Animal suffering

[Angelsflight]

I can’t speak for those who raise hogs or sheep or poultry. But I have some idea what I’m talking about when I talk about beef. Most ranchers I know actually do have some attachment to their animals. But it can only go so far. Animals aren’t people in any way, and lines have to be drawn in terms of attachments and sentimentality.

Cool, I am glad to hear that there are good ranchers out there.

Don’t get me wrong guys…i am really not trying to be argumentative. I just have a strange empathy when it comes to animals.

 

[10gr8kids]

HUH? You lost me…

A lot may depend on what animals you consider worthy enough to worry about.

If crops were not sprayed with insecticides there would not be enough crops to feed everyone. You may not think killing grasshoppers is much to worry about though.
Maybe you just worry about the feathery or fuzzy ones. Even then, geese, deer, groundhogs, coons, and many other animals have to be controlled or they can and do destroy numerous acres of crops. When they become a problem game and fish will increase bag limits on these animals and add additional days to the hunting seasons.

You have to remember that just because our civilization makes it easy for you to get to your grocer and buy what you need, there are still a very few farmers struggling with nature to provide food for the world. One farmer in the US provides food and fiber for 155 people in the US and abroad. In 1940 1 farmer fed just 19 people.

 

[Angelsflight]

A lot may depend on what animals you consider worthy enough to worry about.

If crops were not sprayed with insecticides there would not be enough crops to feed everyone. You may not think killing grasshoppers is much to worry about though.
Maybe you just worry about the feathery or fuzzy ones. Even then, geese, deer, groundhogs, coons, and many other animals have to be controlled or they can and do destroy numerous acres of crops. When they become a problem game and fish will increase bag limits on these animals and add additional days to the hunting seasons.

You have to remember that just because our civilization makes it easy for you to get to your grocer and buy what you need, there are still a very few farmers struggling with nature to provide food for the world. One farmer in the US provides food and fiber for 155 people in the US and abroad. In 1940 1 farmer fed just 19 people.

Nah…I care about all the animals…even grasshoppers.
Well, the only thing I dont care much for …is cockroaches.
Oh, and praying mantises are kinda freaky!

 

[10gr8kids]

Nah…I care about all the animals…even grasshoppers.
Well, the only thing I dont care much for …is cockroaches.
Oh, and praying mantises are kinda freaky!

I’m glad, I do too. My husband told me last night that I talk tough, but am really just a big softy. Lol. It is true I love animals, and hate to see any suffer **needlessly. ** But I have more compassion on the children of this world. Many more of whom would die needlessly of hunger if the farmers were not doing the hard jobs that need to be done.

Whether you eat meat or not does not matter and I respect you for the regard and love you have for animals. Just please think twice before you condemn farmers for the things that need to be done to provide nourishment for all. And remember whether you are a vegetarian or an omnivore some animals will need to suffer to feed you.

We are in a fallen world, so it will be this way until Jesus returns.

 

[Angelsflight]

I’m glad, I do too. My husband told me last night that I talk tough, but am really just a big softy. Lol. It is true I love animals, and hate to see any suffer **needlessly. **But I have more compassion on the children of this world. Many more of whom would die needlessly of hunger if the farmers were not doing the hard jobs that need to be done.

Whether you eat meat or not does not matter and I respect you for the regard and love you have for animals. Just please think twice before you condemn farmers for the things that need to be done to provide nourishment for all. And remember whether you are a vegetarian or an omnivore some animals will need to suffer to feed you.

We are in a fallen world, so it will be this way until Jesus returns.

I wish he would come soon.

 

[10gr8kids]

Actually, when I posted above that I hate to see animals suffer needlessly, that is not quite true. I hate to see them suffer anytime, just sometimes I realize it’s necessary.

I wish He would come soon too. Won’t it be great, no more suffering for anyone or anything. At least not for those who are ready. I’ll pray that we both are.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Oh, and praying mantises are kinda freaky!

They’re odd looking, but they eat harmful insects. Some farmers broadcast mantis eggs on their crops so the mantises will eat the insects that harm the crops. Same thing with ladybird beetles. (“ladybugs”).

 

[severus68]

Just a reminder, the thread is called “Animal Suffering” . Whether we are supposed to eat meat or not is really not the point. We can argue it until the cows come home. lol. (couldn’t resist!)

Anyway, eat meat or not. Whatever. My only problem is how animals are treated while they wait for slaughter. They are keeping you alive with the food they give, after all. Don’t they deserve to be treated humanely also for the time that they are alive? I firmly believe that just because an animal is not equal to humans doesnt give us the right to treat it poorly.

We are not equal to God. How would we like it if he treated us poorly, just because?

Good point,

 

[severus68]

Nah…I care about all the animals…even grasshoppers.
Well, the only thing I dont care much for …is cockroaches.
Oh, and praying mantises are kinda freaky!

Cockroaches? They target me. I can sense one nearby and they always fly towards me. I have a phobia about them especially those big, flying ones but I would still not want them to suffer. Those man eating sharks and crocodiles, - that is still another story.

 

[Angelsflight]

Cockroaches? They target me. I can sense one nearby and they always fly towards me. I have a phobia about them especially those big, flying ones but I would still not want them to suffer. Those man eating sharks and crocodiles, - that is still another story.

I lived in Hawaii for a time where they have those giant black cockroaches that always flew right at you…eek! And cane spiders! Double eek!

And as for animals that kill humans…people definitely have a right to protect themselves. One story that always got to me was the one about Travis, the chimp that attacked that woman. And its owner had to stab the chimp in the back a few times to try to stop it. Poor lady. Her face was so mutilated by that monkey.

One time, when I was about 16 years old in Hawaii, there was this place that had a cage of monkeys. (I wont even call it a zoo, because it would be a pathetic zoo, with just some monkeys in a cage–gibbon monkeys i think)

Anyway, the mother monkey was always swinging around the cage with her babies on her back. I always went to watch them, as monkeys are my favorite animal in the whole world. One day, she put her hand out to me, wanting food probably. And the guard fence was not far back, if I reached my hand out to her I could reach her. So i did once…bravely and stupidly. It was awesome. I stood there an held hands with that monkey for a good 10 minutes. Looking back…I am lucky to have my arm still in its socket…the silly things we do when we are kids, huh?

 

[jkraso]

Not sure about exactly how to say this, but I will give it a try. It is wrong to mistreat animals and it is wrong to mistreat people. It is also wrong to compare animals to people, people are created in God’s image. God gave mankind the animals to rule over. We should rule with respect. On the same hand as a Catholic, when we go to communion, we receive the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ our lord under the appearance of bread and wine. We do not receive a vegan wafer but the flesh of Christ.
Now I am a hunter and I hunt for meat. I usually get a kill with one shot, but over the years I have had to track a wounded animal a couple of times and I know it hurts them. But if you have ever seen animals in the wild take each other out, hunting is a lot more humane than being eaten alive. Controlled breeding and harvesting are generally better for the animals than the alternatives. Ranching and farming are noble occupations, spend some time on a family farm and get back to me on how cruel it is. Feed lots and slaughter houses are a whole other world and issue, and the ones I have seen are not all that bad.

 

[mbrislawn]

Is it wrong, on the Catholic view, to torture animals unnecessarily? If so, why doesn’t the Catholic Church advocate the eradication of factory farming, where billions upon billions of animals are slaughtered every year and are forced to reside in horrible conditions?

I highly recommend this paper by Stuart Rachels: jamesrachels.org/stuart/veg.pdf

Abstract: Over the last fifty years, traditional farming has been replaced by industrial farming. Unlike traditional farming, industrial farming is abhorrently cruel to animals, environmentally destructive, awful for rural America, and wretched for human health. In this essay, I document those facts, explain why the industrial system has become dominant, and argue that we should boycott industrially produced meat. Also, I argue that we should not even kill animals humanely for food, given our uncertainty about which creatures possess a right to life. In practice, then, we should be vegetarians. To underscore the importance of these issues, I use statistics to show that industrial farming has caused more pain and suffering than the Holocaust.

If God had not driven us out of the Garden of Eden there would be no suffering.

 

[mbrislawn]

So it’s cruel to keep an animal in a cage, but we do the same thing to humans. We put them in cages in jail.

 

[Angelsflight]

So it’s cruel to keep an animal in a cage, but we do the same thing to humans. We put them in cages in jail.

Yeah, I have mixed feelings about cages…I guess most animals are pretty well protected in cages at zoos…they are probably a lot safer there than in the wild.

One thing that I had a hard time doing was keeping a bird in a cage. When I had parakeets I had a rather large cage for them to sleep in at night…during the day I would open the cage, put a little playground thing on top of the cage for them to play on…and they could fly around the room if they wanted to.