
Guest
Not if she was taught, and fully believed, that her church could validly ordain her, that she was becoming not a Catholic but an Anglican priest and that they had valid orders.
ICXC NIKA
T
Tomdstone
Guest
Oh, OK. I thought it would be a sin for someone to falsely pretend to be a priest.
P
Picky_Picky
Guest
And I think the point is that an Anglican priest, male or female, should not be thought to be “falsely pretending to be a priest”. They may not be.a valid priest, in Roman eyes, and their belief that they are a priest may be incorrect, but there is no “false pretence” about it, assuming their belief in their orders is genuine.
T
Tomdstone
Guest
Well, suppose an abortionist was taught and fully believes that the fetus is part of the woman’s body and that he is doing nothing wrong in performing the medical procedure. He follows what Hillary says and she says that women have every right to choose what should be done to her body. Should he be allowed to receive Holy Communion because he is only doing what he has been taught in medical school? It really would not be a sin for him because he thinks he is doing something which he was taught was right and he fully believes it? Or take the example of a SS couple who were taught and who fully believe that their marriage is sacred and good. And some Anglicans accept SS marriage. There was even an Episcopal bishop who married his male partner. So it really would not be a sin for them because they were taught and they fully believe that SS marriage is something approved by God. So they should be allowed to receive Catholic Holy Communion? Is that how it works? It all right because they fully believe and they were taught that it is OK?
P
Picky_Picky
Guest
Well, of course, that’s not how it works, as you know. The circumstances under which communion can be afforded to non-Catholics are very narrow, and as ever, no doubt, pastoral discernment is involved where necessary.
W
wllmjoseph
Guest
If Anglicans do not distinguish between mortal sin and venial sin I don’t believe it will be possible for Anglicans to receive communion at a Catholic Mass or service. I would hope that the Catholic church would not forsake it’s doctrines for ecumenicalism.
Something else that needs to be taken into consideration is that birth control is not a sin in the Anglican churches. Does that mean that an Anglican who is currently using birth control attending a Catholic Mass will be able to take the Eucharist while a Catholic using birth control and attending that same Mass will not?
P
Padres1969
Guest
Agreed. While it’s a nice idea in principle, in practice I don’t see how most Anglicans would be ready to receive by Catholic standards. If you lowered the standard for us you’d have to lower it for yourselves too or it would make no sense.
T
Tomdstone
Guest
"Based on the present Ecumenical Directory and looking toward
the general good, especially for those in Lutheran-Catholic
marriages, Catholic communities might increase the opportunities
for Catholics and Lutherans to receive Communion together.
Already local Catholic bishops, given the principles stated in §§
129–31 of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity’s
Directory for the Application of the Principles and Norms for
Ecumenism, can develop their considerations of “grave and
pressing need” (§ 130) to receive the Eucharist. This should be
done in light of (a) the full possibilities of the principles stated in
the Directory and (b) the spiritual good of Lutherans well-disposed
to receive the Eucharist, especially for those in Catholic-Lutheran
marriages who attend church regularly, those who make retreats
in Catholic retreat houses and similar venues, those gathered for
ecumenical meetings, and so forth. "
usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/ecumenical-and-interreligious/ecumenical/lutheran/upload/Declaration_on_the_Way-for-Website.pdf
C
Contarini
Guest
The Orthodox also don’t make this distinction, formally.
In practice both Anglicans and Orthodox recognize that some sins are more serious than others.
Clearly it wouldn’t be a question of Anglicans receiving simply because they were Anglicans, but of receiving if they met the same criteria a Catholic would meet.
R
Reuben_J
Guest
From some of the posts here it seems to give the impression that non-Catholics can receive Communion in the Catholic Church if they believe in transubstantiation and in a state of grace.
Well, they can’t.
To receive Communion in the CC, one has to be
in a state of grace and
in Communion with the Bishop of Rome.
That is the scope for Holy Communion.
Caveat is only given for special circumstances.
Well, they can’t.
To receive Communion in the CC, one has to be
in a state of grace and
in Communion with the Bishop of Rome.
That is the scope for Holy Communion.
Caveat is only given for special circumstances.
L
LutheranScholar
Guest
*ROME, January 21, 2016 (LifeSiteNews) – A group of Finnish Lutherans were offered Holy Communion by priests at a mass held in St. Peter’s Basilica following a meeting with Pope Francis on January 15, according to a report by the Finnish periodical Kotimaa 24.
Lutheran bishop Samuel Salmi was visiting the Vatican as the head of a delegation that included a youth choir that was to perform there. Salmi says he met privately with Pope Francis.
After the personal audience with the pope, the delegation was present at a celebration of the Catholic mass. According to Salmi, at the time of communion the non-Catholics placed their right hands on their left shoulders, a traditional way of indicating that they were ineligible to receive the Eucharist. However, the celebrating priests insisted on giving them communion.
Salmi told Kotimaa 24 that “I myself accepted it [Holy Communion].” He added that “this was not a coincidence,” and nor was it a coincidence when last year the pope seemed to accept the notion of a Lutheran woman receiving communion with her Catholic husband. The original article, written in Finnish, was translated for LifeSiteNews by Voice of the Family’s Maria Madise.
RELATED: Pope’s advice to Lutheran woman: A clue to how he’ll rule on Communion for the ‘remarried’?
At that time the pope acknowledged that “explanations and interpretations” of communion may differ between Catholics and Lutherans, but “life is bigger than explanations and interpretations.” He advised the woman to “Talk to the Lord and then go forward.”
“At the root of this there is, without a doubt, the ecumenical attitude of a new Vatican,” Salmi told Kotimaa 24. “The pope was not here at the mass, but his strategic intention is to carry out a mission of love and unity. There are also theological adversaries in the Vatican, for which reason it is difficult to assess how much he can say, but he can permit practical gestures.”
The visit took place just three days before an annual ecumenical delegation to Rome on the part of Catholic, Orthodox, and Lutheran Finns to celebrate the feast day of St. Henry of Uppsala, who is credited with the evangelization of Finland in the 12th century.
In his remarks to the Finnish delegation on the January 18, Francis seems to hint at the movement towards intercommunion when he tells the ecumenical delegation, “Your dialogue is making promising progress towards a shared understanding, on the sacramental level, of Church, Eucharist and Ministry. These steps forward, made together, lay a solid basis for a growing communion of life in faith and spirituality, as your relations develop in a spirit of serene discussion and fraternal sharing.”
Canon 844 of the Catholic Church’s Code of Canon Law normally only permits the Eucharist to be given to Catholics in the state of grace (that is, not in a state of grave sin), except in cases of members of Churches which have been approved by the Holy See. In danger of death or other cases of “grave necessity” the Eucharist may be given to other non-Catholic Christians who share the same faith as Catholics regarding Holy Communion. In recent dialogue between Lutherans and Catholics some agreement has been reached regarding Eucharistic doctrine, but differences remain.
In addition to its implications for Catholic-Lutheran relations, the event may also represent the pope’s liberal inclinations regarding the giving of communion to other groups, such as those who are divorced and civilly remarried without having received an annulment of their previous marriage.
Francis has repeatedly insinuated that he wants to change the practice of refusing communion to the divorced and remarried, speaking warmly of Catholic theologians – such as Cardinal Walter Kasper – who advocate such an approach. However, he has yet to announce any decision on the matter.
The pope’s Prefect of Divine Worship, Cardinal Robert Sarah, has expressed profound concerns about the pontiff’s tendency to open communion to those whose beliefs or behavior are inconsistent with the Catholic faith.
“It’s not that I have to talk to the Lord in order to know if I should go to Communion,” he told Aleteia reporter Diane Montagna in late November. “No, I have to know if I’m in accord with the rule of the Church.”
“It’s not a personal desire or a personal dialogue with Jesus that determines if I can receive Communion in the Catholic Church,” he added. “How can I know that the Lord has really said: ‘Come and receive My Body.’ No. A person cannot decide if he is able to receive Communion. He has to have the rule of the Church: i.e., being a Catholic, being in a state of grace, properly married [if married].”
Correction: An earlier version of this article incorrectly stated that Bishop Salmi and his delegation visited with the ecumenical delegation from Finland on January 18. Salmi’s visit occurred three days earlier, on January 15.
Note: This article previously stated that Lutherans do not share the Catholic faith in the “real presence” of Christ in the Eucharist. However, Lutheranism does profess a belief in the “real presence” in relation to Holy Communion. Whether or not this term is used in the same way as Catholics use it is a matter of ongoing dialogue between Catholics and Lutherans and is beyond the scope of the article, and so the term has been eliminated. We apologize for any confusion.
- What of this?
R
Reuben_J
Guest
The news report had been discussed in a thread about the same time earlier this year.
Many would agree that the celebrating priest was making a mistake in giving Communion t0 the Lutheran Bishop while others faulted the Bishop for receiving.
The fact remains canon 844 won’t allow it.
Yes, there is a flurry of ecumenical activities at top level between the Lutheran and Catholic Church. The joint celebration to commemorate Luther’s five hundred years anniversary perhaps enhance our relationship even more.
We look forwards for a full communion so that we can receive Communion together. So until then.
L
LutheranScholar
Guest
Amen, sir and may the Holy Spirit work through both our Churches to bring more souls to Christ, our common Shepherd!The news report had been discussed in a thread about the same time earlier this year.
Many would agree that the celebrating priest was making a mistake in giving Communion t0 the Lutheran Bishop while others faulted the Bishop for receiving.
The fact remains canon 844 won’t allow it.
Yes, there is a flurry of ecumenical activities at top level between the Lutheran and Catholic Church. The joint celebration to commemorate Luther’s five hundred years anniversary perhaps enhance our relationship even more.
We look forwards for a full communion so that we can receive Communion together. So until then.
- Status