Annullments

[mom1church]

I have a friend who was raised Lutheran and is trying to convert to Catholicism. The problem is she was married to a Catholic before and divorced, now remarried to a Catholic but was never married in a Catholic Church. She filled out papers for an anullment but was denied, saying they never tried counseling. I was there at the time and her first husband was abusive and an alcoholic and wouldn’t even talk about counseling. Her second husband who she wants to get remarried in a Catholic Church, one that her daugter attends and they joined. She asked me to be her spiritual guide and I don’t understand the annullment process to try to explain it(I’m a Catholic). I know they contacted her first husband and he didn’t respond. He even signed away his parental rights to his son, so that my friend’s second husband could adopt him. Could you give me some insight as to what it takes to be granted an annullment? Thank-you, Jill

 

[puzzleannie]

I have a friend who was raised Lutheran and is trying to convert to Catholicism. The problem is she was married to a Catholic before and divorced, now remarried to a Catholic but was never married in a Catholic Church. She filled out papers for an anullment but was denied, saying they never tried counseling. I

the annulment would not be denied for that reason, as it does not deal with issues that developed after the marriage, or reasons for the divorce, except insofar as they shed light on conditions that existed at the time of the marriage.

there are simply too many unanswered questions and too many variables, and no earthly use to try to explore the ins and outs of an individual case on this forum–for one thing the key issue is was the first marriage according to the laws of the Catholic Church, since one of the parties was Catholic. if not, the marriage is simply invalid due to lack of form and she merely has to supply the necessary paperwork.

she should work with the priest who is preparing her for full communion with the Catholic Church and give him all the facts about former and current marriages, and let him guide her. Your help cannot be anything but limited, because you cannot know indetail what the tribunal needs to know to do its investigation. There is nothing to prevent her from requesting annulment again in another diocese.

your help can be supportive and in general what an RCIA sponsor does. you can refer her to the liturgy and sacraments forum, esp. the many annulment threads, with very good links, and descriptions of what are “real” grounds for annulment

 

[macroom2]

Since the first husband of your friend was a Catholic, and she married him outside the Catholic Church, it would seem that that marriage could be annulled. In normal circumstances a Catholic is obliged to marry a Catholic or a non-Catholic in the Catholic Church.

The rules are different for two baptized non-Catholics. If they have the right understanding of marriage and they have the right intentions and if the right words are used at the ceremony, their marriage is most likely a valid sacramental marriage and cannot be annulled.

I hope that helps a little.

 

[SFD]

puzzleannie:

the annulment would not be denied for that reason, as it does not deal with issues that developed after the marriage, or reasons for the divorce, except insofar as they shed light on conditions that existed at the time of the marriage.

Except this is not how annulments work in the conciliar church. The basis for most annulments is the all-encompassing “psychological reasons”, in canon1095, I believe.

Annulments today are a joke and they are rightly called by many, “catholic divorce”.

SFD

 

[puzzleannie]

Except this is not how annulments work in the conciliar church. The basis for most annulments is the all-encompassing “psychological reasons”, in canon1095, I believe.

Annulments today are a joke and they are rightly called by many, “catholic divorce”.

SFD

OPs complaint is about the difficulty of getting an annulment, not about the ease with which they are granted as you claim. if you want to join a thread on that topic, there are plenty on the sacraments forum. this is not that topic. and yes, in post-conciliar Church there are grounds for annulment and they depend on circumstances that pertained at the time of the contract, not those that that developed after the wedding.

 

[puzzleannie]

Since the first husband of your friend was a Catholic, and she married him outside the Catholic Church, it would seem that that marriage could be .

OP did not state that. OP can’t really help in this instance, it is up the the person who is party to the marriage to see the priest and initiate the process.

 

[macroom2]

OP wrote: “The problem is she was married to a Catholic before and divorced, now remarried to a Catholic but was never married in a Catholic Church.” The word “never” indicates the woman’s first marriage to a Catholic was not in a Catholic Church.

I stand by my response in #3 until OP states that the first marriage was in a Catholic Church.l

 

[SFD]

OPs complaint is about the difficulty of getting an annulment, not about the ease with which they are granted as you claim. if you want to join a thread on that topic, there are plenty on the sacraments forum. this is not that topic. and yes, in post-conciliar Church there are grounds for annulment and they depend on circumstances that pertained at the time of the contract, not those that that developed after the wedding.

But that’s not what is done, typically. The numbers need explanation, as they are significant and orders of magitude larger that just 40 years ago. I know of Catholics who got divorced, paid the $500.00 and got remarried in the church. They were basically told what their “impediment” was…and they really don’t believe it was an impediment…but they got what they wanted…to get remarried.

SFD

 

[SFD]

I have a friend who was raised Lutheran and is trying to convert to Catholicism. The problem is she was married to a Catholic before and divorced, now remarried to a Catholic but was never married in a Catholic Church. She filled out papers for an anullment but was denied, saying they never tried counseling. I was there at the time and her first husband was abusive and an alcoholic and wouldn’t even talk about counseling. Her second husband who she wants to get remarried in a Catholic Church, one that her daugter attends and they joined. She asked me to be her spiritual guide and I don’t understand the annullment process to try to explain it(I’m a Catholic). I know they contacted her first husband and he didn’t respond. He even signed away his parental rights to his son, so that my friend’s second husband could adopt him. Could you give me some insight as to what it takes to be granted an annullment? Thank-you, Jill

There are not enough facts here for anyone to comment on this specific case…nor should anyone discuss anything but the principles here.

SFD