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Newbie2
Guest
Raises animals “organically”? Meaning what?
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That_one_guy
Guest
Main Entry:
1or·gan·ic Listen to the pronunciation of 1organic
Pronunciation:
\ȯr-ˈga-nik\
Function:
adjective
Date:
1517
1archaic : instrumental2 a: of, relating to, or arising in a bodily organ b: affecting the structure of the organism3 a (1): of, relating to, or derived from living organisms (2): of, relating to, yielding, or involving the use of food produced with the use of feed or fertilizer of plant or animal origin without employment of chemically formulated fertilizers, growth stimulants, antibiotics, or pesticides b (1): of, relating to, or containing carbon compounds (2): relating to, being, or dealt with by a branch of chemistry concerned with the carbon compounds of living beings and most other carbon compounds
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That_one_guy
Guest
Top 10 Pet Poisons of 2008
To help you prevent an unhappy accident in 2009, our experts have created a list of the top 10 poisons that affected our pets last year. Here’s a sneak peek at their advice:
aspca.org/site/PageServer?pagename=media_newsalert010209#1
To help you prevent an unhappy accident in 2009, our experts have created a list of the top 10 poisons that affected our pets last year. Here’s a sneak peek at their advice:
aspca.org/site/PageServer?pagename=media_newsalert010209#1
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mackbrislawn
Guest
On the ranch, we did not raise our cattle organically. Just as we do not raise our own chilren organically, we did not raise our cattle organically. The calves are always vaccinated against various diseases, and later on the heifers get vaccinated against brucellosis. And, medicines may have to be given if a cow gets sick.
But I don’t know, do vaccines and medications count or not torwards organic?
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That_one_guy
Guest
Vaccines and medications are not designed to artificially stimulate growth or the production of milk.Steriods and growth hormones are intended to artificially stimulate growth and milk production,etc.
So,no,vaccines and medicines don’t really count as UNorganic.
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Newbie2
Guest
So which is it? Antibiotics are “medicines”.
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That_one_guy
Guest
Antibiotics are not therapeutics,…unless used for a curative,…so You got me on
that one.So,I’m gonna do research.
(shucks-I might be wrong:blush: )
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cathybramble
Guest
this is a guideline for the UK, but i’m guessing that it’s not too different in the US
“Organic farmers are encouraged to use homoeopathy (under veterinary guidance) and the cultural or management control of diseases. The routine or preventive use of some veterinary products is prohibited. However if an animal needs to be treated with conventional treatments to prevent it from suffering, then the Soil Association’s rules state that these treatments must be used.”
soilassociation.org/Web/SA/SAWeb.nsf/848d689047cb466780256a6b00298980/cae68a6d579c7ffc80256df60040a7e0!OpenDocument
the distinction is that factory farming relies on antibiotics as a prophylaxis (to prevent the animals from getting sick due to the poor care and unsanitary conditions in which they are kept).
most people are probably unaware that 70% of all antibiotic use in the US are on factory farms. this has been directly linked to the generation of antibiotic resistant bacterial infections in humans. the FDA had issued a restriction on the use of human antibiotics in this manner but an article i read in the wall street journal says that these farmers appealed this decision because they claim their businesses will fail unless they can use the antibiotics in this way.
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That_one_guy
Guest
Well.There it is.
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JReducation
Guest
If one wants to know the proper Catholic attitude toward creature, an excellent mediation is St. Francis’ Canticle of the Sun.
**Most high, omnipotent, good Lord,
Praise, glory and honor and benediction all, are Thine.
To Thee alone do they belong, most High,
And there is no man fit to mention Thee.
Praise be to Thee, my Lord, with all Thy creatures,
Especially to my worshipful brother sun,
The which lights up the day, and through him dost Thou brightness give;
And beautiful is he and radiant with splendor great;
Of Thee, most High, signification gives.
Praised be my Lord, for sister moon and for the stars,
In heaven Thou hast formed them clear and precious and fair. p. 153
Praised be my Lord for brother wind
And for the air and clouds and fair and every kind of weather,
By the which Thou givest to Thy creatures nourishment.
Praised be my Lord for sister water,
The which is greatly helpful and humble and precious and pure.
Praised be my Lord for brother fire,
By the which Thou lightest up the dark.
And fair is he and gay and mighty and strong.
Praised be my Lord for our sister, mother earth,
The which sustains and keeps us
And brings forth diverse fruits with grass and flowers bright.
Praised be my Lord for those who for Thy love forgive
And weakness bear and tribulation.
Blessed those who shall in peace endure,
For by Thee, most High, shall they be crowned.
Praised be my Lord for our sister, the bodily death,
From the which no living man can flee.
Woe to them who die in mortal sin;
Blessed those who shall find themselves in Thy most holy will,
For the second death shall do them no ill.
Praise ye and bless ye my Lord, and give Him thanks,
And be subject unto Him with great humility.**
sacred-texts.com/chr/wosf/wosf22.htm
Fraternally,
JR
**Most high, omnipotent, good Lord,
Praise, glory and honor and benediction all, are Thine.
To Thee alone do they belong, most High,
And there is no man fit to mention Thee.
Praise be to Thee, my Lord, with all Thy creatures,
Especially to my worshipful brother sun,
The which lights up the day, and through him dost Thou brightness give;
And beautiful is he and radiant with splendor great;
Of Thee, most High, signification gives.
Praised be my Lord, for sister moon and for the stars,
In heaven Thou hast formed them clear and precious and fair. p. 153
Praised be my Lord for brother wind
And for the air and clouds and fair and every kind of weather,
By the which Thou givest to Thy creatures nourishment.
Praised be my Lord for sister water,
The which is greatly helpful and humble and precious and pure.
Praised be my Lord for brother fire,
By the which Thou lightest up the dark.
And fair is he and gay and mighty and strong.
Praised be my Lord for our sister, mother earth,
The which sustains and keeps us
And brings forth diverse fruits with grass and flowers bright.
Praised be my Lord for those who for Thy love forgive
And weakness bear and tribulation.
Blessed those who shall in peace endure,
For by Thee, most High, shall they be crowned.
Praised be my Lord for our sister, the bodily death,
From the which no living man can flee.
Woe to them who die in mortal sin;
Blessed those who shall find themselves in Thy most holy will,
For the second death shall do them no ill.
Praise ye and bless ye my Lord, and give Him thanks,
And be subject unto Him with great humility.**
sacred-texts.com/chr/wosf/wosf22.htm
Fraternally,
JR
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That_one_guy
Guest
OH YES!!!This was what I posted in my VegHaven.org blog profile for my new years prayer!If one wants to know the proper Catholic attitude toward creature, an excellent mediation is St. Francis’ Canticle of the Sun.
**Most high, omnipotent, good Lord,
Praise, glory and honor and benediction all, are Thine.
To Thee alone do they belong, most High,
And there is no man fit to mention Thee.
Praise be to Thee, my Lord, with all Thy creatures,
Especially to my worshipful brother sun,
The which lights up the day, and through him dost Thou brightness give;
And beautiful is he and radiant with splendor great;
Of Thee, most High, signification gives.
Praised be my Lord, for sister moon and for the stars,
In heaven Thou hast formed them clear and precious and fair. p. 153
Praised be my Lord for brother wind
And for the air and clouds and fair and every kind of weather,
By the which Thou givest to Thy creatures nourishment.
Praised be my Lord for sister water,
The which is greatly helpful and humble and precious and pure.
Praised be my Lord for brother fire,
By the which Thou lightest up the dark.
And fair is he and gay and mighty and strong.
Praised be my Lord for our sister, mother earth,
The which sustains and keeps us
And brings forth diverse fruits with grass and flowers bright.
Praised be my Lord for those who for Thy love forgive
And weakness bear and tribulation.
Blessed those who shall in peace endure,
For by Thee, most High, shall they be crowned.
Praised be my Lord for our sister, the bodily death,
From the which no living man can flee.
Woe to them who die in mortal sin;
Blessed those who shall find themselves in Thy most holy will,
For the second death shall do them no ill.
Praise ye and bless ye my Lord, and give Him thanks,
And be subject unto Him with great humility.**
sacred-texts.com/chr/wosf/wosf22.htm
Fraternally,
JR
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JReducation
Guest
I saw that. Our holy father Francis had a mystical sense of creation. He saw all of creation existing within God. In one of his reflections he tells Brother Leo that God explodes with love and out of that explosion he gradually creates every living being.
It’s rather interesting, because Francis has no idea what the Big Bang theory was. However, it was a son of his, a Franciscan Friar who first proposed it.
Maximilian Kolbe, who was a mathematician, physicist and theologian, subscribed to the idea that all creation flows from God’s explosive love.
Therefore, all creatures are to be loved and treated with respect and kindness. They are to be used as was inteded by the Creator and never to be abused.
JR
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cathybramble
Guest
i think therein lies the difficulty… there are different definitions of “cruelty” for farmed animals than for pets.I saw that. Our holy father Francis had a mystical sense of creation. He saw all of creation existing within God. In one of his reflections he tells Brother Leo that God explodes with love and out of that explosion he gradually creates every living being.
It’s rather interesting, because Francis has no idea what the Big Bang theory was. However, it was a son of his, a Franciscan Friar who first proposed it.
Maximilian Kolbe, who was a mathematician, physicist and theologian, subscribed to the idea that all creation flows from God’s explosive love.
Therefore, all creatures are to be loved and treated with respect and kindness. They are to be used as was inteded by the Creator and never to be abused.
JR
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JReducation
Guest
Any treatment that causes an animal unnecessary suffering is considered cruelty in Catholic spirituality, so is abandonment and neglect of their health hygene and other physical needs.i think therein lies the difficulty… there are different definitions of “cruelty” for farmed animals than for pets.
The Church is very clear that all of creation has to be treated with respect and justice. Justice demands that we give living creatures what they need to live healthy and productive lives.
JR
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cathybramble
Guest
i knowAny treatment that causes an animal unnecessary suffering is considered cruelty in Catholic spirituality, so is abandonment and neglect of their health hygene and other physical needs.
The Church is very clear that all of creation has to be treated with respect and justice. Justice demands that we give living creatures what they need to live healthy and productive lives.
JR
we had a discussion wherein someone asserted that animals do not suffer.even among friends there is a wide definition of “unnecessary” suffering - many people feel that it is necessary to raise livestock in intensive confinement and filth because “people need to eat.”
the church seems a little vague on this issue actually.
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JReducation
Guest
I don’t think that the Church intends to be deliberately vague. I think she assumes that most intelligent people will be able to define just and kind treatment for themselves.i know
even among friends there is a wide definition of “unnecessary” suffering - many people feel that it is necessary to raise livestock in intensive confinement and filth because “people need to eat.”
the church seems a little vague on this issue actually.
Also, the Church does have one concern. She is concerned that human beings are so focussed on saving the planet and every plant and animal on the planet, but we’re ignoring saving ourselves.
The only reason to save the planet is for man. Man remains the crowning being in creation. We don’t want to save the planet to go on without man. That would make no sense.
Do we have to eat? Yes. Do we have to be cruel to the animals that we raise for food? No. Today we have the means to do better.
Should we only be concerned about animal welfare and ignore the welfare of human beings. No. That would be a disordered set of priorities.
That’s where the Church wants to enter the picture. She wants to help man order his priorities according to the plan of the Creator. Even St. Francis who saw every living thing as a sign of God’s presence had an ordered system of priorities. The poor always came first. But he treated every creature with respect and kindness. This is the direction in which we must move.
Fraternally,
JR
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cathybramble
Guest
it’s a false dichotomy to say that we either care about the planet and animals OR humans. we can care about all of it at the same time, in fact… all of creation is connected - we can’t harm nature without harming ourselves.I don’t think that the Church intends to be deliberately vague. I think she assumes that most intelligent people will be able to define just and kind treatment for themselves.
Also, the Church does have one concern. She is concerned that human beings are so focussed on saving the planet and every plant and animal on the planet, but we’re ignoring saving ourselves.
The only reason to save the planet is for man. Man remains the crowning being in creation. We don’t want to save the planet to go on without man. That would make no sense.
Do we have to eat? Yes. Do we have to be cruel to the animals that we raise for food? No. Today we have the means to do better.
Should we only be concerned about animal welfare and ignore the welfare of human beings. No. That would be a disordered set of priorities.
That’s where the Church wants to enter the picture. She wants to help man order his priorities according to the plan of the Creator. Even St. Francis who saw every living thing as a sign of God’s presence had an ordered system of priorities. The poor always came first. But he treated every creature with respect and kindness. This is the direction in which we must move.
Fraternally,
JR
news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090103/ap_on_re_af/af_killer_batteries
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cathybramble
Guest
not to be quarrelsome, but do we have to eat? yes. do we have to eat meat 3x a day every day? heavens no. cruelty to animals by farming them in such horrific conditions is coming from a disordered desire for meat, eggs, and dairy. humankind is directly responsible for the suffering of billions of animals a year out of sheer gluttony. the Church says nothing about this even though it is clearly wrong.
(and don’t misunderstand - i do believe that all truth and beauty are in the Church … it’s just that she is not telling people what needs to be said when it comes to this issue).
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JReducation
Guest
Have you ever thought that the Church may have said quite a bit and you are not aware of it? If we look at the lives of the saints and the Church’s current teaching on the environment and her concern for the environment, it says tons about our moral behavior in relationship to other creatures, not just animals either.
Just some food for thought.
Fraternally,
JR
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JReducation
Guest
The Church agrees with you, that it is a false dichotomy. But some people propose such a dichotomy. For example, you have many animal rights activists that are also very pro abortion. That’s a dichotomy.
We have environmentalists who want to protect a particular green area, but are not concerned with creating healthy and appropriate housing for the poor. If you can build housing for the poor without taking down a green area, that’s the way to go. But if you have no other place to build, then the trees have to go to make room for low cost housing for poor or elderly people.
These are the dichotomies that morality says cannot happen. Ecology has to include a Human Ecology too. One writer whom I would strongly recommend is an old mentor of mine who is now deceased, Urie Bronfenbrenner. He wrote the first great work on Human Ecology. OK, I’m biased. I thought it was great.
Fraternally,
JR
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